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Archive 2012 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system
  
 
sebboh
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p.17 #1 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


wfrank wrote:
Odd that so many feel the urge to point out Canons faults. I wouldnt bother if I werent interested.


i whined about the new mirrorless releases from all the camera makers (except maybe the ep1 because it was the first camera that finally started moving in the right direction from my perspective), because i'm interested in getting a camera that fits my needs/desires and camera companies keep not producing it.

the new canon release looks promising as a future system except that they clearly did not leave room to ever allow a FF sensor. the 22mm lens is the perfect prime to start with (seriously sony wtf were you thinking?), too bad about the slow AF. the camera looks ok for p&s ugraders, but is a poor value compared to many of the competitors. i would definitely tell people to choose 4/3, NEX, or NX over it at the listed price point. i'm sure it will do well though if canon puts a fair bit of it's marketing muscle into it. hopefully it'll do well enough to convince them that a higher end model is worth making.



Jul 27, 2012 at 09:15 PM
sebboh
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p.17 #2 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


bluetsunami wrote:
Crazy how the G1X has more controls than this thing....

Would have been more excited if it was a interchangeable lens system in a G1X body, possibly without the useless viewfinder.

The more I look at it and read about it the more it feels like a tepid release. Its one thing to disregard the competition, another to disregard another product you've released.


the g1x is designed for serious photo people, eos-m is designed for p&s upgraders that don't really care about photography but want nice pictures without to much size increase. the g1x body repels these people because it's too big and looks extremely complicated.

i have to say i hate the g1x design and much prefer eos-m. the g1x is incredibly ugly and way more bulky than necessary imho.



Jul 27, 2012 at 09:19 PM
Imagemaster
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p.17 #3 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


bluetsunami wrote:
Crazy how the G1X has more controls than this thing.....


I'm pretty sure the G1X does not have a touch-screen with all the functions you can use with the touch of your finger.



Jul 27, 2012 at 09:22 PM
anscochrome
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p.17 #4 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


When you let the "it weighs too much" wussies of the world be the loud, squeaky wheel, this is what the marketing people give THEM, and ignore you, the silent "I can take any weight as long as I get IQ" users. I am still waiting for a reborn digital Kodak Medalist, with an actual 6x9 cm sensor in it.

(Tongue very firmly planted in cheek mode)



Jul 27, 2012 at 09:29 PM
wfrank
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p.17 #5 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


itai195 wrote:
Canon is the 800lb gorilla, like it or not. So of course anyone interested in cameras, and in mirrorless in particular, is going to be interested in seeing what Canon brings to the table regardless of whether or not they are actually interested in buying the product.


Oh no, Canon is a midget in this field, like it or not. What I see here is people that I believe would never touch anything with the Canon logo spewing out that "this will sell like flies drawn to cowshit". As if it were a worthless product or something. Super weird. But that just my personal opinion, I might be wrong.



Jul 27, 2012 at 09:51 PM
itai195
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p.17 #6 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


wfrank wrote:
Oh no, Canon is a midget in this field, like it or not. What I see here is people that I believe would never touch anything with the Canon logo spewing out that "this will sell like flies drawn to cowshit". As if it were a worthless product or something. Super weird. But that just my personal opinion, I might be wrong.


You're surprised that people who you think would never touch a Canon product find the EOS-M worthless? Perhaps these people would never touch a Canon product because Canon doesn't make any products they like?



Jul 27, 2012 at 10:34 PM
bluetsunami
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p.17 #7 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


Imagemaster wrote:
I'm pretty sure the G1X does not have a touch-screen with all the functions you can use with the touch of your finger.


I believe the NEX5N is able to do this and most photographers still prefer the feel of tactile buttons versus constantly looking at the screen to change basic settings. But I digress and understand that this is probably Canons 'entry level' Mirrorless.



