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Archive 2012 · New lenses

surf monkey
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p.6 #1 · New lenses

Sir_Loin wrote:
As good as the image of the "new" 24-70mm looks, I think it's just a clever mock up. Here's my reasons why I think this;

Where's the description of the lens alongside the red ring at the front? I can't remember any other L lens from the last 15-20 years that doesn't have this.

I can't see Canon abandoning the reverse type zoom it has used so successfully on the 28-70mm and 24-70mm.

I can't see any reason why it should be an 82mm filter thread.

The switches just don't look right.

I have to agree on one point, the total lack of lens info near the front element (except for 82mm) seems to be odd.
Maybe it's a prototype that doesn't include it? Seems fishy though.

The others reasons can be explained away pretty logically.
No reverse type zoom - less weight and more compact.
82mm filter - for better wide corner performance, like the 16-35.
Switches - not sure what looks odd about those, seems reasonable.

Feb 06, 2012 at 08:09 PM

S Dilworth
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p.6 #2 · New lenses

Sir_Loin wrote:
As good as the image of the "new" 24-70mm looks, I think it's just a clever mock up.

Your arguments don't hold water. Besides, the rumours are almost never wrong when they reach the stage of high-quality images of very plausible products. No-one who thinks it's fun to create rumours of fake products has the wit to invent plausible but entirely new features, such as switching this lens to a positive-lead type and updating the typefaces used for the lens markings.

The 82 mm filter thread is a necessary consequence of changing the optics to a positive-lead type. The Sigma from 2008 and the newly announced Tamron both have 82 mm filters for the same reason.

ciprian.trofin wrote:
Something else: ULTRASONIC is printed with silver letters, instead of red or gold. I know just one Canon USM zoom lens with silver letters - Canon EF-S 15-85mm f/3.5-5.6

The existence of that one lens would be enough, but there are others too: look at the 8-15mm f/4L fisheye. It's obviously Canon's attempt to update the look of its new lenses by removing old-fashioned typography and colour schemes.

Feb 06, 2012 at 08:32 PM

Sir_Loin
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p.6 #3 · New lenses

S Dilworth wrote:
Sir_Loin wrote:
As good as the image of the "new" 24-70mm looks, I think it's just a clever mock up.

Your arguments don't hold water. Besides, the rumours are almost never wrong when they reach the stage of high-quality images of very plausible products. No-one who thinks it's fun to create rumours of fake products has the wit to invent plausible but entirely new features, such as switching this lens to a positive-lead type and updating the typefaces used for the lens markings.

My arguments hold as much water as everyone elses opinions in this thread. I could right, everyone else could be right. We've seen mock ups before that looked nothing like the final product. We shall just have to wait and see.

Feb 06, 2012 at 08:43 PM

kakomu
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p.6 #4 · New lenses

stargazer78 wrote:
I'm not entirely sure why so many people are complaining about the new primes.

The current EF 24mm f/2.8 is 24 years old. The current EF 28mm f/2.8 is 25 years old. They're so old, they don't have USM because they pre-date that technology. Their optical formulas are so outdated, they're easily outperformed by modern zoom lenses. Hopefully these primes will actually outperform the L-zoom lenses like they should.

The EF 300 f/2.8 came out in November 1987 with a USM focusing system. Sure, the EF 28 f/2.8 came out in April 1987 (a few months before the 300 f/2.8), but the 24 f/2.8 came out well after the 300 f/2.8 and its USM focusing system.

As to the 28 f/2.8's less-than-stellar performance, that's probably attributable to having a very simple 5 element design. The FD 28 f/2.8 had a 7 element design. As an analog, Nikon's 28 f/2.8 had a 7 element design and then an 8 element design up through the Ai-S series, but went to a 5 element design for the Series E and AF. These 5 element designs were considered quite inferior to the previous versions. The AF-D version was upgraded to a 6 element design which was considered much better.

Ultimately, I get the impression that the 28 f/2.8 was considered a cheapie lens, so they used a cheap optical formula and set it at a price that is far less than either the 24 f/2.8 or the 35 f/2. It was probably designed to pair with the 50mm f/1.8 as another cheapie lens (though, one that performs quite well with a simple design).

That being said, the 24 f/2.8 is a very good performer.

Edited on Feb 06, 2012 at 09:17 PM · View previous versions

Feb 06, 2012 at 08:45 PM

M Vers
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p.6 #5 · New lenses

I remember when the 100IS was 'leaked' and how so many people called it out as a fake based on it's odd barrel design. In this case, the 24-70 looks a completely normal to me. I'd imagine the lack of lens description on the lip of the barrel has to do with the lens being a pre-production model--it might get printed/engraved later. OR maybe they are just taking a page out of a lot of other lens manufacturer's books and are just skipping the process, which in the end should save them a bit of money.

