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Archive 2012 · Strobist
  
 
ukphotographer
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p.8 #1 · Strobist


I never said 'forced' I said 'endure'. According to Google Dictionary the verb endure means to: 1.Suffer (something painful or difficult) patiently. That just about sums it up.
Jan 28, 2012 at 04:28 PM
cgardner
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p.8 #2 · Strobist





Jan 28, 2012 at 06:11 PM
PhotoDes
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p.8 #3 · Strobist


Chuck,

I just wanted to say I've bookmarked this thread to read again -- I got lost a bit in the quagmire. Your information has always been helpful to me and I find the way you approach lighting and imaging in general to be very useful -- I like the practical approach which I don't find elsewhere. You've shared some interesting innovations and I appreciate the time you take to explain them so thoroughly.

Des
Jan 28, 2012 at 09:55 PM
cgardner
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p.8 #4 · Strobist


PhotoDes: I'd suggest you visit and bookmark my web site where I have tutorials which will give you a better understanding of my overall holistic / goal oriented approach than this contentious speedlight centric thread: http://photo.nova.org
Jan 28, 2012 at 11:46 PM
williamkazak
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p.8 #5 · Strobist


After reading all of the posts and going to the various websites, thank you Charles, I was going through my latest "Strobist kit" and I have decided on the following in a series of long bags and a slim bag, taking only what I need of this strobist kit per venue or situation;

3-SB800 Speedlights
3-Pocket Wizard Plus 2
3-Nikon coiled cords (screw type PC to PW straight tip)
4-Umbrella holder light stand adapter tops
2-Manfrotto Air Cushioned light stands on wheels for SB800's
1-Manfrotto Air Cushioned light stand without wheels for White Lightning studio strobe
2-Stroboframe 350 flash brackets with attached short Promaster TTL coiled cords
1-Nikon SB29 TTL long coiled cord
2-Norman light stands with umbrella adapters (for Reflectasol as a flat or as an umbrella with one SB800 and PW)
4-Square Reflectasols in different surfaces to use as bounce flats or umbrella
2-White shoot thru umbrellas, (small for SB800 and large for White Lightning)
3-Round white umbrellas with black backs (1 medium and two large)
1-White Lightning with spill kill reflector
2-Power cords for above White Lightning (keeping a spare cord handy)
2-Extension cords for White Lightning to plug into wall
2-Flash cords-PW to White Lightning (one is a spare)
3-Nikon SB800 gel kits
3-Nikon SB800 small plastic stands
6-Holders for eight AA batteries with batteries (48 batteries)
3-Stofen type plastic diffuser caps for SB800's
3-Stofen type diffuser caps for SB800's with the centers cut out for additional bounce power

What is interesting about this current kit is that I can use a flash bracket on camera with an attached SB800 and a PW in order to trigger two additional SB800 units on rolling stands with PW's for events. I put two small umbrellas on or use the Stofen cap diffusers. Either way, I can light up the dance floor.
Outdoors, I can use an SB800 hand held off camera with the long Nikon coiled SB29 cord or mount that same SB800 on a stand, with or without umbrella and stretch the coiled cord out.

If I need to bring any of my three canvas backgrounds, I add an additional Manfrotto air cushioned light stand with the canvas background of my choice. If I carry a muslin background instead, I add two Norman stands with a crossbar and a muslin.

Edited on Feb 21, 2012 at 04:37 AM · View previous versions
Feb 04, 2012 at 01:03 AM
cgardner
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p.8 #6 · Strobist


Looks like you have everything you need listed, except the truck to haul it...

Back in the summer of 1972 before working for Zucker I worked briefly with a free-lance PJ on Capitol Hill in DC who did a bit of everything, both stills and 16mm movies. He had build a very clever rolling movie studio rig. I was like a 5ft. tall steamer trunk on a hand truck. On the top of the case, permanently mounted was a fluid ball head mount for the movie camera. Inside the case was the camera and all the lights, stands, film and accessories needed. It was always packed and ready to roll at moment's notice.

http://super.nova.org/TP/ToolCart.jpg

If I were shooting weddings today I'd create something similar as a studio light "base station" for shoot portraits and groups with a pair of WL or Einsteins with that gear and my speedlight kit stored in the case. Then completing the portraits I'd lock the studio gear in the case, cable lock it to a post somewhere so it didn't get stolen and shoot the reception shots with the speedlights.

