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Archive 2009Canon EOS 7D Master thread
p.58 #1Canon EOS 7D Master thread
I don't know what you've been drinking lately 
jorkata wrote:
The 5D is the holy grail of IQ 
.
No other camera has received so much praise for its IQ as the 5D - not even the 5DII and the 1DsIII.
And here's a thought, btw:
The 5D had 'only' 12mp and yet it was universally liked.
But 12mp on 1.6x crop is not enoght - they just had to go 18mp
.
jorkata wrote:
rd4tile wrote
Seems like I remember similar comments about image quality when the 5D was introduced, now it's the holy grail of IQ? . No other camera has received so much praise for its IQ as the 5D - not even the 5DII and the 1DsIII.
And here's a thought, btw:
The 5D had 'only' 12mp and yet it was universally liked.
But 12mp on 1.6x crop is not enoght - they just had to go 18mp
. Sep 17, 2009 at 06:08 PM
brainiac
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p.58 #2Canon EOS 7D Master thread
jorkata wrote:
But 12mp on 1.6x crop is not enoght - they just had to go 18mp .
http://cyberphotographer.com/megapixelmyth
But 12mp on 1.6x crop is not enoght - they just had to go 18mp
.http://cyberphotographer.com/megapixelmyth
Sep 17, 2009 at 06:35 PM
p.58 #3Canon EOS 7D Master thread
jorkata wrote:
the 5DII and the 1DsIII.
And here's a thought, btw:
The 5D had 'only' 12mp and yet it was universally liked.
But 12mp on 1.6x crop is not enoght - they just had to go 18mp .
You defintely don't know what your talking about or your looking at samples other than just about everyone else on this forum.
If you think the 7D has noise characteristics similiar to the 40D then you haven't looked at any credible samples. If you want a 12MP camera Nikon makes several of them in FF and crop. You sound like a Nikon troll, are you?
Jim
the 5DII and the 1DsIII.
And here's a thought, btw:
The 5D had 'only' 12mp and yet it was universally liked.
But 12mp on 1.6x crop is not enoght - they just had to go 18mp
. You defintely don't know what your talking about or your looking at samples other than just about everyone else on this forum.
If you think the 7D has noise characteristics similiar to the 40D then you haven't looked at any credible samples. If you want a 12MP camera Nikon makes several of them in FF and crop. You sound like a Nikon troll, are you?
Jim
Sep 17, 2009 at 06:54 PM
p.58 #4Canon EOS 7D Master thread
jorkata:
Initial samples are showing that the 7D has about the same ISO/noise as the 40D.
Initial tests are showing that 7D has about the same S/N as 5D, not 40D. This is the point I have been trying to make.
Edited on Sep 17, 2009 at 08:20 PM · View previous versions
Initial samples are showing that the 7D has about the same ISO/noise as the 40D.
Initial tests are showing that 7D has about the same S/N as 5D, not 40D. This is the point I have been trying to make.
Edited on Sep 17, 2009 at 08:20 PM · View previous versions
Sep 17, 2009 at 07:04 PM
p.58 #5Canon EOS 7D Master thread
mfurman wrote:
Initial samples are showing that the 7D has about the same ISO/noise as the 40D.Initial tests are showing that 7D is about the same S/N as 5D, not 40D. This is the point I have been trying to make.
And it won't matter, because somewhere in the next hour someone who hasn't read any part of this thread will post that RG's crappy 100% crops prove that the 10d had better high ISO performance.
Earlier quote
jorkata:Initial samples are showing that the 7D has about the same ISO/noise as the 40D.
And it won't matter, because somewhere in the next hour someone who hasn't read any part of this thread will post that RG's crappy 100% crops prove that the 10d had better high ISO performance.
Sep 17, 2009 at 08:13 PM
p.58 #6Canon EOS 7D Master thread
I'm convinced the whole key to this body's success is the AF system, will it clearly outperform the current non 1 series bodies and get us closer to 1 series AF?
I'm satisfied Canon has a good sensor in it. I'm excited that this might be the first 1.6X body that I'll really like.
I'm satisfied Canon has a good sensor in it. I'm excited that this might be the first 1.6X body that I'll really like.
Sep 17, 2009 at 08:25 PM
p.58 #7Canon EOS 7D Master thread
rd4tile wrote:
I'm convinced the whole key to this body's success is the AF system, will it clearly outperform the current non 1 series bodies and get us closer to 1 series AF?
I'm satisfied Canon has a good sensor in it. I'm excited that this might be the first 1.6X body that I'll really like.
I agree.
After downloading some IR RAW files and looking at them with the latest camera RAW I was quite impressed especially with the higher ISO shots...
I think the AF should be quite good also but I thought my 40D did a fairly good job in this aspect of the camera when compared with the mkIIn.
