Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

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Archive 2011 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

skibum5
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p.4 #1 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

mpmendenhall wrote:
skibum5 wrote:
is that really pasadena?

I was wondering if anyone would notice

No, I'm out of town for research work --- the snow is in Los Alamos, NM, which has had several inches on the ground for the past couple weeks, and just got a new ~4" overnight.

Ah that makes sense. Cool, one of my friends just moved out there recently after getting a position at the lab and was commenting today on the giant snow flakes you just had out there (and I was a bit surprised to think the snow might have extended all the way out to Pasadena

despite the talk on the news about some giant snow storm in the SW).

And it sounds like the magic copy of lens is working out for you. Never hurts to see moire wide open

(I was

when I saw it even after tacking a TC on a 300 2.8 and shooting wide open f/4).

Dec 20, 2011 at 03:33 AM

RobertLynn
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p.4 #2 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

Forgive my ignorance, but I thought the anti aliasing filters worked to deal with moire?

Dec 20, 2011 at 04:04 AM

mpmendenhall
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p.4 #3 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

RobertLynn wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but I thought the anti aliasing filters worked to deal with moire?

The AA filter helps significantly compared to no AA filter, but in many cameras (including the 5D) is not strong enough to 100% prevent moiré. Since a stronger AA filter would make the images less sharp on the pixel level, Canon has probably chosen an AA filter blur that is sufficient when paired with the resolution of a "typical" lens (e.g. a mid-quality zoom), but not quite strong enough to handle exceptionally sharp optics in all cases.

Dec 20, 2011 at 05:21 AM

RobertLynn
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p.4 #4 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

mpmendenhall wrote:
RobertLynn wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but I thought the anti aliasing filters worked to deal with moire?

The AA filter helps significantly compared to no AA filter, but in many cameras (including the 5D) is not strong enough to 100% prevent moiré. Since a stronger AA filter would make the images less sharp on the pixel level, Canon has probably chosen an AA filter blur that is sufficient when paired with the resolution of a "typical" lens (e.g. a mid-quality zoom), but not quite strong enough to handle exceptionally sharp optics in all cases.
Even lenses like the 400 2.8 or the 135 or one of the tse or macro lenses?

I'm not trying to be picky but I thought these were excellent optics from canon?

Dec 20, 2011 at 06:09 AM

Lars Johnsson
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p.4 #5 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

RobertLynn wrote:
pingflood wrote:
Lars Johnsson wrote:
SKumar25 wrote:

RobertLynn wrote:

Like i said before, I think my frustration comes from my inability to shoot mf. No lens in my bag has a focus ring like a specific mf lens.

I just can't see the cost justification (ts e not withstanding) of the high price of these mf only lenses. I know the optics are excellent but it would seem that the costs should be lower out of production costs.

I don't belive the AF cost that much of the overall price of an lens. Remember how cheap some of the Canon AF lenses are.
And the build quality of the lens also cost some money. Remember the the build of the Zeiss ZE two 35mm lenses are way above the Canon 35L

Dec 20, 2011 at 06:15 AM

mpmendenhall
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p.4 #6 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

RobertLynn wrote:
Even lenses like the 400 2.8 or the 135 or one of the tse or macro lenses?

I'm not trying to be picky but I thought these were excellent optics from canon?

Yes, I would expect you should be able to induce moiré from lenses like these. Just about any half-decent prime should be able to produce mild but visible de-mosaicing artifacts at the image center when stopped down to f5.6-8. Stronger artifacts at wider apertures and all across the frame are indicators of higher optical quality. To look for this, shoot a test subject with high contrast details in a regular pattern with structures approximately 1 pixel wide when viewed in the final image.

Dec 20, 2011 at 06:18 AM

RobertLynn
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p.4 #7 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

mpmendenhall wrote:
RobertLynn wrote:
Even lenses like the 400 2.8 or the 135 or one of the tse or macro lenses?

I'm not trying to be picky but I thought these were excellent optics from canon?

Yes, I would expect you should be able to induce moiré from lenses like these. Just about any half-decent prime should be able to produce mild but visible de-mosaicing artifacts at the image center when stopped down to f5.6-8. Stronger artifacts at wider apertures and all across the frame are indicators of higher optical quality. To look for this, shoot a test subject with high contrast details in a regular pattern with structures approximately 1 pixel wide when viewed in the final image.

