carstenw wrote:
Well, I've changed my mind: you don't seem to be sold on any of the lenses, so I think you shouldn't buy an M9. You wouldn't be happy.
Well, you are correct that I have not seen any lenses that I've been completely sold on. Except for one - the 50/0.95 noctilux. But although I tend to be reckless with spending money on camera equipment, €8,000 for a single lens is too extreme. At half the price, I would not have hesitated but as it is it's simply too much.
It is also the reason why I have been unusually hesitant. Usually I'm a master of impulse buying, but not this time. The M9 falls into the "it would be nice to have" and not in my usual "I must have now" category where most of my lens purchases are. Still, I know myself well enough to know that I'll get it. I have to now or I'll be wondering about what I missed out on. I just need to make up my mind about the lenses.
By the way, do you guys know if Leica will calibrate non-Leica lenses?
Luka, Leica will not calibrate non-Leica lenses, but there are plenty of folks who will. I would be surprised if there wasn't someone in Stockholm who could do it.
Thank you Rod, H00ligan! Appreciate all the comments
Recalibration of lenses as Jeff is suggesting is very straight forward, and in my case done by a certified Leica repairer that does all camer gear. In my discussion, I wish I knew them when I had numberous problems with the Canon 50/1.2 L.
Luka, you are right about being hestitant I was extremely hesitant myself, and yes rightly so. It is an expensive camera. I have never been caught up with brand names, just the rendering and IQ that gives me pleasure to work with. I never seriously considered buying a Leica or the lenses, as I thought it was over priced.
It was only since I explored the ZE range of lenses with the 5DII, that really opened my eyes to what better IQ was available and blown away just how much better images could be.
I have explored all the other alternatives, Oly and Pana. m43's, Canon's G series as alternative to taking my DSLR. All have been very good, but I have been dissapointed... maybe expecting too much. With recent release of the NEX 3 and 5 they seemed excellent but lacking FF, and really when combined with adapter and a better quality lens, the form factor and useability it lacking IMO. Maybe when the NEX 7, FF may combine with my existing lenses.
In my very recent experience, and there are so many more great photographers here with a lot more experience than myself, I can say the M9 works brilliantly for me. I never thought it would as I had in the back of mind what it cannot do, rather than what it does very well. It is really a photographer's camera.
Just thought I would share some thoughts, as my comparison is based on my last trip to Thailand taking the ZE's and the 5DII. Now having the M9 with 50 Lux, there is no comparison for me. I have the ability to take the M9 every where with me, and kind of looks retro. If there was another similar sized camera and form factor with the brilliant IQ, yes I would always consider it, though it would need to have the ability to adapt the 50 Lux on it
jhapeman wrote:
Luka, Leica will not calibrate non-Leica lenses, but there are plenty of folks who will. I would be surprised if there wasn't someone in Stockholm who could do it.
I suppose there should be someone. I checked Leica's web site and while there are plenty of official resellers here, the closest authorized repair shop is in Denmark. When it comes to photography I get increasingly a feeling that I live in a third world country For instance Hasselblad (a Swedish company) only had one reseller in Sweden before that reseller recently went belly up - so we're down to a grand total of zero.
charles.K wrote:
Thank you Rod, H00ligan! Appreciate all the comments
Recalibration of lenses as Jeff is suggesting is very straight forward, and in my case done by a certified Leica repairer that does all camer gear. In my discussion, I wish I knew them when I had numberous problems with the Canon 50/1.2 L.
Luka, you are right about being hestitant I was extremely hesitant myself, and yes rightly so. It is an expensive camera. I have never been caught up with brand names, just the rendering and IQ that gives me pleasure to work with. I never seriously considered buying a Leica or the lenses, as I thought it was over priced.
It was only since I explored the ZE range of lenses with the 5DII, that really opened my eyes to what better IQ was available and blown away just how much better images could be.
I have explored all the other alternatives, Oly and Pana. m43's, Canon's G series as alternative to taking my DSLR. All have been very good, but I have been dissapointed... maybe expecting too much. With recent release of the NEX 3 and 5 they seemed excellent but lacking FF, and really when combined with adapter and a better quality lens, the form factor and useability it lacking IMO. Maybe when the NEX 7, FF may combine with my existing lenses.