The "Photo with Santa" operations in shopping malls use a similar approach attaching everything needed to the cabinet they roll in and out and secure at night...

http://super.nova.org/TP/MallSantaStudio.jpg

The typical set-up is one light with a med SB and WL1600 used from about 15-20' to create the needed foot print with a butterfly pattern and very gradual front>back fall off eliminating the need for separate background lighting or separate fill light. The camera, usually an all-in-one like a G12 is attached to the light stand with a super clamp and extension arm. I do the same thing occasionally...

http://super.nova.org/TP/SuperClamp.jpg

Chuck
Feb 04, 2012 at 10:16 AM
RDKirk
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p.8 #7 · Strobist


Back in the summer of 1972 before working for Zucker I worked briefly with a free-lance PJ on Capitol Hill in DC who did a bit of everything, both stills and 16mm movies. He had build a very clever rolling movie studio rig. I was like a 5ft. tall steamer trunk on a hand truck. On the top of the case, permanently mounted was a fluid ball head mount for the movie camera. Inside the case was the camera and all the lights, stands, film and accessories needed. It was always packed and ready to roll at moment's notice.

I've been using this approach for a number of years, my "ShootNScoot" system:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rdkirk/4061324014/
Feb 04, 2012 at 01:29 PM
takurpic
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p.8 #8 · Strobist


Chuck, that's a pretty sweet rig!

____________________________________

When folks hit me up with 'how do I learn photography?', I send them here to FM and to Strobist. Two incredible resources for people willing to do some research.


Feb 06, 2012 at 08:28 AM
cgardner
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p.8 #9 · Strobist


takurpic wrote:
Chuck, that's a pretty sweet rig!

You mean this?

http://super.nova.org/TP/SuperClamp.jpg

I love the SuperClamps. They are like a Swiss Army knife for lighting. In a situation where I want a higher than normal POV for the camera can put one speedlght on the top of a 12" stand, the camera below it on a SuperClamp, and a second flash clamped near it for fill. I can then hoist it in the air and trigger it via cable release (I have the Canon 60' long extension cord). It takes a bit of trial and error to get the framing right, but that's simplified by using a china marker on the stand collar and section.

Another very handy DIY lighting accessory I use is this board on which I counter sunk a 1/4" -20 (standard tripod size) 1" long bolt and then attached a 5/8" lighting stud...

http://super.nova.org/TP/BoardandStud01.jpg

I use it a lot of different ways. In the studio I'll put my background light on it when I need it low to the ground behind seated subjects. With the addition of a bungle cord or a few nails and a hammer I can attach it to a tree and turn it into a light stand for my speedlights...

http://super.nova.org/TP/BoardandStud02.jpg

When I need a tall tripod and carrying a ladder is logistically feasible I will attach my tripod ball head to the board and then "A" clamp it to the top of the ladder...

http://super.nova.org/TP/LadderPod.jpg

Another handy non lighting accessory are chemistry lab clamps. I've used the one shown below since the 70s for holding my Larsen reflectors on the stand. Here is shown with a section from an old stand creating a mini-boom to extending my AB800 away from the stand so I could tilt it down more...

http://super.nova.org/TP/LabClamp.jpg

The stand I use most of the time for indoor speedlight shooting isn't a light stand it is a modified disposable "Pitch It Sr." medical IV stand I found for $5 in a thrift store...

http://super.nova.org/TP/IVStand.jpg

It is similar to the one I used in the 70s when shooting weddings with Zucker. It makes shooting with two flashes as simple logistically as shooting with one because it can be rolled around and adjusted with one hand.

I keep that light stand and another conventional one, and all the other accessories in a canvas storage bag from a folding lawn chair that has a shoulder strap. I grab it and the camera bag which has my camera bracket clipped to the top handle with OC-E3 permanently attached and the lighting accessory bag and I'm good to go to handle every situation I typically encounter that is within the power range of the speedlights. I've been shooting that way with KISS DIY solutions for 40 years now.