Thanks for this information. In a way I hope I forget it, that way I don't...if I can't reproduce it, I've got "junk" lenses, or if I can reproduce it, myc amera is junk. I've got a very flawed way of thinking at times lol.

In another way, it's really cool to learn new things. It's one of the reasons why I love this forums.

Dec 20, 2011 at 06:56 AM

StarNut
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p.4 #8 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

cputeq wrote:
RobertLynn wrote:
It is manual focus... Isn't it like 2011 now?

Shooting a nice manual focus lens is like driving a nice manual transmission car. You don't use it for the convenience but rather the experience of something different with a finely-crafted machine.

Different strokes.... I think paying a whole bunch of money for a manual focus (only) lens is like paying a whole bunch of money for a totally antiquated Morgan car. Nice car, but there are so many better ways, to me, to spend that much money on a nice car.

Dec 20, 2011 at 07:00 AM

mpmendenhall
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p.4 #9 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

Example of moiré artifacts using my $1 test target (note the "mazing" and red/blue coloration splotches produced from what should be a pure grayscale pattern).
ZE 35/2 wide open, 5D 100% crop, center frame, default Aperture RAW processing:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

I consider this rather impressive for an f2 lens, wide open; most lenses would need to be considerably more stopped down to do this. Even more impressive to me is similar performance in an extreme corner crop (still wide open):

This image is copyrighted by the owner

Dec 20, 2011 at 07:36 AM

Ralph Conway
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p.4 #10 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

RobertLynn wrote:
It is manual focus... Isn't it like 2011 now?

Yes. But some people who like to take pictures and do not trust AF still like to focus manual. Those lenses are not done for P&S but for view, decide what image component is worth and focus it.

Even it is 2011 I can imagine I would purchase and use a non AF body or lens. I would never use one that does not offer MF. I MF very often. Not because AF does not work. Just because of the fact that in 30-50 % no cameras AF system can know, what I would like to let it focus upon.

And in my opinion its still us, who do the picture, not any camera neither any AF system. It does not matter, how good it is. If I have time (e.g: portraits) I still love and prefere to focus manualy.

Dec 20, 2011 at 02:07 PM

Ralph Conway
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p.4 #11 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

Other viewpoint:
It is 2011 and I would expect the possibility in any todays DSLR to offer a VF screen, that enables one to use the full power of the body - even up to MF.

This is not the fact. One can forget all existing bodys except the 1s (I guess) that VF sreens are not exchangeable. Or even if you can forget most of the exchangeable ones.
To be able to focus manual with my 5D II I had to purchase an OEM viefinder first.

Ralph

Dec 20, 2011 at 02:14 PM

FlyPenFly
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p.4 #12 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

The world's most enduring images and the world's most expensive photographs were taken with MF lenses.

I have nothing against AF as I have several AF lenses. I'm just saying, when you don't want to sacrifice image quality and you're not a SPRAY AND PRAY kind of photographer, thoughtful methodical use of a MF lens with careful composition and honing your craft to perfection is what makes lasting images.

if you're just shooting weddings to pay the bills, i can understand why you might dismiss MF. I've always detested wedding photography for that reason, they just click away and position themselves not as photographers but like a wedding planner.

Dec 30, 2011 at 10:11 PM

StarNut
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p.4 #13 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

FlyPenFly wrote:
The world's most enduring images and the world's most expensive photographs were taken with MF lenses.

I have nothing against AF as I have several AF lenses. I'm just saying, when you don't want to sacrifice image quality and you're not a SPRAY AND PRAY kind of photographer, thoughtful methodical use of a MF lens with careful composition and honing your craft to perfection is what makes lasting images.

if you're just shooting weddings to pay the bills, i can understand why you might dismiss MF. I've always detested wedding photography for that reason, they just click away and position themselves not as photographers but like a wedding planner.

Wow. Obnoxious, supercilious, dismissive and self-important, all rolled up in one post.

Bravo!

Dec 30, 2011 at 10:39 PM

Gunzorro
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p.4 #14 · Crazy sharp Zeiss lens at LensRentals

Correction: The world's most enduring images were painted with a brush.

Throw away your silly MF camera and produce something truly awesome! True meticulous vituosity comes from the tips of your fingers, not some silly external lens.

If that still seems too modern, try Flintstones' tech.

(Couldn't resist -- Thanks Fly, and assist by StarNut)

Happy New Year!!

Dec 31, 2011 at 12:23 AM

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