Feb 06, 2012 at 08:49 PM

tr1957
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p.6 #6 · New lenses

matejphoto wrote:
The primes are very surprising to me.
I expected a new full frame 50mm 1.4 and most importantly a 50mm equivalent for crop (like Nikons 35mm 1.8).

Yeah, it seems like updating the 28mm f1.8 over the F2.8 would have been the better move (would give an IS wide for the full frame bodies, and serve as the fast/IS normal lens for crop bodies).

Feb 06, 2012 at 08:54 PM

David Baldwin
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p.6 #7 · New lenses

Speaking personally I am delighted with the news that Canon are releasing a brand new 28mm f2.8.

Its a very versatile focal length on full frame, and with IS would offer an interesting approach to handheld lowlight work, different to the excellent 24L Mk2. I would expect a modern modest aperture 28mm to offer very high IQ. 28mm f2.8 doesn't sound very sexy, but it is a practical field of view, and I would think bitingly sharp wide open.

Bring it on!

Feb 06, 2012 at 09:25 PM

Jeff
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p.6 #8 · New lenses

deepbluejh wrote:
Focus limiter maybe? And Canon isn't going to make any high resolution press photos for prototypes. I think we can pretty well be assured this is a final lens.

Oh, I guess I missed the 'fact' that this was an image from Canon.

Feb 06, 2012 at 10:17 PM

troy12n
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p.6 #9 · New lenses

Kind of surprised they are even offering anything in the 28mm focal length anymore. An updated 20/2.8 would have been better than the 28.

And I question the need for IS at such wide FL's... but it's nice they are still thinking of non-L users I guess.

Feb 06, 2012 at 10:26 PM

skibum5
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p.6 #10 · New lenses

ciprian.trofin wrote:
100L is no zoom

but the 70-300L is and it has ultrasonic in black instead of red or gold!
so the new style is white on black or black on white for L!

Feb 06, 2012 at 11:50 PM

mpmendenhall
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p.6 #11 · New lenses

I'm also very excited about Canon's choice to update an "unexciting" lens like the 28/2.8.

For as long as I have been buying lenses, Canon has treated their slower tier of primes as "second class citizens" --- with low mechanical quality and optical formulas older than I am. This is largely what drove me from having a medium Canon lens collection to a very large everything-but-Canon lens collection (the only Canon lens I still have is an MP-E 65/2.8); so long as Canon was only offering thirty year old designs with lousy construction, I felt much better off choosing nicer thirty year old primes from Leica, Zeiss, Olympus, etc.

As Canon actually starts offering compact, lower-speed primes taking advantage of modern advances in manufacturing (affordable aspherics, exotic glass types, modern coatings, etc.), I will start considering adding Canon lenses back to my collection.

Feb 07, 2012 at 12:15 AM

RobertLynn
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p.6 #12 · New lenses

I don't mean to sound like a jerk off...but a lot of people saying they won't buy a version II, are the same people who complained that they didn't like version one because of IQ. The complaing about IS seems like sour apples to me.

I'm a wedding and event shooter...yeah, I'd like faster than f/2.8 but...I think that saying that f/2.8 isn't fast enough is hog wash. Absolute rubbish.

Feb 07, 2012 at 03:01 AM

kewlcanon
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p.6 #13 · New lenses

Well I guess they're from Canon

.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/2012/02/07/Canon_24-70mm_F2p8_II_24mm_f2p8_IS_28mm_f2p8_IS

Jeff wrote:
deepbluejh wrote:
Focus limiter maybe? And Canon isn't going to make any high resolution press photos for prototypes. I think we can pretty well be assured this is a final lens.

Oh, I guess I missed the 'fact' that this was an image from Canon.

Feb 07, 2012 at 05:35 AM

surf monkey
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p.6 #14 · New lenses

RobertLynn wrote:
I don't mean to sound like a jerk off...

And yet you always do.
Strong opinions about what others think are part of your charm.

Feb 07, 2012 at 05:45 AM

skibum5
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p.6 #15 · New lenses

Whoa did anyone look at the MTF for this new 24-70 II! Whoaaaa! Beats the new 24 2.8 IS prime's MTF (of course with the new prime costing $850 and canon cheaping out and not using UD in it that is a bit of a shame on Canon's part)! AND it destroys the old 24-70 MTFs and it even handily beats the 24 1.4 II MTF at 24mm!!

Not that they are everything and Canon does the fake computer generated charts, but it does hint that a good copy of this zoom may deliver out of this world insane image quality.

Wow at 24mm this new 24-70 simply DESTROYS the old 24-70 if the MTF charts are to be believed. Just kills it at f/2.8 AND at f/8! And at 70mm it utterly annihilates the old 24-70 at f/2.8! Just destroy all monsters it! And beats it at f/8 as well.

More shocking, according to the charts it also beats the new 24mm 2.8 IS at f/2.8 and f/8 (makes one only wonder what insane level of performance the new 24 prime would've had had they just stuck in a UD element or two and not been so cheap) and the 24 1.4 II at f/8 (and maybe even f/2.8 for all we know).