Feb 06, 2012 at 09:46 AM
RobertLynn
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p.8 #10 · Strobist


For anyone giving the white towel grief, I'll say this...

(sometimes you're not always in control of the ambient light sources and you can't turn them off or modify them)

The white towel doesn't get fooled by fluorecent lights...my Sekonic L358 will read "EV" in rapid cycling light.

Not sticking up one way or the other, not stirring the pot or anything. I find Chuck's posts informative, and yeah, there's a lot of the times they are the same, btu i forget things often, and need refreshed. I've never once had a problem with his posts.
Feb 12, 2012 at 11:24 PM
williamkazak
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p.8 #11 · Strobist


I was shooting gels the last couple of days. Last night, I was at a gallery show that was using florescent lighting. I thought I would try the Flourescent gel that comes with the Nikon SB800 speedlight. I was using my flash on a bracket with Stofen type diffuser cap that I had cut out of the center. I bounced to the ceiling and let the diffuser push light forward also. I was trying different WB settings on the camera. I tried Auto WB, Florescent, and Flash WB. Not sure what I was "supposed" to use. I wanted ambient, so my shutter was around 1/60 and my F stops were fom 5.6-F8, camera on M and flash on Auto.
Another situation, the day before; side light with the warm gel which I suspect is for incandescent. The room was lit by incandescent. My fill flash on camera with bracket was not gelled (mistake?). I was getting the side light to spray the background as well as become my "key" light. Nice pics of the musicians, good backgrounds. Camera set at 1/125 at F4 mostly, slight tweaks in LR. Was wondering where my WB setting on the camera should be in that circumstance? A, Flash or? Pics were mostly warm and I had to add some blue in LR. CG and I corresponded about this so I tried the light totally to the side but we never talked about gels. Any comments?
Mar 03, 2012 at 04:39 PM
alohadave
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p.8 #12 · Strobist


williamkazak wrote:
I was shooting gels the last couple of days. Last night, I was at a gallery show that was using florescent lighting. I thought I would try the Flourescent gel that comes with the Nikon SB800 speedlight. I was using my flash on a bracket with Stofen type diffuser cap that I had cut out of the center. I bounced to the ceiling and let the diffuser push light forward also. I was trying different WB settings on the camera. I tried Auto WB, Florescent, and Flash WB. Not sure what I was "supposed" to use. I wanted ambient,...Show more →

Set your WB to Florescent and put the gel on your flash.

There's a problem with florescents though. You need to know which color bulbs are being used, and hope that they are all the same. There are many varieties and they are almost always mixed. Green and magenta are two colors that are fairly common.

williamkazak wrote:
Another situation, the day before; side light with the warm gel which I suspect is for incandescent. The room was lit by incandescent. My fill flash on camera with bracket was not gelled (mistake?). I was getting the side light to spray the background as well as become my "key" light. Nice pics of the musicians, good backgrounds. Camera set at 1/125 at F4 mostly, slight tweaks in LR. Was wondering where my WB setting on the camera should be in that circumstance? A, Flash or? Pics were mostly warm and I had to add some blue in LR. CG...Show more →

Your WB should match the color of light that you want to be white. In this case, you could set your WB to Incandescent (Tungsten) or Flash. When you set the WB to Incandescent, the ungelled flash will read as blue (same thing happens when you get sunlight with Incandescent WB. If you set the WB to flash, all the Incandescent light sources will go orange. If your flash was ungelled, it would read as white.

When I'm shooting events, I'll typically leave the camera on Flash or Daylight WB (they are pretty close), leave my flashes ungelled, and let tungsten light sources go orange. It's close enough that most people won't even question orange light fixtures. I've never had any luck with using a CTO (Color Temperature Orange-the Incandescent correcting gel) and setting my WB to Incandescent. I always get a magenta color cast. Plus, if there is any kind of daylight coming in through windows, they will be blue and you get blue highlights where it hits things and people in your shots. I'd rather have orange light fixtures than blue color casts on people.

