Recently i've been shooting kids indoor soccer ..typical dark gym with crappy light. I've read lots of articles on tweaking the 1dIII focus/AI servo. have tried the back AF button for AF also and i don't think this is normal for a 1dIII to have so many OOF shots...i mean its just horrible.
Should i try MA? Send it in to canon for the 1dIII focus test even though i have a letter from canon that they applied the fixes (provided by the seller) . The 70-200 is tack sharp on the 5dII, 1dsIII, T2i..and sometimes on the 1dIII.
From the examples you posted I would chalk it up as user error. In the first two examples you shutter speed is waaaay to slow to stop motion, period. In the third its impossible to say, but again without testing to prove that the camera is not functioning properly, I am going to put it on you.
I would mount it on a tripod and do some testing, I am not anywhere near knowing how to officially test it, but just find some static and moving objects coming in you direction and track it using servo to insure it is tracking properly.
Also keep in mind that the mk3 is hyper active when it comes to grabbing focus, so lets say in the third shot you have posted that if for a split of a split second your focus area lost the target and you fired, then I would bet that there is something else in that frame that may be in focus because in that split second that if fell off of your sons face it grabbed focus on what or who ever it landed on.
Don't give up on this body yet, she really does take a while to master it and learn its sensitivities.
Also keep in mind that the mk3 is hyper active when it comes to grabbing focus, so lets say in the third shot you have posted that if for a split of a split second your focus area lost the target and you fired, then I would bet that there is something else in that frame that may be in focus because in that split second that if fell off of your sons face it grabbed focus on what or who ever it landed on.
Don't give up on this body yet, she really does take a while to master it and learn its sensitivities. ...Show more →
You're onto something here. On the first couple of shots in the series..it focused on the kid behind my son...and even though the focus point was on my son after the 2nd shot in the series...i can see the grass behind him is sharp and the rest of the series my son is out of focus. good thing there is another game tomorrow.
Perhaps i'll take the 1dIII and the 1dsIII and test it out.
1) If you're shooting high speed, slow down your FPS to give your lens more time to rack focus. I used to get frustrated at the 100-400 on ducks, then I slowed my FPS to 7 (because the 100-400 isn't the fastest) and my in-focus shots much higher. I realize the 70-200 is fast, but this might help a bit.
2) Dots on battery compartment don't mean anything, at least according to Canon service rep. I emailed them and sent serial # and mentioned two dots, they said disregard dots and the fix had NOT been done on the 1D3 I had. They repaired it free and quickly.
in addition to what's been mentioned,
you're also comparing shots from two different firmware versions and two completely different environments. it's hard to diagnose a problem when the samples aren't compared under the same circumstances.
i would up the shutter speed to at least 1/500-640, slow the servo tracking to default setting, and slow the frame rate to 8 frames/sec. try using the center point only as well.
you might also consider setting everything back to default, just to measure what changes help vs. make things worse.
Your noise levels are pretty bad too. That greatly impairs clarity on dark days. It must have been pretty dark out for iso to be 3200@1/160sec. That can screw up focus and make it jump. Try shooting without auto ISO if you want sharp photos, and remember that if you shoot too dark, with high ISO's you won't be able to lighten them. Lots of noise! If you are going to use high ISO, then make sure it's exposed properly .Try controlling your shutterspeed also.
I agree with lwrnclightner, it's a very precision camera that jumps focus sometimes a little too easily. My bet is they had to make it that way in order to handle 10FPS. I also sometimes shoot at 7FPS which helps. Try also shooting in single point rather than aiservo which can jump all over the place with confusing light or movements.
Forgot to add, if you are shooting aiservo, try a short pause in your half focus while following the movement before snapping the shot. The auto focus is a little more accurate if you give it a chance.
I will not get into all 1DMIII settings. There are some good guides. Here are some basics.
1)Servo Mode
2)Center point selected only. Try this with point expansion on and off to see what works for you.
3)Make sure you have seperated the Shutter button from the rear AF button. You do not want the Shutter button to AF the camera at all. You will try to keep the center point on your subject and AF the camera with the rear button. Release the shutter when feel you have the photo. You will constantly bump the AF with rear button when needed after the center point has wondered off a subject. You obviously hold the AF button down to track your subject.
4)Most of the time I set the the camera to AE not shutter priority. You are going to use f2.8-5.6 most of the time. Set the ISO to whatever setting allows you to maintain a shutter speed above 1200. Manual is good too for certain situations but AE is easy. The idea is to use the large apertures to get the background blur to isolate you subject.
5)Set the camera for about 6FPS at the most 8FPS. Once you have mastered these basics crank the camera up or down as needed. Practice at lower FPS lower meaning 5-6.
6)You really need to use a monopod. This helps a lot and is still mobile if you are shooting sports. Just because you have this fast focusing super computer does not mean all the basics of camera control do not apply. Try to be smooth as you track the camera. You will never see a tripod on a sideline but will always see one with something like a Wemberly head for wildlife with big glass. Use your monopod for sports.
7)Practice, practice practice. Use moving subjects to practice AFing the camera with the center spot on a moving subject and releasing the shutter when you see the photo you want develop in the viewfinder.