Jul 27, 2012 at 11:31 PM
Imagemaster
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p.17 #8 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


bluetsunami wrote:
I believe the NEX5N is able to do this and most photographers still prefer the feel of tactile buttons versus constantly looking at the screen to change basic settings. But I digress and understand that this is probably Canons 'entry level' Mirrorless.


#1 - You were comparing to the G1X, not the NEX5N.
#2 - How many people to you think could care less about the feel of tactile buttons, e.g. iPad, iPhone, etc., etc. users?
#3 - Perhaps Canon would like to make a entry into camera categories where they are lacking.

From http://bcnranking.jp/news/1207/120724_23322.html:

In DSLR category:
1. Canon @ 59.8%
2. Nikon @ 28.8%

In MILC category:
1. Olympus @ 30.7%
2. Panasonic @ 29.6%

In compact camera category:
1. Canon @ 16.2%
2. Sony @ 15.4%



Jul 28, 2012 at 12:02 AM
bluetsunami
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p.17 #9 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


Imagemaster wrote:
#1 - You were comparing to the G1X, not the NEX5N.
#2 - How many people to you think could care less about the feel of tactile buttons, e.g. iPad, iPhone, etc., etc. users?
#3 - Perhaps Canon would like to make a entry into camera categories where they are lacking.

From http://bcnranking.jp/news/1207/120724_23322.html:

In DSLR category:
1. Canon @ 59.8%
2. Nikon @ 28.8%

In MILC category:
1. Olympus @ 30.7%
2. Panasonic @ 29.6%

In compact camera category:
1. Canon @ 16.2%
2. Sony @ 15.4%


Its rationalizations like this why Canon feels no need to release anything of import until everyone else does. Of course I'm speaking as one who likes to photograph things not a Canon stock holder.

And yes I was talking about the G1X but, in an attempt to make it oranges to oranges I brought up the 5N since I'm assuming the predominant touchscreen controls will be similar as far as workflow when handling the camera to the 5N if one were to rely on the touchscreen. But sure bring up the iPhone and having to deal with touch controls when talking about a $800 photographic tool, yikes.

When the competitions entry level MILC bodies seem to just offer more pound for pound at the same price point or even less you've got to wonder what Canon was thinking. Coasting on brand recognition isn't a valid excuse, at least for me.



Jul 28, 2012 at 12:14 AM
sebboh
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p.17 #10 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


wfrank wrote:
Oh no, Canon is a midget in this field, like it or not. What I see here is people that I believe would never touch anything with the Canon logo spewing out that "this will sell like flies drawn to cowshit". As if it were a worthless product or something. Super weird. But that just my personal opinion, I might be wrong.


you seem awfully sensitive about any criticism of canon, do you spend a lot of time on nikon forums? MOST of the people on this forum shoot canon (to the point that if you don't mention the camera used it is assumed to be a 5D of some variant), so it really can't be that much of a canon hating forum. canon is not a midget in this field, they are the dominant player in camera sales both at the consumer and pro level who has finally entered this weird subcategory of cameras. at the marketing and distribution levels they can push around most of the "established" players in this small but rapidly growing segment.



Jul 28, 2012 at 04:32 AM
 

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p.17 #11 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


All it will take to be a dominant player in the mirrorless market is the right mix of: price, features, & IQ, and IMO Canon is close, faster AF and add peaking & an EVF, and most of the complaints would disappear.


Jul 28, 2012 at 06:35 AM
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p.17 #12 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


Erm, how is Canon close? Of price, features and IQ it has none, as far as I can tell. The price is high, the features are few (well, there could be a lot in the menus I suppose, but no EVF, dual wheels, etc.) and the IQ of this by-now older sensor limps behind the Sony sensors. I think we will have to wait for the high-end EOS-M.