One thing to remember is that you can correct for one WB. If you have two different colors, you correct for one, and the other one will go where it will. If you have more than two different colors of light, try to eliminate one (usually florescent is the one to eliminate if possible).
Mar 03, 2012 at 08:43 PM
williamkazak
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p.8 #13 · Strobist


Thanks for the response. In the second situation with the musicians, I am able to go back every week and experiment, so I do, but with flash now, which is the point of this thread. The gel on the side key light made the light warm which corresponded to the incandescent lights of the venue. Spraying some light onto the background in the process and shooting at ISO 3200, it was all good. White light keylight from the week before, without a gel, was suddenly now a warm look, of course, which was what I was after for a change of pace. I could have not used fill flash at all by merely letting the room ambient handle fill, like I have done many times there. I put the flash on a bracket, like I mentioned, so I could be more in control, as suggested to me by CG. Not bad, either. I had to tweak the manual flash as I moved around. No big problem. In LR I added a little more fill as needed. It dawned on me, when I was shooting, that I should have gelled the fill flash also, to match up better. Only in a few instances did the person in the foreground look "white" in color because of the flash, while the background and the other players were still looking warm. I understood what was happening and I put the camera WB on flash or incandescent and they looked the same to me. I mostly added a little blue in LR for a little less "warm".
The first situation, with florescents in the white room, could have been handled by high ISO, no flash and Auto WB in the camera. I wanted to experiment, so I put the florescent gel in the flash as I bounced, tilting the Stofen and flash as to throw fill forward into the faces. I guess what confused me was that when I finally figured my camera WB in the very beginning of the art show, I thought I used camera WB/flash. Then, I used camera Auto/WB, which was probably more of the same look to me. Then, I tried camera florescent/WB. I think that the reason I did all of that was because, as I had a lowered shutter speed to catch ambient, I moved around the room, shooting artwork, sculptures and people, all the while bouncing the flash, my colors were all not the same. Florescent lighting is a bitch when you need some ambient because I did not want the room totally lit up with flash. Again, LR, came in handy for some color tweaks.


Mar 04, 2012 at 01:26 AM
cgardner
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p.8 #14 · Strobist


When shooting speakers, stage events, dress rehearsals, etc. were I can use flash I gel my flashes with 1/2 CTO gel, then using a gray card set Custom WB off the gelled flash.

http://super.nova.org/TP/CTO.jpg

The logic behind my approach is this: I like normally balanced skin tones and viewers expect to see them in photos where there's nothing in the background context to suggest the ambient light isn't neutral. That's because in person our eyes adapt to the ambient and see faces in any light as "normal" per that context.

Setting Custom WB off the card with the gelled flash ensures the more important faces in the foreground will be reproduced as neutral and "normal" looking. The 1/2 CTO might not match the tungsten in the background exactly but it will be closer to "normal" looking than would be if I used flash WB. More often than not in PP I keep the WB on the faces neutral, but if I want to change the mood to look warm / cold I'll adjust the temp slider in the Adobe Camera RAW editor I use with CS5.

Here are a couple examples:

http://super.nova.org/TP/BarryBlack2.jpg

Barry Black, Chaplain of the US Senate guest preaching at my church. The "key" light from the left and the rim light from behind are the stage lighting (tungsten/halogen) but the stage fill had a strong magenta cast. To eliminate the color cast in the shadow of the gray suit and face I used a single 1/2 CTO gelled flash on a bracket with my diffuser as fill to overpower the color cast in the shadows.

Below is the same stage at a teen talent show. The overall stage lighting was pretty flat so I put my gelled slave flash on stage out of frame on the left as a rim light, lighting the front side (minimally) with the gelled flash on the bracket...

http://super.nova.org/TP/FirepowerWide.jpg
http://super.nova.org/TP/FirePowerCU.jpg

There I adjusted the color a bit warmer than neutral in PP for the close-up.

There was enough light in either case to shoot ambient. And with the talent show there wasn't the color cast problem I just wanted to add the accent flash on the left and blend it in seamlessly.

The biggest advantage I see in gelling flash in tungsten environments is that it allow cranking up the ISO for more background ambience and avoid the "shot in a cave" look of front>back flash fall-off creates when trying to overpower the ambient to avoid color casts.