Some 1DMKIIIs had focus problems. I returned 2 bodies until the fix. It is an excellent camera. A huge percentage of action photos were taken with the 1DMKIII during it's reign.
I have not used the 1Diii, but my experience with shooting indoor action (HS hoops) with a 7D in really bad light (1/400 f/2 iso 3200) is that Canon's autofocus just doesn't work that well in those challenging conditions. There just is not enough light to generate enough contrast to enable quick (or sometimes any) accurate autofocus. Results are MUCH better if the light is just a stop or two higher.
You will probably get somewhat better results using a faster prime (e.g. 100mm f/2, or 135L), if you have one, becuase your SS will be faster, and motion blur will be less, but the AF challenge will remain.
If your lens/camera combo AF works well in decent light I doubt that calibration will help. I don't think Canon can calibrate the lens to work differently in crappy light. AF sytsems are limited and in that light and those conditions you are pushing the limits of what the system can do. Best approach may be to shoot many more shots, and wind up keeping only 10%-20%, vs. 70%-80% in somewhat better light.
If you really need a high % of keepers, consider strobes.
First off, it looks like you're processing jpg files for your examples. That puts you behind the 8-ball right from the start, especially in low light. I sometimes shoot sports with Large jpg to get super throughput at high fps (was 1DIII, now 1DIV), but only in good light. In low light, use RAW and you'll get a lot more decent photos, even though you get fewer images.
Shooting in low light at 3200 ISO is challenging. For most sports, I find that you need at least 1/400 sec to freeze the action. Little people might go down to 1/320 sec. Shutter speeds below 1/200 sec generally won't cut it. One way to do this is to shoot in M mode, set the shutter speed to 1/320 or so, and see what happens. You can still get great shots when it's somewhat underexposed, espeially if the players get a little more light than the background.
As far as AF in decent light goes, the third photo should definitely be sharper. I get the best results with AI Servo by keeping the AF button pressed and then holding down the shutter for a burst of shots in high speed drive, while tracking the subject. You do not need a monopod for daylight photography of moving subjects with the 70-200/2.8L-series lenses, and you usually don't need IS turned on, either. As long as AF is activated (and you're tracking the subject), the 1D-series AF forecasts where the moving subject will be when the next image is taken. This doesn't work so well when the camera doesn't know when you're going to push the shutter button to take the next image. In constant-speed shooting mode (i.e. hold down the shutter button), the camera can predict both where the subject will be and when the shutter will fire. You might need a few more memory cards, but you'll have a lot more keepers.
Would someone elaborate on the benefits of seperating AF from the shutter. How does that functionality differ from using a half press on the shutter with a full press to trigger bursts? Intuitively it seems like it accomplishes the same thing (AF tracking then shutter burst) but you have to coordinate two fingers vs. one.
Sunny, got to agree with Jim, the last shot should have been sharper. This frame appears to be at the end of a burst which you would expect to be spot on. The focal point has good contrast and the ss of 1/1250 is certainly fast enough. Is the focal point in the previous burst frames always on the same contrasting spot? If not, then techinque could be a part of the issue and perhaps an aide should be considered (monopod).
It's diffcult to tell whether any other spot on the frame might be sharper. In your quest, I would begin by isolating the body+lens capability by first learning what it can do with stationary targets under reasonable conditions with the goal to ensure it's dialed in to be sharp on target vs front or back focusing. Assuming you are successful, then move on to testing moving targets with the various settings combinations.
Separated AF, for me, helps because the * button is a more positive state, i.e. fully depressed vs the more subtle quasi depressed shutter while moving the camera to keep a focal point on the subject that can be erratically moving (soccer for example). It eliminates accidentally activating the shutter when I didn't intend to. For me, it's pretty natual with the thumb on the AF control and the index finger on the shutter. While many do subscribe to this method, in the end, it's up to you. BTW: it took me just one soccer game to get completely used to it.
pperham wrote:
Would someone elaborate on the benefits of seperating AF from the shutter. How does that functionality differ from using a half press on the shutter with a full press to trigger bursts? Intuitively it seems like it accomplishes the same thing (AF tracking then shutter burst) but you have to coordinate two fingers vs. one.
Another benefit other than what Matt mentioned, is that you can separate focus and exposure if you are shooting TV or AV. * button is focus & you can program half press shutter to lock exposure. If you're tracking a runner/cyclist/etc who is going between different lighting, you can hold down the back * button to get the AF tracking & half press the shutter when your subject gets into the lighting that you're going to take the shot.
Trying to track focus on the face is not easy in any light it is to small of an area and can blend in to drk reas in the background. You will have enough depth of field so focus track on there torso . I t larger and much easier for the focus system to lock onto.
1D3 user here, lots of soccer experience in low light. my camera set-up in tough light: manual settings (e.g. iso 3200-H, min 1/400, f/2.8, custom WB if possible), AF on the back button, center point only without expansion. Always try to allow AF a split second to lock, keep back button down, fire burst, release thumb. Repeat. There is a definite rhythm to it. (You really do have to keep the AF point pip on the player - good to put it smack on the jersey numbers.) If I get a good lock on the subject (something with higher contrast) and keep my thumb down, I'll get very high % of the burst in good focus.