I think I'll be quite happy with the 7D.
I'm convinced the whole key to this body's success is the AF system, will it clearly outperform the current non 1 series bodies and get us closer to 1 series AF?
I'm satisfied Canon has a good sensor in it. I'm excited that this might be the first 1.6X body that I'll really like.
I agree.
After downloading some IR RAW files and looking at them with the latest camera RAW I was quite impressed especially with the higher ISO shots...
I think the AF should be quite good also but I thought my 40D did a fairly good job in this aspect of the camera when compared with the mkIIn.
I think I'll be quite happy with the 7D.
Sep 17, 2009 at 08:34 PM
p.58 #8Canon EOS 7D Master thread
brainiac wrote:
.http://cyberphotographer.com/megapixelmyth
Thanks for sharing this link. It's nice to have a comprehensive write up of this. Now, everyone send it to 5 friends.
jorkata wrote
But 12mp on 1.6x crop is not enoght - they just had to go 18mp .Thanks for sharing this link. It's nice to have a comprehensive write up of this. Now, everyone send it to 5 friends.
Sep 17, 2009 at 10:50 PM
p.58 #9Canon EOS 7D Master thread
jorkata wrote:
Initial samples are showing that the 7D has about the same ISO/noise as the 40D.
About the same but not better. That's the key.
I'm questioning your judgement if you think the 7D is running even with the 40D. There are clear differences evident in the samples presented in this thread and others.
Initial samples are showing that the 7D has about the same ISO/noise as the 40D.
About the same but not better. That's the key.
I'm questioning your judgement if you think the 7D is running even with the 40D. There are clear differences evident in the samples presented in this thread and others.
Sep 17, 2009 at 10:52 PM
p.58 #10Canon EOS 7D Master thread
all I care about the 7D:
1. clean ISO 100-6400(it should be able to do a 20x30@6400)
2. A/F closer in speed/accuracy of a 1 Series camera
but people want it to be a 1 series which it is not..but is a leap above the 50d which by all counts is a good thing,you know if there was to be a 3D it most likely
be a FF version of the 7D..if Canon is listening this would fill the gap.
1. clean ISO 100-6400(it should be able to do a 20x30@6400)
2. A/F closer in speed/accuracy of a 1 Series camera
but people want it to be a 1 series which it is not..but is a leap above the 50d which by all counts is a good thing,you know if there was to be a 3D it most likely
be a FF version of the 7D..if Canon is listening this would fill the gap.
Sep 17, 2009 at 11:10 PM
p.58 #11Canon EOS 7D Master thread
fraga wrote:
Exactly.
Make the 3d more expensive than the 5dMII (obviously) and leave the bigger, bulkier bodie do the 1DMIV (with grip included) as well as way better weather sealing, dual cards, better batery, +2 or 3 fps, more and better AF points with AF up to f8, larger buffer, longer life shutter, and some other tweaks and features like spot metering on every focus point, interchangable focusing screen, etc.
Make the 3d for $3300 - $3600, and pleople (specially pros) will still go for a $4300-$4500 1DMIV.
But what do I know, I can be completly wrong...
i hope you are completely right
Exactly.
Make the 3d more expensive than the 5dMII (obviously) and leave the bigger, bulkier bodie do the 1DMIV (with grip included) as well as way better weather sealing, dual cards, better batery, +2 or 3 fps, more and better AF points with AF up to f8, larger buffer, longer life shutter, and some other tweaks and features like spot metering on every focus point, interchangable focusing screen, etc.
Make the 3d for $3300 - $3600, and pleople (specially pros) will still go for a $4300-$4500 1DMIV.
But what do I know, I can be completly wrong...
i hope you are completely right
Sep 17, 2009 at 11:54 PM
p.58 #12Canon EOS 7D Master thread
mfurman wrote:
Can we get back to the topic: "Is IQ of 7D almost as good as 5D's?", please?
comparing DxO DR measurements to what I got from IR samples it seems like the DR is a bit better at the lowest ISO or two for the 7D and almost identical to the 7D at higher ISO if the 7D rates ISOs like the 50D (if it rates them like the 5D2 did then the 5D will still have a little bit better DR at higher ISO but not by a huge amount and the lower 7D banding would probably make the 7D at least as good effectively).
that said in terms of SNR at 18% it is hard to imagine the 7D doing as well it simply has such a hugely smaller light collecting area.
Can we get back to the topic: "Is IQ of 7D almost as good as 5D's?", please?
comparing DxO DR measurements to what I got from IR samples it seems like the DR is a bit better at the lowest ISO or two for the 7D and almost identical to the 7D at higher ISO if the 7D rates ISOs like the 50D (if it rates them like the 5D2 did then the 5D will still have a little bit better DR at higher ISO but not by a huge amount and the lower 7D banding would probably make the 7D at least as good effectively).
that said in terms of SNR at 18% it is hard to imagine the 7D doing as well it simply has such a hugely smaller light collecting area.