Jul 28, 2012 at 07:05 AM
EOS20
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p.17 #13 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


EOS M And 800 L:

http://www.canonrumors.com/2012/07/canon-eos-m-ef-800-f5-6l-is/




Jul 28, 2012 at 05:18 PM
Imagemaster
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p.17 #14 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


EOS20 wrote:
EOS M And 800 L:

http://www.canonrumors.com/2012/07/canon-eos-m-ef-800-f5-6l-is/



You can bet he is not handholding that with one arm. Did they clone out the monopod



Jul 28, 2012 at 05:43 PM
douglasf13
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p.17 #15 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


carstenw wrote:
Erm, how is Canon close? Of price, features and IQ it has none, as far as I can tell. The price is high, the features are few (well, there could be a lot in the menus I suppose, but no EVF, dual wheels, etc.) and the IQ of this by-now older sensor limps behind the Sony sensors. I think we will have to wait for the high-end EOS-M.


Agreed. The 22/2 is certainly a smart move, but, as far as camera bodies go, I don't find it much more appealing than Samsung NX, let alone NEX, m4/3, etc. Granted, I don't own any EOS DSLR lenses, but I wouldn't be interested in using those lenses on the EOS M, anyways. When I had Sony DSLR lenses, I didn't use them on NEX, either.



Jul 28, 2012 at 05:43 PM
mawz
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p.17 #16 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


douglasf13 wrote:
Agreed. The 22/2 is certainly a smart move, but, as far as camera bodies go, I don't find it much more appealing than Samsung NX, let alone NEX, m4/3, etc. Granted, I don't own any EOS DSLR lenses, but I wouldn't be interested in using those lenses on the EOS M, anyways. When I had Sony DSLR lenses, I didn't use them on NEX, either.


I dunno, I find the EOS-M LOT more appealing than a NX, because the mount is far more adaptable. I personally wouldn't buy one, but that's for other reasons, I dislike the Soapbar design inherited from the P&S world and I really dislike that 18MP Canon sensor. But if I was looking to get into Mirrorless now, in the sub-$1k body range, the EOS-M would be a strong option (I'd probably still choose the NEX-5N instead, it's a lot better value, but an EOS-M and the 22/2 would be a rather nice little kit).



Jul 28, 2012 at 07:26 PM
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p.17 #17 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


mawz wrote:
I dunno, I find the EOS-M LOT more appealing than a NX, because the mount is far more adaptable.



How much more adaptable could it be? Maybe I missed this somewhere. What lens can it take that the NEX can't. Not EOS EF lenses, as there is an NEX adapter available for that.




Jul 28, 2012 at 09:06 PM
mawz
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p.17 #18 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


Lotusm50 wrote:
How much more adaptable could it be? Maybe I missed this somewhere. What lens can it take that the NEX can't. Not EOS EF lenses, as there is an NEX adapter available for that.



NX, not NEX. (Frikkin Namespace collisions, could Sony not have picked a name which wasn't only 1 letter different from an already existing product?)

The adaptability of the EOS-M is very similar to E mount unlike NX which mount cannot adapt most RF lenses.



Jul 28, 2012 at 09:08 PM
wfrank
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p.17 #19 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


itai195 wrote:
You're surprised that people who you think would never touch a Canon product find the EOS-M worthless? Perhaps these people would never touch a Canon product because Canon doesn't make any products they like?


Of course not. I personally spend zero time in MFT and other threads about products that dont interest me. But if it's a Canon loads of people with zero interest show up and write how uninterested they are.



Jul 28, 2012 at 09:42 PM
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p.17 #20 · EOS-M - Canon mirroless system


My comment is about the 90% of the market that's not measurebaters, the EOS-M is in the ballpark spec wise, the sensor while not being cutting edge will still produce good images, the lack of EVF & peaking kills it for me(As I said before), but they did get the core specs right, it's compact, 18mm registration(I was worried it would be closer to 25mm), and the sensor is APS-C and not a smaller format(I do wish it was 1.3x or FF).

The next EOS-M(X/S/mkII) could have all the features we want(other than FF).

We'll find out how popular it is in the new year, and I predict it will do good enough for canon to continue with the format.



Jul 28, 2012 at 10:11 PM
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