p.1 #1 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
I am admittedly not that experienced in on camera lighting in different situations but recently I ran into a strange situation, I was photographing at an art gallery where the displays were shown on large white box's, and those box's bounced my flash as if it had been reduced to 1/4 power on all of the shots, plus the background lighting fell of drastically. What could I have done in this situation? besides not using flash, as my cameras sensor is not very effective in low light without it.
p.1 #2 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
Sounds like your flash was set to TTL and was fooled by all of the white. The addition of Flash Exposure Compensation (FEC) or a manual setting would have addressed this issue, but without seeing the scene, it's hard to say what that would have done to the actual subject you were attempting to capture.
p.1 #3 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
The reflectivity of that white reflected a strong amount of light (ABOVE AVERAGE) back to your flash ... telling it "Whoa, that's ENOUGH light" and to shut down.
The same can happen with glass, mirrors, chain link fences and other such high return objects. Your flash is programmed to ASSUME that the light being reflected back at it is coming from a scene with AVERAGE reflectivity.
The reverse happens when you take a picture with a dramatically BELOW AVERAGE reflectance and the flash again assumes it was coming from an AVERAGE reflective scene, so it signals "Max Power, Beam Me Up Scotty" and your subject gets blasted by more flash than it really needed.
as if it had been reduced to 1/4 power ... i.e. it was, just not by you. This is one area in particular where man can "out think" technology ... i.e. "man"ual control, or flash exp compensation adjustments are required.
p.1 #6 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
I prefer to shoot in Manual camera mode and flash mode. The Auto settings can go crazy with white or mirrors.When both are in auto you have no way to know which is adjusting for what condition and it is hard to learn what to modify. While white will require an adjustment( compared to a dark surface) because it does reflect it is still easy and fast to do when in Manual mode. Try this. Set flash to around 1/16 - 1/8 power. Set camera to around 400 ISO and F5 range.I use a mini box and angle away from subject so this setting might be bright for more direct flash approach. That is a good starting point. Adjust as required. The reason i am at 400 ISO is I want some ambiant light from the room in the shot and this seems to be a good balance for me. Aslo I am shooting a bit slower for that reason. Helps me get a natural non flash look 95% of the time. That other 5% stills seems to be out of my control. After you master this you will never use auto again
p.1 #7 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
Image1 wrote:
Yes you are right it was on TTL setting! ..so the solution is to switch to manual in these instances?
As others have said, either manual flash or use flash exposure compensation.
Depending on what model of flash you have, it may have an indicator of some kind that shows what the "correct" power setting will be at a given flash-to-subject distance, so all you need to do is measure the distance and set the flash accordingly.
Or you can just take several test shots and dial the power level or FEC amount until you get a proper reading on your histogram, and then use that setting for the rest of the shots. If it's done with manual flash you'll need to keep the same distance and the same aperture, but if it's done with FEC then you can vary the aperture (and, within a limited range, the distance) and the camera will compensate.
The fastest and easiest way, IMO, is to use a flash meter in incident mode. You would then be measuring the actual light from the flash at the point where it falls on the subject, and the meter would tell you the proper exposure settings for that light level.
p.1 #8 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
What body are you shooting? On the 1d3 there is a FEL button which I use when shooting flash. I set camera in manual, expose for the scene and then with metering in spot mode, you put your focal point on the subject and press the fel button and that locks flash exposure for the subject only. Works perfect.
p.1 #10 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
BrianO wrote:
Yep; and on xxD models the * button is the FEL.
Good news for the Op, it really works and from the description of the missed shots it would probably have worked wonders. It is also handy for back lit situations also. I find it most useful shooting candids at events, no more varying exposures from shot to shot. I love it.
p.1 #11 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
lwrnclightner wrote:
...[Flash Exposure Lock] is also handy for back lit situations also. I find it most useful shooting candids at events, no more varying exposures from shot to shot. I love it.
Yeah, I find that at weddings it's helpful to zoom in on the bride's or groom's face, centered in the VF, lock the flash exposure, and then zoom out and compose the shot. Even with a bride in white and a groom in black, with the subject(s) off center and a high-contrast background, this will usually give very good exposure with natural skin tones.