Sep 17, 2009 at 11:59 PM
p.58 #13Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Yohan Pamudji wrote:
I think the 7D, far from completing the lineup, is actually the strongest indication that we will finally see an "affordable" full frame with better-than-xxD features, a.k.a. the 3D.
The 5DII is the affordable full frame.
At least here in the UK, where its currently costs less to buy a 5DII body only than pre order the Sony 850.
A 3D will, by definition of Canons heirarchical pricing policy, be more expensive than a 5D, not less, regardless of anything else.
IF Canon are to introduce a FF version f the 7D, it will be a minimum twelve months away (to allow the 7D to maximise its sales and give breathing room for 1D introductions) , AND it will be significantly more expensive than current FF offerings.
That could be done by either selling it at a higher price point than the 5D currently occupies, OR lowering the 5DII price (as naturally happens over time anyway)and introducing the new camera at the $3k pricepoint.
Its difficult to judge these things because the US prices and the UK (and the rest of Europe infact) seem considerably out of alignment currently, as highlighted by the above mentioned 5DII/Sony 850 situation.
I think the 7D, far from completing the lineup, is actually the strongest indication that we will finally see an "affordable" full frame with better-than-xxD features, a.k.a. the 3D.
The 5DII is the affordable full frame.
At least here in the UK, where its currently costs less to buy a 5DII body only than pre order the Sony 850.
A 3D will, by definition of Canons heirarchical pricing policy, be more expensive than a 5D, not less, regardless of anything else.
IF Canon are to introduce a FF version f the 7D, it will be a minimum twelve months away (to allow the 7D to maximise its sales and give breathing room for 1D introductions) , AND it will be significantly more expensive than current FF offerings.
That could be done by either selling it at a higher price point than the 5D currently occupies, OR lowering the 5DII price (as naturally happens over time anyway)and introducing the new camera at the $3k pricepoint.
Its difficult to judge these things because the US prices and the UK (and the rest of Europe infact) seem considerably out of alignment currently, as highlighted by the above mentioned 5DII/Sony 850 situation.
Sep 18, 2009 at 02:23 AM
p.58 #14Canon EOS 7D Master thread
rd4tile wrote:
I'm convinced the whole key to this body's success is the AF system, will it clearly outperform the current non 1 series bodies and get us closer to 1 series AF?
I'm satisfied Canon has a good sensor in it. I'm excited that this might be the first 1.6X body that I'll really like.
+1
I'm convinced the whole key to this body's success is the AF system, will it clearly outperform the current non 1 series bodies and get us closer to 1 series AF?
I'm satisfied Canon has a good sensor in it. I'm excited that this might be the first 1.6X body that I'll really like.
+1
Sep 18, 2009 at 04:55 AM
p.58 #15Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Ok, let's admit it... For many of us who have already pre-ordered the 7D, we're suffering from excessive wanderlust with just too much time on our hands. We want this camera. Now!
Hurry up already, Canon!
Hurry up already, Canon!
Sep 18, 2009 at 06:25 AM
p.58 #16Canon EOS 7D Master thread
cameron12x wrote:
Ok, let's admit it... For many of us who have already pre-ordered the 7D, we're suffering from excessive wanderlust with just too much time on our hands. We want this camera. Now!
Hurry up already, Canon!
I freely admit to that. I can't wait to slap the 400 f5.6 on, go on my back deck and shoot away, that's my version of therapy!
I hope those AF zones work as advertised!
Ok, let's admit it... For many of us who have already pre-ordered the 7D, we're suffering from excessive wanderlust with just too much time on our hands. We want this camera. Now!
Hurry up already, Canon!
I freely admit to that. I can't wait to slap the 400 f5.6 on, go on my back deck and shoot away, that's my version of therapy! I hope those AF zones work as advertised!
Sep 18, 2009 at 07:46 AM
p.58 #17Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Mark Bishop wrote:
Yohan Pamudji wrote:
The 5DII is the affordable full frame.
At least here in the UK, where its currently costs less to buy a 5DII body only than pre order the Sony 850.
A 3D will, by definition of Canons heirarchical pricing policy, be more expensive than a 5D, not less, regardless of anything else.
IF Canon are to introduce a FF version f the 7D, it will be a minimum twelve months away (to allow the 7D to maximise its sales and give breathing room for 1D introductions) , AND it will be significantly more expensive than current FF offerings.
That could be...Show more →
I agree, it's always about price points. Nikon played Canon well with the gap between the 40D and the 5D. It was an obvious move by Nikon. Canon showed it's corporate sluggishness by letting Nikon fill that space with the D300. Now Canon has lost a lot of market share and will be responsive for awhile.
