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Archive 2011 · 1DX review by TDP
  
 
mttran
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p.2 #1 · 1DX review by TDP


Dawei Ye wrote:
I dunno...6 years ago we had the 5D released, where ISO 3200 was easily usable.

3 years later, we had the 5D2 released, where ISO 3200 was still considered the usable limit, perhaps ISO 6400 (arguably).

2 years after that, we got a 1D IV

In 5 years, we've barely improved 1 stop in usability

Consequently if we can only barely get a 1 stop improvement in 5 years between the 5D and 1DIV, I'm a bit sceptical that 51K, an improvement of 4 stops, is realistic for 1 year.


, you have read my minds...it should be good but 4 linear stops from 5D/1Ds2 ? it can't be. 2 linear usable stops then maybe



Dec 21, 2011 at 08:15 PM
thejakestir
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p.2 #2 · 1DX review by TDP


Dawei Ye wrote:
.....

In 5 years, we've barely improved 1 stop in usability

Consequently if we can only barely get a 1 stop improvement in 5 years between the 5D and 1DIV, .....



Dang, is the 1dIV really only one stop better than the 5d classic? I've never used a 1dIV but I'm taking it off my list now.



Dec 21, 2011 at 09:05 PM
Ralph Conway
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p.2 #3 · 1DX review by TDP


RobertLynn wrote:
Did I seriously read that you think it won't be worth it, unless it's 25600/51000 ISo setting is like the 3200 of a 5d2....

Wow...I missed the ferry boat ride to fantasy land and I'm awaiting at the dock for the next arrival.



No. As far I remember I sayd (or wanted to say) that I expect 1DXs ISO 25600 will be in compareable IQ to 5D IIs ISO 3200 - usable without mayor developing settings. And I MENTIONED (or wanted to) that if it will be not FOR ME the 1DX would not be interesting for thinking about it anyway. Here in germany its priced at (a rumored) $ 8-11K already.

An additional 1-2 stop improvement was just usual the last body generations follow up WITH an additional resolution enhancement. Compared to 5D MK II the "DX" provides 20% less pixels in a 3 years newer sensor. And itīs the new flagship. So why not 3 stops instead of just 1.5 or two?

Maybe I am a dreamer. But I drove the ferry boat the last 30 years and already saw a couple of "wonders" within the last decade.

To all others. I am sorry. My post was just a sign of frustration about still not seeing any highres high ISO pics. I read same "introductions" half a dozends of time. To me just copies of Canons original "press infos". I might have published the same on my website. But I did not. It would not make any sense. I am still not connected to anny supplier, amazon or anybody selling anything.
My fault.

Of course there are people out there who did not and might be happy about Peters link.
And giving the info tu us/them was fine, Peter.



Dec 22, 2011 at 09:29 AM
Ralph Conway
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p.2 #4 · 1DX review by TDP


Dawei Ye wrote:
I dunno...6 years ago we had the 5D released, where ISO 3200 was easily usable.

3 years later, we had the 5D2 released, where ISO 3200 was still considered the usable limit, perhaps ISO 6400 (arguably).

2 years after that, we got a 1D IV

In 5 years, we've barely improved 1 stop in usability

Consequently if we can only barely get a 1 stop improvement in 5 years between the 5D and 1DIV, I'm a bit sceptical that 51K, an improvement of 4 stops, is realistic for 1 year.


No.
To me 5D was usable in ISO 1600. barely in ISO 3.200.
5D II (3 years later) ISO 3200 was fully usable, 6400 is great - at additional 9MP.

To me that looks more than one stop. Itßs 1.5 by encreasing the resolution about 30%.
1D IV is an ather product. It vame next to 5D II and it has to be compared with 1D 3, imo.
In 3 years we have improved 1.5 stops. The last 3 years nothing has changed. Next generation is just infront the door. A follow up giving us another 1.5 would make 3 stops to me within 6 years, not one in 5.

Edit:
To explain my viewpoint:
In 2002 I bought a D60, giving me great ISO 400 and somehow usable ISO 800.
In 2008 I purchased a 5D MK II. Giving me much better ISO 3200 (than 800 six years earlier) and full usable 6.400. At an resolution increase from 6 to 21MP.
For me that counts more than 3 stops with more than three times multipled resolution. Within 6 years. So why not another three stops at a lower resolution within 3 years?

Ralph



Dec 22, 2011 at 09:39 AM
adrianb
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p.2 #5 · 1DX review by TDP


What I agree on with Ralph is ...those tiny samples released...which really are pretty much useless..

On certain situations 5D II is a real improvement over the old 5D.

I can now easily shoot at ISO 2000, 3200, 4000, 5000. I don't like to go over 5000.

iso 1600 was usable on 5D but not always.

