Hi fellow FMer's. I have a Nikon D3s still under warranty that's causing me some concern. I am noticing some very odd noise patterns on some of my underexposed images. I realize that noise is common when trying to pull details out of the shadow on underexposed images in post. But the uniform pattern of the noise is what particularly concerns me. I've never had this type of noise in my RAW files on my D300 or D700, regardless of underexposure.
I've sent the examples to Nikon but they have stated that they cannot see the issue and that noise artifacts are acceptable in this situation. I'm not able to find examples online of this so I'm hoping to get some input from you guys.
For this example, the settings are: D3s, 70-200 2.8, ISO 5000(although I've seen this occur on ISO as low as 800), 1/125 sec @ f/2.8. Shot in raw, the CF cards I'm using are Sandisk Extreme 16GB cards. I thought at one point in may be the card but it shows up on both cards. Here's the original, about a 2 stop underexposure:
Has anyone else seen this? I have a request to send it in to Nikon during my slow time to have it thoroughly checked out while it is still under warranty.
I don't have a D3s, but that seems completely normal for a software 2EV push. What are your sharpening settings set at? Perhaps you are accentuating the noise a bit through that?
I don't really see any uniformity to the noise either.
I don't have a D3s, but I agree with the others here. For this level of underexposure and ISO, I would expect noise. As for the lines in the noise pattern, I don't know. But if it shows up in properly exposed images, then you have a reason for concern.
Right, the horizontal lines only show up in the shadows. These artifacts are not present where there are details. As I said in my original post, this also shows up in ISO 800. While I appreciate the responses, in my original post I never complained about the grain. I want to know if the "lines" of noise are normal. I realize I'm pushing the limits of the camera being 2+stops underexposed. While the D3s is an amazing camera, if I don't do my job then I certainly don't expect it to perform miracles. I am just trying to get other opinions if these lines would be considered within normal expectations as when I've tried to salvage underexposed NEF files from my other cameras I never seen this type of noise.
This was an "in the moment shot" that was backlit at sunset. I just liked the moment and was trying to salvage it in post when I noticed again these noise lines.
Like I said, just wanted some opinions from other D3s users while the camera is still under warranty.
Unfortunately it's endemic to the D3s sensor. It will exhibit banding even at base ISO (200), where it will be visible after about 2 to 3 EVs of shadow pushing, depending on the texture of the image content and how deep the shadows go.
You need to expose to the right of Histogram in the first place. If you need to bring it down 5 stops later, you can always do so without any problems.
utildayael wrote:
[both my D3s and D7000 do similiar if I push the file 2 stops and its a darker file like the one you posted]
The D90/D5000 exhibit no banding whatsoever. The D7000/D5100 only exhibit very slight, low-intensity banding but only after being pushed beyond 9 stops.
My D3s does not show the sort of linear noise that you are seeing. I looked up a few dark shots in Lr and upped the exposure 2 to 4 stops to create lots of shadow noise - but there were no lines.
[edit] Ditto for my D700.
Furthermore, using the jpg sample you posted it was pretty hard to remove the linear noise in Lr without savage NR. that is also unusual.
I'm often trying to capture more DR in landscape images taken hand-held so that high ISO is required. You could have used lower ISO and overexposed your image somewhat to prevent this noise but the sky would have been pure white and that may not be desirable. Still, a bit of exposure bracketing might have let you salvage something.
I shoot raw images. Did you ? Could it be that jpg processing or in-camera NR that only applies to jpg images is causing the problem ?
Alan the jpg sample was a screen shot from the NEF in LR (just used it for the example).
I'm not using any pocket wizards in this particular shot or any other radio equipment. What's I consistently notice when it occurs is that the line pattern only occurs in the shadows of the image, i.e. large areas of black, not where there is some amount of detail. I also notice that when it occurs, it's always on the first shot of a group. In this instance, this was the 1st frame of the several underexposed shots, again due to back light(which i initially thought I compensated for). Anyway, the consecutive shots, even though underexposed by the same amount, do not exhibit these noise lines.
I know some responded by saying the easiest way to avoid this is to expose properly and I know this. This was just a shot I was hoping to salvage in post b/c of the moment and noticed the pattern. I thought is was possibly an isolated instance but going through my archived shots, I've discovered it on several other NEFs in the same circumstances, with ISO ranging from 800-6400. I was just looking to get some feedback as to if others have seen this pattern before. As I said, I've never noticed it in the NEFs of my D300 or D700.
I have a month left on the factory warranty and I was going to send it in to have it cleaned and checked. Just wanted to know if I should have Nikon look into this further or if i was being paranoid.
Alan321 wrote:
My D3s does not show the sort of linear noise that you are seeing. I looked up a few dark shots in Lr and upped the exposure 2 to 4 stops to create lots of shadow noise - but there were no lines.
[edit] Ditto for my D700.
All Nikon FX cameras have it, in pretty much equal degrees. I've analyzed 4 different D3s and 3 different D700 and all exhibited similar amounts of banding. It generally doesn't show up until you the shadows closer to 3 stops, depending on the texture (or lack thereof) of the background and how deep the shadows are.
I just recently acquired a used D3s and mine does not exhibit this problem. Last weekend, I shot a lot of images indoors that were taken at ISO 2000 and above with heavy shadow areas and none showed white dots in horizontal lines like the OP's image above.
I also owned the D700 and it never exhibited this problem either. Madbloks, can you duplicate it?