In my very recent experience, and there are so many more great photographers here with a lot more experience than myself, I can say the M9 works brilliantly for me. I never thought it would as I had in the back of mind what it cannot do, rather than what it does very well. It is really a photographer's camera.
Just thought I would share some thoughts, as my comparison is based on my last trip to Thailand taking the ZE's and the 5DII. Now having the M9 with 50 Lux, there is no comparison for me. I have the ability to take the M9 every where with me, and kind of looks retro. If there was another similar sized camera and form factor with the brilliant IQ, yes I would always consider it, though it would need to have the ability to adapt the 50 Lux on it ...Show more →
Thanks for sharing your thoughts Charles, much appreciated
zombii wrote:
Joakim, On the first shot, I like the color version better. On the second, I like both. Both nice but the second is my favorite. The B&W version looks more snowy but the color gives that sense of autumn transitioning to winter feeling.
Adam, I forgot to comment on your image. That VW really pops! Are the speckles in the lower right hand corner the noise you're talking about or is that just pavement texture? It's hard to tell at this size.
Thanks for the comment. No I think that's just the pavement texture.. What I'm talking about is something that bothers me less and less each day. I guess I was initially shocked, because I've only really looked at websized photos from the M9 and everyone always went on about how the ISO is so much more improved over the M8. Thought it really doesn't seem that way to me. And honestly my 5DII produces a much cleaner file all the way though the ISO range. It's fine if people don't want to agree... Again though, it bothers me less and less each day, I think I'm getting use to the noise and just trying to have fun with the camera.
And thank you everyone else for the comments...
BTW since I know you'll ask. Here is a 100% crop at ISO 200, I tried to capture a section of the file where you see many colors and different brightnesses:
I think most of us that come from a 5DII would find this a bit shocking considering the price tag you expect more initially.. But again, I'm getting use to the quirks of the M9 (poor LCD, very slow at getting it all started up, slow processing) but ultimately a really different experience then my work cameras, which is where I'm starting to sort of see the value of Leica (though I'm still on the fence).
denoir wrote:
Nice shots Joakim! I prefer the B/W images although I would have perhaps liked a bit more contrast.
I've been busy the past week with work stuff but I had time to think a bit about the M9 today. I was in a camera store and asked if they by any chance had a 50 lux asph in stock. They laughed and said that the waiting time was about 6 months. No online retailer in Sweden has them in store nor have I been able to find any online retailers in EU that ship to Sweden that have it in store. In the camera shop they told me that Leica had a massive problem with lens supply as all their production capacity was currently allocated for producing cameras - the M9 has been a far greater success than they expected.
Anyway, this complicates things for me. I had made up my mind about the 50 lux asph which would form my kit together with a Zeiss 25/2.8 and Zeiss 35/2. As I can't get it, I've got a 50mm problem - plus I've started having second thoughts about the Zeiss 35/2.
So as it looks now:
25mm: Zeiss 25/2.8 - set. No problems there.
35mm: 35/2 Biogon or 35/2 cron. I was originally thinking Biogon but as much as I like Zeiss after seeing some comparison shots I'm not sure what to think. The Zeiss has IMO a nicer rendering but the cron blows it away when it comes to sharpness and contrast.
50mm: Here it gets difficult. I'd prefer the 50 summilux asph but apparently I'm not going to be able to lay my hands on one any time soon.
That leaves me with the following choices: Zeiss 50/1.5, Zeiss 50/2 and 50 cron. The 50/1.5 seems to be a nice portrait lens, but I dislike the idea of having to recalibrate it the first thing I do. It's also not very sharp wide open. The Zeiss 50/2 seems to be an excellent lens but is just an f/2. The 50/2 cron is also an option - I have been pleasantly surprised by its rendering style.
So what do I do? Do I go completely Zeiss? Which 50 do I pick then - f/1.5 or f/2? Do I go with two Zeiss lenses and one Leica? In that case, which Leica - the 35 or 50 cron? I could of course wait for the 50 lux to be restocked but I don't really feel like waiting. And although it's not absolutely necessary, I would not mind having at least one high quality Leica lens - just to see what all the fuss is about.
I'm not much of a portrait shooter but I primarily like landscape and nature photography. I really like the Zeiss rendering style and I love interesting and lively bokeh. I often do wide aperture landscape photography and shoot wide open most of the time.
