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Archive 2012 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III

  
 
Lars Johnsson
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p.3 #1 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


thinkpadfans wrote:
I was surprised too. Certainly you lose F2 and faster apertures, but I find the weight and sharpness of the 40mm more important.


So why did you start this thread "50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III" then

If you already know that you like the 40mm better and weight is important



Jul 29, 2012 at 01:56 AM
rabbitmountain
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p.3 #2 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


Lars,
Like I said, with my 5Dc+35L I get over 80% in focus, so nothing wrong there. With my other lenses (70-200mkII, 16-35, etc.) the same. The 50L is a different story. Your 3 bodies are 1-series. That helps significantly with the 50L.



Jul 29, 2012 at 01:58 AM
Yakim Peled
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p.3 #3 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


thinkpadfans wrote:
I was surprised too. Certainly you lose F2 and faster apertures, but I find the weight and sharpness of the 40mm more important.


Well, I haven't tried the 40/2.8 but as a past owner of both 35L and 50L (loved the first, hated the second) I'm sure I could never give up the faster aperture and superior AF and BQ of the 35L. As I see it, f/2.8 is just too slowwww for a prime in these FLs.

YMMV of course.

Happy shooting,
Yakim.



Jul 29, 2012 at 02:58 AM
Lars Johnsson
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p.3 #4 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


rabbitmountain wrote:
Lars,
Like I said, with my 5Dc+35L I get over 80% in focus, so nothing wrong there. With my other lenses (70-200mkII, 16-35, etc.) the same. The 50L is a different story. Your 3 bodies are 1-series. That helps significantly with the 50L.


I did owned the 5D before also. And 1 series bodies doesn't help the 50L more than it helps the 35L or any other fast lens



Jul 29, 2012 at 03:01 AM
PhilDrinkwater
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p.3 #5 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


Rickuz wrote:
I have used both. Now i only have the 35L. It is a great lens that no one will regret buying - a versatile, workhorse that is tack sharp on all apertures, even wide open.

The 50L is a "mixed feelings lens". It has problems with focus shift, and compared to other L primes, it is not sharp enough wide open. You can get great shots with the 50L, but it just doesn't happen very often. In my experience it is very hard to nail the focus with it.

Get 35L now and 85L II later.


The 35L is my least used lens - only when I really need it since I don't have space for the 50. The 50L takes 40% of my photos.

Horses for courses.

Op: the simple answer is do you need 50mm or 35mm more? It's not like comparing the 50 1.2 with the 1.4. These are completely different lenses and like asking if you should buy cheese or cereal - ie the wrong question to be asking and one which fundamentally doesn't make sense.

Make a decision which you need - 35 or 50mm - and buy the right one to suit your needs.

Edited on Jul 29, 2012 at 03:22 AM · View previous versions



Jul 29, 2012 at 03:02 AM
rabbitmountain
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p.3 #6 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


Lars Johnsson wrote:
I did owned the 5D before also. And 1 series bodies doesn't help the 50L more than it helps the 35L or any other fast lens

In an other thread I started, where I consider a 1DsII exactly to help focus a 50L, Michael doesn't agree with your statement. Here is the link to that thread:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1135461/0#10839740

I wonder why that is, because I've seen some other FM'ers say the same. The vast majority, however, agree that the 5D mkI and mkII don't go well with the 50L. I've read about all there is on the 50L here on FM until 6 years back and many new 5DmkIII owners say they were about to sell their 50L until they started shooting it with their 5D3.
I don't own the 50L, but I've tested it (about 200 images) inside a camera store and I compared it 5 minutes later with a 5DmkIII. On my 5Dc, 20% of shots were in focus. On the 5D3 (same time, same subjects, same settings) 80% or more were in perfect focus.

So why do some still maintain that the 50L is good to focus on 5D / 5D2 bodies? I would really like to know!



Jul 29, 2012 at 03:18 AM
zino
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p.3 #7 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


for me 50mm is better for portrait.


Jul 29, 2012 at 06:42 AM
Lars Johnsson
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p.3 #8 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


rabbitmountain wrote:
In an other thread I started, where I consider a 1DsII exactly to help focus a 50L, Michael doesn't agree with your statement. Here is the link to that thread:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1135461/0#10839740

I wonder why that is, because I've seen some other FM'ers say the same. The vast majority, however, agree that the 5D mkI and mkII don't go well with the 50L. I've read about all there is on the 50L here on FM until 6 years back and many new 5DmkIII owners say they were about to sell their 50L until they started shooting it with their 5D3.
I don't own the
...Show more

Maybe some people are not used to work with very fast f/1,2 lenses with very small DOF. Often they have never used such a fast lens before. Others maybe don't know or understand about the focus shift at close distance. Others just recompose for portrait as they did with their f/2,8 lenses before. There can be a lot of reasons.......