I really don't think anybody really doubts that the 1DX will be an amazing camera...

Surely it will be superior to all Canon bodies, in pretty much every aspect (perhaps except the 3mp gap)

But what one really has to ask himself is: is it really worth the money?

The only people who can actually consider the 1DX are those for whom money is NOT a problem and those who earn serious money from Photography and who can both afford the body and would benefit from its features (who actually NEED it).

I'd love to own a 1DX but I know it's an overkill for me. I'd be happy with a 1Ds II / 1D III... or hell, even a 1D II N as a 2nd body.

We're getting way too obsessed with gear.

I'm sure that some people are justified to discuss about 1DX and its features, but the rest of us,are just lurkin' around ....gazing into the abyss of photo gear...



Dec 22, 2011 at 02:21 PM
PetKal
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p.2 #6 · 1DX review by TDP


adrianb wrote:
I really don't think anybody really doubts that the 1DX will be an amazing camera...



Well, I do not neccessarily doubt that, but I have my reservations about the 1DX AF system: will it live up to the design hype ? Are we going to see marked improvements relative to the previous 1D cameras ? Will it work well at all ?

You see, the MkIII caper with its autofocusing has not been forgotten.

Furthermore, the servo AF performance of 7D doesn't instil much confidence in Canon's know- how relative to servo AF design. (Yes, you can say I am not impressed by 7D's servo AF at all )

All in all, on paper I think 1DX is poised very well, however, with that camera Canon has to earn their laurels in the trenches.

Edited on Dec 22, 2011 at 06:13 PM · View previous versions



Dec 22, 2011 at 05:42 PM
adrianb
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p.2 #7 · 1DX review by TDP


I never shot with 1D series. I would really like to get my hands on some models (1Ds II, 1D II/N, 1D III) just for a few test shots to see the difference between crappy AF (5Dc/5DII) system and normal AF system.

I pretty much use 99.9 % user center spot on my 5D II & recompose ,and one shot AF.Rarely or almost never AI SERVO.

I don't use outer points or AI servo not because I shoot dead/static stuff,just because I can't nail the shots as I'd like to..

I'm curious as how AI servo works on 1DII/1Ds II/ 1D III, not just by reading forums & stuff because on the web everybody's opinion is based on their own feel/perception/judgement..

So what works for some may be useless for me.

I also believe that putting AF aside, the 1DX is a winner (IQ/speed/features etc).

Only concern is the AF which they will either NAIL it, or....hopefully not mess it up and put an AF inferior to the one in the other 1D series..

After all, judging by all the other specs, the 1DX should really have some serious AF because even though it's a 'one man show' /"do it all" camera, it's not a landscape/fashion/etc body (such as the 5D II),to be able to come with an excuse for a crappy AF system.

I mean, I dig it, the 5D are slow because they were never meant to be cameras that you can jump into action,bullets flying by & etc... but the 1DX should be able to cope with that (AF wise).






Dec 22, 2011 at 05:54 PM
RobertLynn
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p.2 #8 · 1DX review by TDP


If you're just using center point, you won't much see a difference in static af performance.


Dec 22, 2011 at 06:49 PM
Pixel Perfect
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p.2 #9 · 1DX review by TDP


Chris Ventura wrote:
So your facts are based on...rumor sites? And Nikon is dead as a competitor how? Last time I checked Nikon had superior noise handling, in both the D7000 and D700 compared to 5DMKII and 7D. Let's not even discuss AF...



Mustn't have looked very closely. The D7000 may have some advantages over the 7D in colour, but not in noise. Download the RAW images say from dpreview and procees them in ACR 6.6 and compare them and you'll see almost no difference in noise.

The 5D II downsized to 12MP will show more detail and less noise than the D700.

Edited on Dec 24, 2011 at 05:24 AM · View previous versions



Dec 23, 2011 at 09:39 PM
RobertLynn
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p.2 #10 · 1DX review by TDP


Pixel Perfect wrote:
Mustn't have looked very closely. The D7000 may have some advantages over the 7D in colour, but not in noise. Download the RAW images say from dpreview and procees them in ACR 6.6 and compare them and you'll almost no difference in noise.

The 5D II downsized to 12MP will show more detail and less noise than the D700.


Be careful...if you say anything bad about the D.7K and D7K, you're obviously a Canon fanboy.



Dec 23, 2011 at 10:05 PM
 

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Ralph Conway
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p.2 #11 · 1DX review by TDP


Pixel Perfect wrote:
Mustn't have looked very closely. The D7000 may have some advantages over the 7D in colour, but not in noise. Download the RAW images say from dpreview and procees them in ACR 6.6 and compare them and you'll almost no difference in noise.

The 5D II downsized to 12MP will show more detail and less noise than the D700.