I've got the best solution for you..... GET A NOCTILUX .95!!!!!
Seriously, it's more readily available then the 50LUX, and knowing you, I think you'll like the uniqueness of the lens. Neat for landscapes, great for portraits, and fantastic as a walkaround.. And you're use to the weight of all the ZE glass
charles.K wrote:
Thank you Luka and Ryan!
Yes the Lux is an easy lens to keep on the camera
Charles, amazing shots... You are making a very solid argument for the 50 Lux ASPH.. If I could find one locally at a good price, I'd consider it.
Your album growing? I'm gonna go take another look see.
denoir wrote:
Well, you are correct that I have not seen any lenses that I've been completely sold on. Except for one - the 50/0.95 noctilux. But although I tend to be reckless with spending money on camera equipment, €8,000 for a single lens is too extreme. At half the price, I would not have hesitated but as it is it's simply too much.
It is also the reason why I have been unusually hesitant. Usually I'm a master of impulse buying, but not this time. The M9 falls into the "it would be nice to have" and not in my usual "I must have now" category where most of my lens purchases are. Still, I know myself well enough to know that I'll get it. I have to now or I'll be wondering about what I missed out on. I just need to make up my mind about the lenses.
By the way, do you guys know if Leica will calibrate non-Leica lenses?...Show more →
Crap, sorry just read this... Well I still think you should go for the Noctilux .95
denoir wrote:
Well, you are correct that I have not seen any lenses that I've been completely sold on. Except for one - the 50/0.95 noctilux.
I haven't tried this lens, but from everything I have heard, it is essentially as good as, and very similar to, the 50 Lux ASPH, from 1.4 and down. The uniqueness would be just at f/0.95... I think I prefer the older Noctilux for its unique rendering.
Adam: I thought I'd leave it to you to get and test it first
Carsten: Yes it's at f/0.95 that it's interesting. The old nocti is nice as well as far as rendering goes. In the reasonably sized and priced lenses the one I'm most attracted to is the 50/1.5 Sonnar. I know there are focus shift and calibration issues but I really like the rendering style.
At f/1.4 and up, the new Nocti has stunning sharpness and contrast. Sean Reid's recent review shows that well. That said, it's not a lens you buy to shoot at anything but f/0.95, unless it's your only 50.
I think most of us that come from a 5DII would find this a bit shocking considering the price tag you expect more initially.. But again, I'm getting use to the quirks of the M9 (poor LCD, very slow at getting it all started up, slow processing) but ultimately a really different experience then my work cameras, which is where I'm starting to sort of see the value of Leica (though I'm still on the fence). ...Show more →
That's way more chroma noise than I am seeing. What raw converter are you using?
That's a ton more noise than I see even in 4min exposures! (max on m9).
Why shoot at iso200 though? It's likely pushed 160, try and stick to whole-stop increments from base-iso, which is the general best practice with digital. Canon may have in between isos better managed. Make sure exposure comp is set to 0 as well!
Wait, the M9 is 80 160 200 250 400 500 640 800 1250 1600 2000 2500 isn't it?
So what are the whole stop increments from base iso? Base iso is 160 BTW.
If I shoot straight out of camera JPGs that's what I get, if I shoot DNG Uncompressed and convert using Lightroom that's what I get. Lightroom is what was supplied with the M9 so it should be the one to use right?
BTW, I have a question about lightroom.. When I'm using the 50 MP ZE, it shows up in the list of lenses by Zeiss to correct for, along with all the other ZE lenses that is made by Zeiss. The second I click on a 35 ZE image to correct it though, Zeiss totally disappears from the menu of lens corrections. And all other lenses seem to disappear as well, except for the 50 and 100. Leica never even shows up, wouldn't Leica M9's and lenses be in the correction list, considering lightroom is partnering up with Leica?
EDIT: missed writing 250, 500, 1000
Oh and would you think that base iso is 160, 320, 640, 1250, 2500 for the M9 are those the isos I should stick with? This Swedish guy on his blog suggests 200 and 800
For instance Hasselblad (a Swedish company) only had one reseller in Sweden before that reseller recently went belly up - so we're down to a grand total of zero.
No online retailer in Sweden has them in store nor have I been able to find any online retailers in EU that ship to Sweden that have it