...it seems like Micro 4/3rds is the ultimate mount for those who want to use a wide range of lenses. The format provides for the widest range of "compatibility" with other lens mounts - including C Mount, which IIRC not even the Leica M Mount is compatible with. It's kind of curious that you don't see a lot more excitement over the mount here.
Is it the crop factor? Lack of all-weather bodies?
I think there's a lot of excitement here about mFT, and there are many active and recent threads on related issues. In fact, there's been so much discussion since the E-P1 was introduced that we're probably just taking a short break.
A quick search for "E-P1" produces 37 threads; "GF1" 15; and, "micro" 39. There's certainly overlap between these threads. There's been a lot of discussion, and I'm sure there will be a lot more.
Ya, the 2x crop factor means that pretty much any alternative lens solution will not give one anything much wider than a normal focal length lens. Who wants to use their 18-24mm ff lens just to end up with a normal lens when used on M4/3rds? The more densely packed sensor of 4/3rds also means that any lens designed for FF will have to be of pretty high resolving power and also have superior freedom from lens aberrations to offer the quality needed. For these reasons, I actually see 4/3rds as one of the worst platforms for alternatives.
Sam Bennett wrote:
Is it the crop factor? Lack of all-weather bodies?
I used the Panasonic G-1 as my main camera for months. I really wanted to like it, and for some parts also did so.
In the end the small sensor made me feel trapped. For some applications there is simply too much noise. Then there are no native fast lenses. With fast I mean lenses allowing for shallow DOF and/or low noise.
The camera was great for manual focusing and the mount was versatile. I'm sure there some day will be a more complete system around the µ4/3 cameras including nifty fast lenses and T/S stuff and working flashes and... Then I'll be back.
The size of the cameras isn't that interesting; I still needed a bag for my daily casual shooting. The 5D fits the same satchel bag, not much to win there. less weight to carry is a plus. A Panasonic Leica Summilux-D 25/1.4 (noise and DOF wise being equal to a 50/2.8) having the same size and weight but double the price, and worse performance, than the Sigma 50/1.4 is boring.
I can't say there's a lack of excitement here, it's probably the #2 subject in here after adapting MF lenses to Canon.
Personally, the G1's been a huge win for me. The small size/weight and ability to manually focus easily in low light via the EVF are a godsend for everyday carry (I'm carrying a bag full of stuff, so a 5D sized camera is right out. Tried that for 5 months with the D300, ended up leaving it at home more often than not. And the G1 beats the D40 I did carry hands-down for real-world use).
The biggest problem with m43 has been fast normal/wide lenses and wide lenses in general. I've ended up settling for now on the M.Zuiko 17 and either the Nikkor 5cm f1.4, the CV Ultron 40/2 or the CV Nokton 58/1.4 as my carry kit. I'll end up replacing the 17 with the Panny 20 and 14 as they arrive and I have the cash. I would really like to see a native fast lens in the 35-50mm range as well, AF has its uses and face detection suits a lot of my general day-to-day shooting well (lots of bar shooting with friends)
I agree with Jonas, partly. I also wanted to really like the G1, but the crop kills it for me. My shooting range is between 20 and 40 with the occasional 85 in there, which severely limits the choice of fast glass.
I bought the G1 specifically for a trip and used it solely while there. The results, even though they come out good on screen, do not hold up that well in print. For me, the m4/3 is looking as the "real" alternative to the LX3 and G10 more than a DSLR, and for that it will have to be smaller than the G1. Maybe the GF1...I like the idea of a smaller but capable camera, just as Mawz mentioned.
For a lot of the people here mFT does fit into a second system sort of area. I tried an E-P1, and while it was interesting, the lack of an optical viewfinder killed it for me. I'm not even sure an EVF would be good enough. As for alternative lenses, for me it is a complete non-starter. The lack of anything remotely resembling wide (less than 28mm equivalent) is the biggest drawback. Then most of the alt lenses are large enough to make the mFT advantage nil. It still might find it's way into being a always-carry camera for me, but it's not there yet.
Generally speaking, IMO, there are (over the time) more people using DSLRs to attach alt lenses than mFT mount cameras. Time will tell if this mount will be more used than, say, Canon crops or FFs. For now, for me at least, the answer is no.
I'm excited.. to the point of unexcitement because Panasonic is being so random with their stock. It's amazingly still in stock on their site, but I don't want to deal with the tax.
so waiting and seeing how long it takes for amazon to ship. but if I don't get it within a couple of weeks, I'm going to have to push it off until later. My EVF shipped, and I want to be able to still return it if it doesn't work for me.
Sam Bennett wrote:
I guess that's where I may differ - I never saw the GF1 as a potential replacement for my D700, just my D50.
But I'm glad to hear maybe I was off a bit. Just didn't seem like there was much buzz here around the GF1 and the 20mm.