Assuming things work out as the charts imply, of course, and who knows about bokeh or CA, etc. And this certainly may be a big if.

Feb 07, 2012 at 06:01 AM

trumpet_guy
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p.6 #16 · New lenses

stargazer78 wrote:
I'm not entirely sure why so many people are complaining about the new primes.

The current EF 24mm f/2.8 is 24 years old. The current EF 28mm f/2.8 is 25 years old. They're so old, they don't have USM because they pre-date that technology. Their optical formulas are so outdated, they're easily outperformed by modern zoom lenses. Hopefully these primes will actually outperform the L-zoom lenses like they should.
Canon is finally getting around to updating their non-L primes for full frame, something many people thought we'd never see. Updated versions of the 20mm, 35mm, and 50mm are no longer out of the question.

Yes, I did not anticipate Canon would update these non-L primes.
I am happy to see I have been proven wrong. If these are sharp, I may consider one.

Feb 07, 2012 at 06:11 AM

surf monkey
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p.6 #17 · New lenses

skibum5 wrote:
Whoa did anyone look at the MTF for this new 24-70 II! Whoaaaa! Beats the new 24 2.8 IS prime's MTF (of course with the new prime costing $850 and canon cheaping out and not using UD in it that is a bit of a shame on Canon's part)! AND it destroys the old 24-70 MTFs and it even handily beats the 24 1.4 II MTF at 24mm!!

Not that they are everything and Canon does the fake computer generated charts, but it does hint that a good copy of this zoom may deliver out of this world insane image quality.

Wow at 24mm this new 24-70 simply DESTROYS the old 24-70 if the MTF charts are to be believed. Just kills it at f/2.8 AND at f/8! And at 70mm it utterly annihilates the old 24-70 at f/2.8! Just destroy all monsters it! And beats it at f/8 as well.

More shocking, according to the charts it also beats the new 24mm 2.8 IS at f/2.8 and f/8 (makes one only wonder what insane level of performance the new 24 prime would've had had they just stuck in a UD element or two and not been so cheap) and the 24 1.4 II at f/8 (and maybe even f/2.8 for all we know).

Assuming things work out as the charts imply, of course, and who knows about bokeh or CA, etc. And this certainly may be a big if.

Similar to what happened when the MTF charts came out for the 70-200ISv2. No one believed it could be that much better, but then...
Hopefully we can expect a similar result.

Feb 07, 2012 at 06:15 AM

surf monkey
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p.6 #18 · New lenses

So is the new 24-70 like the 24-105 in zoom function?
Will it lengthen a great deal when zoomed?
It looks very similar to the 24-105, just a bit bigger.
I did like the reverse zoom and the way the hood worked with it on the old version.
I guess you can't have it all.

Feb 07, 2012 at 06:17 AM

skibum5
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p.6 #19 · New lenses

trumpet_guy wrote:

Yes, I did not anticipate Canon would update these non-L primes.
I am happy to see I have been proven wrong. If these are sharp, I may consider one.

MTF charts on Canon's website imply that the 24-70 at 24mm will be sharper than the 24 1.4 II at f/8 (and for all we know give it a run for it's money at f/2.8) and they make the f/2.8 performance of the current 24-70 look laughable in comparison.

They imply the new 24 2.8 IS may be a tiny hair sharper than the 24 1.4 II at f/8 too (although worse than the new zoom

).

Of course reality may always different from computer simulated charts, etc. etc.

Feb 07, 2012 at 06:23 AM

Snopchenko
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p.6 #20 · New lenses

stargazer78 wrote:
I'm not entirely sure why so many people are complaining about the new primes.

The current EF 24mm f/2.8 is 24 years old. The current EF 28mm f/2.8 is 25 years old. They're so old, they don't have USM because they pre-date that technology. Their optical formulas are so outdated, they're easily outperformed by modern zoom lenses. Hopefully these primes will actually outperform the L-zoom lenses like they should.
Canon is finally getting around to updating their non-L primes for full frame, something many people thought we'd never see. Updated versions of the 20mm, 35mm, and 50mm are no longer out of the question.
Producing consumer-level, cheap lenses for full frame is indicative of where Canon intends to take the full frame format. It looks to me like Canon is bracing for full frame to become more affordable in the near future.
Adding I.S. to these particular lenses show that Canon will not rule out adding I.S. on non-telephoto lenses.

I really hope you're right but up until recently all the indication was to the contrary - that non-L EF lenses are being phased out for good, to be replaced with EF-S and L "equivalents" in order to milk those who want to use FF heavily. I'm glad if I'll be proven wrong on this one - sometimes it's not a shame to be proven wrong for the common good.

Still, the new Tamron 24-70 looks more interesting than any of these 3 lenses. Surely the MSRP isn't going to be $2300.

Feb 07, 2012 at 08:16 AM

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