The 7D makes it less likely to see an inexpensive FF. I think this line will have two camera's, one full frame and one 1.6 crop. These will be similar throughput and AF abilities.
A used 5D is a great inexpensive FF camera.
Yohan Pamudji wrote:
Earlier quote
I think the 7D, far from completing the lineup, is actually the strongest indication that we will finally see an "affordable" full frame with better-than-xxD features, a.k.a. the 3D.At least here in the UK, where its currently costs less to buy a 5DII body only than pre order the Sony 850.
A 3D will, by definition of Canons heirarchical pricing policy, be more expensive than a 5D, not less, regardless of anything else.
IF Canon are to introduce a FF version f the 7D, it will be a minimum twelve months away (to allow the 7D to maximise its sales and give breathing room for 1D introductions) , AND it will be significantly more expensive than current FF offerings.
That could be...Show more →
I agree, it's always about price points. Nikon played Canon well with the gap between the 40D and the 5D. It was an obvious move by Nikon. Canon showed it's corporate sluggishness by letting Nikon fill that space with the D300. Now Canon has lost a lot of market share and will be responsive for awhile.
The 7D makes it less likely to see an inexpensive FF. I think this line will have two camera's, one full frame and one 1.6 crop. These will be similar throughput and AF abilities.
A used 5D is a great inexpensive FF camera.
Sep 18, 2009 at 08:59 AM
p.58 #18Canon EOS 7D Master thread
dcmiller wrote:
The 7D makes it less likely to see an inexpensive FF. I think this line will have two camera's, one full frame and one 1.6 crop. These will be similar throughput and AF abilities.
First we have to see what Canon has in store for the MkIV since the 1D series will have a lot of impact on what Canon is going to release as their premium but non-pro series of DSLRs. For example, there isn't gonna be a FF version of the 7D if the 1D4 is still 1.3 crop.
The 7D makes it less likely to see an inexpensive FF. I think this line will have two camera's, one full frame and one 1.6 crop. These will be similar throughput and AF abilities.
First we have to see what Canon has in store for the MkIV since the 1D series will have a lot of impact on what Canon is going to release as their premium but non-pro series of DSLRs. For example, there isn't gonna be a FF version of the 7D if the 1D4 is still 1.3 crop.
Sep 18, 2009 at 09:34 AM
p.58 #19Canon EOS 7D Master thread
I don't see a 3D coming for a long time, if ever. I think we'll see 1-series Mark IV cameras as before, around 18 Mp APS-H, and 31Mp full frame (oh, and video).
A 3D, with 5-6 fps, reduced shutter/mirror lag, and the AF of the 7D would be nice, but I don't have my hopes set too high. If you shoot primarily sports or action with Canon cameras, you'll likely be doing it with sub-frame sensors for a while.
I say this because the only real improvements I wanted in the 5D2 were these things, and we got something different. So I'm guessing Canon's product planners are working in inverse correlation to my desires.
A 3D, with 5-6 fps, reduced shutter/mirror lag, and the AF of the 7D would be nice, but I don't have my hopes set too high. If you shoot primarily sports or action with Canon cameras, you'll likely be doing it with sub-frame sensors for a while.
I say this because the only real improvements I wanted in the 5D2 were these things, and we got something different. So I'm guessing Canon's product planners are working in inverse correlation to my desires.
Sep 18, 2009 at 09:58 AM
p.58 #20Canon EOS 7D Master thread
cameron12x wrote:
Please don't give them any ideas. They've had a rough time with complacency lately, so let's keep spurring them on instead of letting them sit on their laurels!
I think the 7D, far from completing the lineup, is actually the strongest indication that we will finally see an "affordable" full frame with better-than-xxD features, a.k.a. the 3D. Before this it was all speculation and wishful thinking based on nothing tangible in the Canon lineup. Now Canon have shown they are willing to trickle down features traditionally considered pro level features into cameras other than the 1-series, which they've been very reluctant to do in the past. 3D might finally be coming.+1^19 Amen!
Isn't 1^19 the same as 1?
Yohan Pamudji wrote
Brit-007 wrote
I think it is obvious that Canon has now completed their line up.I think the 7D, far from completing the lineup, is actually the strongest indication that we will finally see an "affordable" full frame with better-than-xxD features, a.k.a. the 3D. Before this it was all speculation and wishful thinking based on nothing tangible in the Canon lineup. Now Canon have shown they are willing to trickle down features traditionally considered pro level features into cameras other than the 1-series, which they've been very reluctant to do in the past. 3D might finally be coming.
Isn't 1^19 the same as 1?
Sep 18, 2009 at 10:00 AM