The G1 was not a replacement for my D700 either Sam, I sold the NIKON on grounds I did not like it on its own right. The D700 is a brick compared to what I would like to carry.
One day, the technology will advance to the point where it can offer what we used to carry 30 years ago: a full frame SLR the size of the F2!
dasrocket wrote:
One day, the technology will advance to the point where it can offer what we used to carry 30 years ago: a full frame SLR the size of the F2!
I read this and had to laugh because the F2 I carried around had a huge MD-2 drive attached to it and weighed a ton. My Sony a900 is a much lighter, smaller rig and also gives me 5fps if needed. Heck, the Sony is even lighter than the Canon T-90 I also once used.
I'm excited about m4/3 until I go into the shop and hold it in my hand and look at the results, at which point I realise that (1) the cameras aren't small enough to compete with genuinely pocketable cameras, (2) the sensor is too small to compete with entry level DSLR's, and (3) all my small wideangles will be teles, with most of their image circle wasted and a lot of pressure on centre performance with all those pixels.
Don't get me wrong, the GF1/20mm has got me very close to pulling the trigger, but price, size and quality are still holding me back. It will get cheaper and I may succomb.
But I'm not an alternative lenses kind of guy. I'll probably stick to MFT lenses. I'm loving my EP-1. I have 5 DSLRs and bags of lenses, but the EP-1 is my "walk around" camera. It's what I've been looking for in a compact. Good quality, HD video. All in a small package that goes easily in my backpack (The EP-1 is not too small for me, I've never carried a camera in my pocket). I have a G10, which I like for the size and beautiful control layout, but it's useless above 200 ISO. The EP-1 makes great prints at 400 ISO and decent ones at 800.
I was never expecting DSLR image quality form the EP-1. If I need that I'll just use a DSLR. What I wanted was a good quality camera to carry around when I'm out with the family or trekking around with non-photographer friends. It's the camera that allows me to get the shot because I always have it with me. I'm playing around with panos and stitching at the moment and having a great time. And a 20mm 1.7 is next on the wish list.
I heard all the concerns about 2x crop, lack of VF, IQ, body size and so on, but decided to try the E-P1. I can honestly say that in the month I've had it I've hardly touched my 5DII. I like the quality of the jpgs, the size of the body, the IBIS is great with adapted lenses, and I've seldom missed the VF. It's not the ultimate camera, but it's sure a lot of fun to use.
I just got a GF1/20 kit. It is quite nice. One should not expect it to replace their main DSLRs in low light, fast action, but in general photography it is great. The 20 works out to 40 mm with the crop which I find to be a useful focal length. The GF1/20 will not replacement my 5DMK2 or 1DMK2 when I need ultimate quality or speed, but as a carry everywhere camera it's a winner.
Count me in as another person who is quite excited about the MFT movement (if you can call it that). I am a wedding photographer who shoots with D3's and very heavy Nikon lenses (14-24/2.8, 24-70/2.8, 70-200/2.8, 28/1.4, 85/1.4, 200/2). So when I first heard that I could potentially get decent image quality in a lightweight kit, especially for traveling (I am tired of schlepping my Nikon gear overseas on personal trips), I was quite excited at the prospect.
I have been looking for the perfect travel camera for some time now - I had a Fuji F30 and Canon G10 - very good compact cameras, but they always fell short with regard to image quality (they were reasonably good at low ISO) and I also missed the functionality of my SLRs when using these P&S cameras.
I just picked up the GF1 and 20/1.7 pancake ... I can't remember the last time I had so much fun playing with a new camera. It reminds me of when I got my first (film) SLR over 30 years ago and a fast 50mm lens. That's all I used to shoot with for a few years (until I could afford a couple more primes) and I loved it. I feel like the GF1 (and the pancake lens) is helping me "rediscover" photography again. It is so liberating working with such a compact, functional and quasi-minimalist camera (especially since the 20/1.7 is the only MFT lens I currently own).
I am really, really impressed with how the GF1/20mm combo performs. No - it won't replace my D3's for work ... they are in a class of their own, image quality (and handling) wise. However, for the size of the GF1/20mm package, the image quality is very, very good. I am also impressed by how the GF1 handles.
I applaud Panasonic and Olympus for their foray into the MFT market. I think it was a ballsy move and they've successfully targeted a niche area between the compact and DSLR markets. I do believe that they will be very successful with this system. As much as I love my Nikons (and Canon is very good too), I really want someone else to give them a run for their money. I really want a MFT player to be the #3 (or even top 1 or 2) camera player in the market.
I look forward to seeing more lenses (especially the Panny 14mm pancake and the new 45mm Leica/Panny Macro coming out) and seeing this system expand. I have to believe it will only get better over time - with regard to selection of lenses, improvements in camera functionality and image quality.