I wish I'd had it available 30 years ago when I was shooting weddings regularly.
p.1 #12 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
BrianO wrote:
Yeah, I find that at weddings it's helpful to zoom in on the bride's or groom's face, centered in the VF, lock the flash exposure, and then zoom out and compose the shot. Even with a bride in white and a groom in black, with the subject(s) off center and a high-contrast background, this will usually give very good exposure with natural skin tones.
I wish I'd had it available 30 years ago when I was shooting weddings regularly.
+1 - works a treat because speaking in zone terms, Caucasian skin is about zone 6 - 1 stop over middle gray which is what the metering is striving to give you. Darker skin tones just decrease exposure a stop. I've also used the brides dress and give exposure a +3 or so to plant it in zone 8 or 9. helps keep dress highlights from getting fried. Now if there were only a way to tame those little sequins and crystals...
p.1 #13 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
BubbaJon wrote:
+1 - works a treat because speaking in zone terms, Caucasian skin is about zone 6 - 1 stop over middle gray which is what the metering is striving to give you. Darker skin tones just decrease exposure a stop. I've also used the brides dress and give exposure a +3 or so to plant it in zone 8 or 9. helps keep dress highlights from getting fried. Now if there were only a way to tame those little sequins and crystals...
You are able to preserve detail in a white dress at 3 stops overexposed?
Sequins and crystals are going to give you specular reflections and you'll never get any detail out them, they are simply point sources of light when they are reflecting small light sources.
p.1 #14 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
alohadave wrote:
You are able to preserve detail in a white dress at 3 stops overexposed?
I think BubbaJon was saying that metering off the dress and acknowledging that as being a reference point that is appx 3 stops brighter than Zone System middle gray (for compensation usage) is an alternate strategy of getting an exposure that doesn't blow it out ... not to be confused with overexpose the scene by 3 stops and still hold the details.
Similar to metering off of snow vs. metering off of grass. If you (reflective) meter off the grass, you are in the neighborhood of what you're exposure meter is expecting. If you (reflective) meter off of snow, you know that it requires compensation to move it from gray to white.
p.1 #16 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
BubbaJon wrote:
...I've also used the brides dress [as a FEL target] and give exposure a +3 or so to plant it in zone 8 or 9. helps keep dress highlights from getting fried.
alohadave wrote:
You are able to preserve detail in a white dress at 3 stops overexposed?
Not three stops overexposed, but three stops over the metered reading. Remember that meters set exposure to middle gray -- they don't "know" the actual tone of what they're reading. So if you meter a gray object, the meter will lock in a setting that will render the gray object as gray. If you meter a white object, the meter will lock in a setting that would render the white object as gray, and so you need to increase exposure to bring it back up to white; in this case by dialing in +3 FEC.
That was why BubbaJon made reference to the Zone System. As you may know, Ansel Adams and Minor White standardized and taught a system of previsualizing a scene and knowing how to "place" a given tone into a desired level of exposure when using reflected meter readings; whether it's a landscape measured with a spot meter or a bridal gown measured with a camera's TTL meter, the prinicple is the same.
p.1 #17 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
Use manual control, much more consistant in a controlled situation.
TTL/ETTL is usefull when a situation is changing fast, otherwise manual all the way.
After learning this is much easier in post processing also.
p.1 #18 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
Image1John, second everything above but if you're still a bit unsure of shooting manual (which is really the best solution, practice gets you there or buy a meter and practice or shoot and practice ....) switch to External Metering Auto (custom function 05, set to 2 on a 580EXII) which lets the flash determine the exposure not the camera. You'll still need to dial in a bit of FEC to taste. Just a little more predictable.
I shoot manual but if I'm in a situation where the lighting is constantly changing and don't have time to think, I'll go AMO which lets the flash behave like your old school auto flash. Still sucks but not as sucky as ETTL.
p.1 #19 · Flash was killed off by large White Objects
Wow got busy for a few days and was not able to check my post it has certainly expanded, Thank you to everyone here for their advice I am now going to try out some of the methods you have all suggested, ...I can see that TTL flash is not always a reliable method. Thanks Again I appreciate all the help!