Last is my real life experience with 5D MK II and D700, too. I did the last wedding with both.
I can not compare D7000 with 7D - never worked with one of them.

And no (to Chris) I developed 1400 shots in ISO up to 6.400. 800 D700 and 600 5D IIs. I do not know where you found superior noise handling at the D700. They are near to equal in 100%. Beside the fact that 5D II offers 75% more pixels. Like PixelPerfect says: downscaled to 12MP the %D MK IIs images do both: show finer detail and less noise at same high ISO.

And right, there is no fact yet for my Nikon "out of race" idea. Its really just the rumored D4 at 2MP AND two stops less to the already announced 1D X, it should compete against (what stil is a rumor, too).

The good thing: If D4 will replace D3s it might first time hopefully be much cheaper then itīs Canon equivalent. What at least might low down the price of 1D X. A benefit for all of us.

Ralph



Dec 23, 2011 at 10:53 PM
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p.2 #12 · 1DX review by TDP


Ralph Conway wrote:
... at least might low down the price of 1D X. A benefit for all of us.

Ralph


+1



Dec 23, 2011 at 11:21 PM
mark petri
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p.2 #13 · 1DX review by TDP


stebesplace wrote:
$7K officially prices me well out of the market. I mean, even $4K for the Mark IV is steep, but one could actually save up and attain this within a period of time. I can tell this will best a lot of cameras out there, but they really are shooting through the roof price wise, pun intended. Hope the MAP pricing will be in a range people can afford, for what you are really getting...


Where are you buying a IV for 4k? Sign me up!



Dec 23, 2011 at 11:42 PM
mark petri
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p.2 #14 · 1DX review by TDP


adrianb wrote:
I never shot with 1D series. I would really like to get my hands on some models (1Ds II, 1D II/N, 1D III) just for a few test shots to see the difference between crappy AF (5Dc/5DII) system and normal AF system.



In going back and forth between 5Dc - D series- and now a 5d2 - shooting with anything non-D drives me a little bonkers. Not in terms of IQ (my 5d2 more than holds it's own in that dept), but all the "other stuff"

Ya AF is an obvious one, but the build, feel, customization, speed... often times can't quantify it, but you get used to it and it's tough putting it in reverse after.






Dec 23, 2011 at 11:47 PM
Pixel Perfect
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p.2 #15 · 1DX review by TDP


RobertLynn wrote:
Be careful...if you say anything bad about the D.7K and D7K, you're obviously a Canon fanboy.


I'll give cudos where their due and while the D700/7000 are fine cameras, they don't possess magical properties as far as noise goes. What's more impressive for me is that the Sony NEX-7's 24MP sensor can match the D7000/7D for noise at high ISO. It's a bit more noisy at the pixel level, but when we equalize image sizes, they are all remarkably close. The Sony can show amazing detail a low ISO.



Dec 24, 2011 at 05:30 AM
Ralph Conway
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p.2 #16 · 1DX review by TDP


Are you a Sony fanboy now?


Dec 24, 2011 at 10:29 AM
campyone
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p.2 #17 · 1DX review by TDP


"I really don't think anybody really doubts that the 1DX will be an amazing camera...
Surely it will be superior to all Canon bodies, in pretty much every aspect (perhaps except the 3mp gap)"

Amazing? In some ways certainly. Superior? In what ways and for whom? When I look at what's happening to the prices of used 1Ds MarkIIIs since the 1Dx was announced it seems possible that many photographers think the 1Dx will be superior mainly for moving subjects and/or low light.



Dec 24, 2011 at 02:37 PM
Chris Ventura
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p.2 #18 · 1DX review by TDP


Far from fanboy Ralph :-) Point taken in regards to resizing images. Trust me, many lenses Canon has that I want :-) 135 F2 and 70-200 F4 being two of them. Oh, and 400mm 5.6. Nikon forgets not all of us have bags of money in the closet :-)

Ralph Conway wrote:
Last is my real life experience with 5D MK II and D700, too. I did the last wedding with both.
I can not compare D7000 with 7D - never worked with one of them.

And no (to Chris) I developed 1400 shots in ISO up to 6.400. 800 D700 and 600 5D IIs. I do not know where you found superior noise handling at the D700. They are near to equal in 100%. Beside the fact that 5D II offers 75% more pixels. Like PixelPerfect says: downscaled to 12MP the %D MK IIs images do both: show finer detail
...Show more



Dec 28, 2011 at 12:56 AM
Ralph Conway
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p.2 #19 · 1DX review by TDP


To keep that thread above. That does not seem to be very far from me, Chris.


Dec 28, 2011 at 09:26 PM
Tom Dix
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p.2 #20 · 1DX review by TDP


Interesting; taking a wait and see. Hoping it lives up to the hype.


Dec 29, 2011 at 05:21 AM
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