The more you raise the ISO (or slow the shutter) the less the flash is needed to expose the foreground. Raise ISO high enough in some situations and no flash at all is needed. To find the right balance I look at the eyes of the subjects. Often the ambient light fixtures overhead will cause the brow to shade the eyes. Overpowering the ambient with the flash on the bracket gets the light in the eyes but will make the background darker by degree as teh flash falls off. If ISO is raised to the point the flash isn't doing much the shaded eyes will be darker.

A solution to the "shot in a cave" look is to put the slave flash behind the action like this (light included in the shot to show it's position)

http://super.nova.org/TP/10mm_ActionB.jpg

The light from the back flash meets the flash on the bracket in front (creating downwards butterfly modeling) in the middle, uniformly lighting the space. For even more uniform lighting of the space while adding rim light for separation bounce the light in back up off the ceiling instead of aiming it directly. When I have a low ceiling to work with I'll often open the top flap of both my diffusers which splits light up and forward

William, that bounced approach is one you might want to try at your music venue. Keep your frontal slave on the stand on the table on the right as you have been and use fill over the camera, then add a third flash with a DIY paper or foil snoot somewhere on stage behind or to the side of the performer. Don't aim it directly at them, bounce the spot of light up off the ceiling behind them. The snoot will hide the source in the photo and the spot on the ceiling will provide both rim light component for separation and bounce more light onto the background of the stage minimizing the fall off from your key and bracket fill in front.
Mar 04, 2012 at 07:58 PM
williamkazak
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p.8 #15 · Strobist


Problems at the Thursday night jam sessions include no ability to bounce. The ceilings are not really there because it is a warehouse of sorts, an old hardware store. Cannot place anything behind the performers, as they can knock it over. Tried that. My key light, last week, March 1, was on a small tabletop tripod on the lockers to my right. That is directly on the side of their faces. I get different looks as they turn their heads while playing or singing. Previously, I had the key light on a table to my right in a small silver reflector or with just a Stofen cap. That got me dark backgrounds because I was going for ISO 800 at 1/125 at F4 for quality. So, last week, March 1, I went back to ISO 3200. You can see this stuff in my Facebook folders. It takes me almost a week to get each session up but I am enjoying playing with the various flash techniques, rather than just all available light as before, which is the idea of this thread.

Here is last week, March 1 with the light on the side of the performers on a small Leitz table top tripod on top of the lockers with Stofen cap and warming gel. I used fill flash on camera, no gel;
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.3207916870780.2149356.1051949743&type=1&l=d7ad825dfe

Febuary 23. The light on a table on my right with small silver umbrella and stand;
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.3145820518410.2147964.1051949743&type=3&l=f00c30a200

Febuary 16, flash on my right on table with small silver umbrella or Stofen cap and stand;
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.3108609428156.2147066.1051949743&type=3&l=1460a5a59c..

Febuary 9;
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.3046898565423.2146051.1051949743&type=3&l=0807e639c3

Edited on Mar 06, 2012 at 11:45 PM · View previous versions
Mar 05, 2012 at 02:36 AM
williamkazak
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p.8 #16 · Strobist


I did a Sweet 16 birthday party last night. I brought two speed lights on rolling stands. Think wedding reception. I wanted a directional light so I did not bounce. I did not want to light the whole place up. I just used the Stofen cap on the speed lights and pointed them right at the dance floor. I wandered with my flash on a bracket as I shot pictures of the dancers. Mirrors were on one entire wall. I had wondered if I should use a small silver umbrella in each set but I decided that experiment was for another day. I liked what I was getting, with the Stofen caps, considering the mirrored wall was limiting my "enjoyment" and tied up my desired light placements. Invariably, I get some shots with the stand included and the light blasting off. With an umbrella on the top, that would have been more obnoxious. Anyone want to comment on their event lighting when not bouncing?


Mar 05, 2012 at 02:47 AM
cgardner
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p.8 #17 · Strobist


One of the reasons I like candid shooting with flash much more than studio work is that just about every room you walk into contains a different set of lighting problems to solve. I touch on that in this tutorial of my for beginners titled When To Use Flash. Sometimes the best strategy is to leave the flash in the bag. Other times you wind up using every tool and trick in the bag. There is no "one strategy fits all" solution so more tools and tricks you have in the bag the more fun and effective ways you can control the lighting.