Of course a 1 series body with better AF will help you. But it will help other lenses like the 24L,35L, 85L also. It's not like it only help the AF with the 50L. It's not like the 1DsII has some magic AF that works especially good with the 50L and not with other lenses



Jul 29, 2012 at 07:04 AM
Velu01
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p.3 #9 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


I own and love the 35mm lens and use it wide open quiet often.

Regarding the 50L, I never did use one but I wonder why the majority of comments are so negative regarding focusing !?
I do own a 85LII so I am aware of the pitfalls using f1.2 but one should almost believe that the 50L just isn't fabricated/calibrated well !??



Jul 29, 2012 at 08:00 AM
Yakim Peled
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p.3 #10 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


Velu01 wrote:
I own and love the 35mm lens and use it wide open quiet often.

Regarding the 50L, I never did use one but I wonder why the majority of comments are so negative regarding focusing !?
I do own a 85LII so I am aware of the pitfalls using f1.2 but one should almost believe that the 50L just isn't fabricated/calibrated well !??


Search. There are many posts about the 50/1.2. It is one of the most controversial lenses, alongside the 24-70/2.8.

Happy shooting,
Yakim.



Jul 29, 2012 at 09:10 AM
rabbitmountain
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p.3 #11 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


Lars Johnsson wrote:
Maybe some people are not used to work with very fast f/1,2 lenses with very small DOF. Often they have never used such a fast lens before. Others maybe don't know or understand about the focus shift at close distance. Others just recompose for portrait as they did with their f/2,8 lenses before. There can be a lot of reasons.......


I agree with most of this Lars. I am quite used to shooting f/1.4 with my 35L, but it's more wide-angle so it's more forgiving.
The way I tested the 50L, however, rules out focus shift (I shot @ f/1.2 all the time) and recompose error (I didn't recompose). I did the following:
- I was in a camera store, it was inside, only tungsten lighting (no windows)
- First I tested the 5Dclassic + 50L combo using a Lens Align unit, camera on a tripod. I shot f/1.2-1.4-1.6-1.8-2.0-2.2-2.5-2.8-3.2-3.5-4.0 and the focus shift was quite apparent.
- By coincidence, the combo was tack sharp on the LensAlign.
- Then I tested to mimic shooting an indoor wedding ceremony @f/1.2:
- Camera set to focus with exposure button (no back button focus)
- f/1.2
- shutter speed 1/250 or faster (I have a steady hand)
- fired 200 frames at various subjects: shelves with photographic equipment, desk clercs, cameras, studio lights, etc.
- range varying from 1.5m~5m
- No focus/recompose, just focus and quickly release shutter, to prevent distance shift by me or by the subject
- 20% shots perfectly in focus, 10% barely in focus, 70% unuseable
Repeated the same steps with 5DmkIII.
- I needed -8 MA to get it sharp on the Lens Align
- 80% shots perfectly in focus, 10% barely in focus, 10% OOF, but useable at 4x6

So based upon my own testing, the AF problem with the 5Dclassic/50L is real.

Just to be sure I took my 5Dclassic + 35L and repeated the same test for about 50frames, mostly of the same subjects. Shot @f/1.4 only, got 90% perfectly focused shots, 10% slightly OOF.

Of course a 1 series body with better AF will help you. But it will help other lenses like the 24L,35L, 85L also. It's not like it only help the AF with the 50L. It's not like the 1DsII has some magic AF that works especially good with the 50L and not with other lenses
My 35L is as good as it gets, but of course any lens will benefit from better AF. I don't know what it is with the 50L, but what about this:

I would be willing to get a 1DsII solely for being able to shoot the 50L. There is no other reason I would need one, because my 5Dclassic works magic with all of my lenses. This may sound irrational, but I know a 5DmkIII will be excellent with the 50L, and so may the 1DsII.



Jul 29, 2012 at 09:19 AM
Sneakyracer
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p.3 #12 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


The 35L is a much better lens mechanically and optically. Its good at f1.4 where the 50 is unusable. But, if you like amd want the 50mm focal length then its a moot point.


Jul 29, 2012 at 12:28 PM
Lars Johnsson
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p.3 #13 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


Sneakyracer wrote:
The 35L is a much better lens mechanically and optically. Its good at f1.4 where the 50 is unusable. But, if you like amd want the 50mm focal length then its a moot point.


