I recently photographed a four day convention for a non profit company. Each day consisted of approximately 15-16 hour days. It was non stop with very little time for breaks or lunch. It was eat on the run.
When I negotiated for the job and submitted my proposal, not all of the working factors were disclosed in respect to actual requirements.
"Oh we want you to photograph the meetings and workshops".
I underbid the job not knowing ALL of the working conditions as this was my first convention ever photographed.
For those who do these types of jobs, how do you develop your proposal ? Charge strictly by the hour, 8 hour block, or ? It turned out to be a lot more work than I had anticipated. If I had to do it all over again I would have doubled my bid.
It sounds like a little bit more research, or questions asked, would have produced a more accurate quote for the job.
If told, "we want you to photograph the meetings and workshops", my first question would have been if that meant ALL the meetings/workshops. Then, I would have taken a look at the program and figured out how many hours per day that would require for shooting.
You also mention that the "working conditions" were not what you expected. What do you mean by that? Was there some other problem other than your under-estimation of the length of the day?
Being that this was the first time that I had ever done a job like this, I knew very little about what particular questions to ask. Working conditions in regard to no lunch breaks during a 16 hour period. We were given an agenda ONLY after we arrived. Prior to that, I was emailed ONLY the amount of hours we were needed daily, but not the particulars.
There were workshops, banquets and competitions all day long between two hotels and the convention center. THAT was not told to me. Only that the convention was at the convention center, not the two additional hotels. There was no way to ask about that fact.
But it was a learning experience. After talking to the AV guys I learned so much for the next job in what to bid and how to bid and what to require. And made great professional contacts with companies like Intel, 3M, Johnson & Johnson, IBM, DOW, GE, BP, General Dynamics, Boeing, etc etc.....
My "in" to getting referred for the job was the fact that I personally knew the head of the PR dept. who was in charge of hiring the photographer. She was the daughter of a close personal friend.
It was all good though. Next time I'll know how much to bid. Just wanted to see if other pros out there had done this type of work and how they bid on it.
Bid like any other job: By asking a lot of questions, drawing up a contract, agreeing to what the day is going to cost based on time, work, specifics-- with parts of the contract dictating what happens in the case of extra time needed per day (or additional days).
If you can't get a program ahead of time-- then you should have it really ironed out how your coverage and fees will reflect the actual conditions and hours you end up working. The contract can be as general as: $TK for a day rate of up to TK hours of shooting, with $TK for every additional hour. Or it can break down by location, types of shooting, etc.
The point is that you don't go in not knowing what you're shooting and how-- and if you're going in only partially knowing this information, you have it very clearly written into your contract how you're getting compensate for the likely scenarios.
That said, I'd tell a client this: "I'll be able to do my best work if I know exactly the sorts of shots/meetings/etc I'm looking at." And it would be true. Most clients are going to want to discuss with you about what they want out of the images, what the format of their event is, what things you can and cannot do and where you can and cannot do them (flash, shooting location, interacting with subjects, etc).
Not only does knowing this information help you accurately bid-- it helps you deliver the best possible results to your client. Don't skimp on the prep; there's as much to making your photography strong that happens before the event starts as there is in the couple of seconds surrounding the snapping of the shutter.
Interesting thread. A lady called me from a non-profit because a friend knew I was good and told her about me. She wanted me to shoot dogs with their owners at a local pet store in front of a painted backdrop with a Christmas theme. She was going to be Santa and she thought the pet owners could get prints right on the spot. After this job she was going to be calling for future projects. A friend has the perfect backdrop and I figured that I could rent it from him for the day. Another friend was willing to go to and fro to the local Sam's Club to make the prints. He gave me his price, I added mine and the backdrop rental. I figured she could pay for the prints. Right?
The more I thought about it, the less I liked this whole arrangement. I could not find their website. They could have just placed a jar at the pet store for donations like "save the greyhounds" did at a local Borders years ago and handed out pamphlets.
I told my friend with the backdrop to call her and give her his price. You can guess the rest. It had something to do with free work. He declined.
These threads are useful because it reminds us of what we are up against. I am not a non-profit. I get paid for my work. It costs thousands of dollars for me to shoot a job like this because of the gear I need to bring to it. I don't want you calling me requesting more "free work" even though I love dogs.