Your StoFen adventure is a perfect example. For situations where you want to spread light and fill the room putting a flash with one in a corner where the corner of the room will increase it's footprint with a diffuse but directional pattern is the perfect tool. But bouncing the flash backwards into the corner would have about the same net effect.

You just need to start with the goal of the lighting you want in the shot, size up how much the ambient will provide it, then supplement it as best you can with whatever gear you choose to bring. I use a "belt and suspenders" approach. I always have my Master flash on a bracket for situations where I can't bounce or use other strategies with my DIY diffuser which lets me blast most of the light forward with flap down or split it like a StoFen cap.

Most of the time I get by with just my flash on bracket and another on a stand, a solution I can carry in and on my camera bag but I also have a "lighting bag" (from a folding lawn chair with a convenient shoulder strap) I have packed with a couple of stands, super clamps and other mounting solutions. The tricks I use just scratch the surface of ways cinematographers mount lights. Take a look at the movie lighting accessories at B&H and you'll be amazed at all the creative solutions that are out there, such as a lighting stud that will attach to the frame of a tile ceiling, studs on A clamps, studs that can be screwed in anywhere, studs on plates that can be nailed to trees, etc.

In terms of lighting style, direct vs. bounce? I take my clues from the environment, ambient lighting, and the implied message of the photo. If shooting a "normal" office scene I'd bounce the flash off the ceiling because the room in normally filled with even overhead lighting. If I want a more dramatic look I'll use direct sources, or mix direct and flash..

For example, I was asked to to a photo story on the group of volunteers who do food prep at our church. The kitchen was lit up like an overcast day at noon with the fluorescent fixtures. Wanting something a bit more dramatic and controlled lighting-wise I opted to use three 580ex flashes and overpower the ambient for most the shots...

http://super.nova.org/TP/LightingDiagram.jpg

Due to the tight quarters, equipment and the need to work around the action I used third "C" group flash (designated for background lighting when using Canon ETTL ratios) instead of trying to bounce light into the background as I might in an office or average room. The SuperClamps allowed me to attach my key and background lights to whatever was handy — shelves, doors, equipment — when there wasn't room for a light stand. I love those things and don't know how I lived without them for so many years

http://super.nova.org/TP/SuperClamp.jpg
Mar 05, 2012 at 08:24 AM
williamkazak
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p.8 #18 · Strobist


Nice kitchen lighting, Sir Charles. It is helpful to think back on a job and analyze it, "next day". At the Sweet 16 party, at the dance floor, one wall was all mirrors. I could have used just one light on wheels with my flash on camera to add dramatic lighting to the situation. Less hassles. The rest of the room was all mirrors!
Mar 05, 2012 at 01:03 PM
williamkazak
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p.8 #19 · Strobist


Get this, at the Thursday night Jam last night, I got there early, as usual. A couple of new to the event photogs also arrived and wanted to do a few pics when the music starts. We were testing our WB, ambient exposures too and I was adding my side light with small silver umbrella and no gel. I figured ISO 3200 or 1600 with 1/125 at F4 was right for me with WB set on camera at Florescent. No flash on camera. Anyway, half throught the night, my pics started looking blue. Couldn't put my finger on it. I looked up at two Florescent tubes shining brightly along with the usual Tungstin lights. I called the prop today. He said he turned on the Tungstin half way into the program. What? You mean you increased the intensity? He said, no, he turned them ON, to add with the Florescant. WTF? I thought I was looking at everything turned on when we were testing in the beginning. Duh. Of course, light balance is all over the place again. Then, I look in my menu this morning, tracing all of this back before I called him and I see that I have all of these various Florescent options in my camera menu. Duh again. Pics up on FB in a week. Tried to talk the prop into removing the Florescent tubes for more Tungsten but he said the reason for both was when they mixed paint, they could work day or night and match up paint colors. It is an old hardware store.
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.3226949866593.2149747.1051949743&type=1&l=b04412d2e1
Mar 09, 2012 at 11:06 PM
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