What's better mechanically with the 35 ? Maybe it's unusable at f/1,4 when you are shooting. But it's very usable for hundreds of members here at FM



Jul 29, 2012 at 01:01 PM
Lars Johnsson
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p.3 #14 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


rabbitmountain wrote:
I agree with most of this Lars. I am quite used to shooting f/1.4 with my 35L, but it's more wide-angle so it's more forgiving.
The way I tested the 50L, however, rules out focus shift (I shot @ f/1.2 all the time) and recompose error (I didn't recompose). I did the following:
- I was in a camera store, it was inside, only tungsten lighting (no windows)
- First I tested the 5Dclassic + 50L combo using a Lens Align unit, camera on a tripod. I shot f/1.2-1.4-1.6-1.8-2.0-2.2-2.5-2.8-3.2-3.5-4.0 and the focus shift was quite apparent.
- By coincidence, the combo was tack
...Show more

I have got a lot higher percent of good focusing shots with every body including my old 5D than yours 20%. (IMO) it's rather obvious that your 50L need some adjustment. You got 20% good shots with the 5D. And then 80% with the 5D2 after doing MA with the lens. If you could do MA with the 5D you would have got about the same result for both bodies. Instead Canon must adjust/calibrate the lens when you can't do it in your camera



Jul 29, 2012 at 01:08 PM
stanj
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p.3 #15 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


Sneakyracer wrote:
The 35L is a much better lens mechanically and optically. Its good at f1.4 where the 50 is unusable. But, if you like amd want the 50mm focal length then its a moot point.

Lars Johnsson wrote:
What's better mechanically with the 35 ? Maybe it's unusable at f/1,4 when you are shooting. But it's very usable for hundreds of members here at FM


... and considered equally unusable by hundreds of other members. That's the nature of this beast: it's a love/hate relationship for most people. Whether the problems are real or purely imagined, this is the most polarizing lens in the Canon lineup and you can't do anything about people feeling very passionate about it one way or another.

Personally, whenever I see such violent arguments about a thing such as a lens, similar to the 1D3 AF thing (where some never had any issues and others were burning their cameras), it's an indication that indeed there _is_ an issue, just not everyone trips it due to their usage patterns or "quality standards". There's an undisputed difference in image rendering, and in love vs. hate, compared to its closest two cousins - 35L and 85L. Given that the "easiest of the three lenses" to build is so polarizing is a bit telling.

As for me, yes the 50L is unusable at f1.4 unless I'm desperate, which is why I shoot it at f2, which happens to be the area of maximum focus shift. But I am not beating the dead horse here.



Jul 29, 2012 at 01:19 PM
Lars Johnsson
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p.3 #16 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


stanj wrote:
... and considered equally unusable by hundreds of other members. That's the nature of this beast: it's a love/hate relationship for most people. Whether the problems are real or purely imagined, this is the most polarizing lens in the Canon lineup and you can't do anything about people feeling very passionate about it one way or another.

Personally, whenever I see such violent arguments about a thing such as a lens, similar to the 1D3 AF thing (where some never had any issues and others were burning their cameras), it's an indication that indeed there _is_ an issue, just not
...Show more

So why don't you sell it and buy another 50mm lens? There are many and you have been complaining about 100 times on this lens?



Jul 29, 2012 at 01:33 PM
Yakim Peled
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p.3 #17 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


stanj wrote:
... and considered equally unusable by hundreds of other members. That's the nature of this beast: it's a love/hate relationship for most people. Whether the problems are real or purely imagined, this is the most polarizing lens in the Canon lineup and you can't do anything about people feeling very passionate about it one way or another.

Personally, whenever I see such violent arguments about a thing such as a lens, similar to the 1D3 AF thing (where some never had any issues and others were burning their cameras), it's an indication that indeed there _is_ an issue, just not
...Show more

+1

Happy shooting,
Yakim.



Jul 29, 2012 at 02:10 PM
thinkpadfans
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p.3 #18 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


Lars Johnsson wrote:
So why did you start this thread "50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III" then

If you already know that you like the 40mm better and weight is important



I bought the 40mm just recently. I started the post earlier.



Jul 29, 2012 at 02:49 PM
thinkpadfans
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p.3 #19 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


Yakim Peled wrote:
Well, I haven't tried the 40/2.8 but as a past owner of both 35L and 50L (loved the first, hated the second) I'm sure I could never give up the faster aperture and superior AF and BQ of the 35L. As I see it, f/2.8 is just too slowwww for a prime in these FLs.

YMMV of course.

Happy shooting,
Yakim.



Yes you are right. I am just waiting on the 35L II to come out. for 50L, which I still have, I usually just shoot at F2. I think shooting at F1.2 and F1.4 is hard. For 35L. It just has too many small problems for me to keep it.



Jul 29, 2012 at 02:52 PM
rabbitmountain
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p.3 #20 · 50L or 35L on a 5D Mark III


Sneakyracer wrote:
The 35L is a much better lens mechanically and optically. Its good at f1.4 where the 50 is unusable. But, if you like amd want the 50mm focal length then its a moot point.

Jasmine Star, a top wedding photographer, shoots the 50L on FF @f1.2 all the time and makes beautiful wedding sets. You could google her or just follow this link:
http://www.jasminestarblog.com/index.cfm?postID=986&san-francisco-wedding-meg-tim
Most of those were shot with the 50L wide open.

So I think that proves that as long as you know what you're doing, and give it enough time to get used to this lens (which I intend to do), it is very usable wide open.



Jul 29, 2012 at 02:52 PM
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