cogitech wrote:
But they do offer these screens in cameras such as the 40D, 5D, and 1-Series (maybe the 50D too? I haven't looked into that).
Like I said. Not including this feature was either due to technical difficulty related to this new bell (or whistle, your call) or it was an outright "nah, let's leave that out specifically to alienate people who use MF/fast glass.
actually they don't offer it in the xxD series, all the screens there are third party and not officially sanctioned.
(that said when canon serviced my 20D they said they adjusted the exposure metering to match my haoda screen )
or maybe they did starting with the 40D? I don't know. Anyway they didn't with the 20D.
timbop wrote:
OK, we get it. You aren't happy. you've made your point. Over and over. Beaten it to death. You've come back to tell us one more time. The camera's not for you. You appeared to get that yesterday, but yet you keep coming back to it. Don't buy the camera. Keep what you have. We heard you that not having the S series screen is a dealbreaker for you. Got it. We understand. Yep, you need a "real" camera for your way of shooting. Canon should build a fullframe camera (beyond the 3 they've already made) to fulfill YOUR needs. Uh-huh, we heard you. We understood you. At some point, you're going to have to let it go. The camera isn't your cup of tea, and you explained why. Understood.
Now, are you going to continue to throw an hourly tantrum, or are you planning to grow up just enough to move on?...Show more →
It's not a tantrum. n0b0 asked me to explain my position a few pages ago and I did so. Then people felt the need to try to convince me that S type screens are irrelevant. I haven't been arguing alone here, after all.
skibum5 wrote:
actually they don't offer it in the xxD series, all the screens there are third party and not officially sanctioned.
(that said when canon serviced my 20D they said they adjusted the exposure metering to match my haoda screen )
Jim Victory wrote:
I disagree. I think we will se a 5D upgrade with the same features as the 7D with a 24MP sensor. I also think we will see a 1DMKIV with a 18MP sensor and a 1DsMKIV with a 30MP sensor.
I would be surprised if Canon would put less than 18MP in a 1DMKIV and their not going to join the 24MP crowd with their next version of the 1DsMKIV. They will want to better the others with a higher MP count like they always have with their Ds series.
Jim
Jim, I think your numbers are right on the money.
1D Mark IV - 18MP
5D Mark III (3D?) - 24MP (just enough to call it an upgrade) with 7D-ish feature set
1Ds Mark IV - 30MP at least
Canon will be busting the ceiling wide open with the res on the 1Ds Mark IV. It needs to, since it will have less and less to differentiate it from the also-FF 5D series once the 5D series gets pro-ish AF.
I have both 5D models. Actually I find the manual focus using the viewfinder with lenses like the Rokkor quite accurate on the 5DII. Certainly more accurate than my copy of the 5D mk I.
I find that I am not really missing shots with the 5DII. I probably do more tripod and studio work than you do though. Still, I have grown to love Live View. You can use it quickly when you get used to it. I also find the larger more detailed LCD on the 5DII provides more accurate feedback on the shots I have taken. I shoot some architecture stuff and I prefer Live View with optional grid lines on. This is (adding the lines) a super nice feature for ensuring straight verticals etc. I also like that I do not have to jam my face up against the back of the camera for every shot I am doing. Its a great mix of features and for me a worthwhile upgrade for the work I do.
It could be that the Ee screen and shim upgrade on my 5D mk I is yielding more accurate focus at f1.2 than my stock 5DII. I will have to test them against each other. But between both bodies and the way I have them configured I am pretty happy. I have the battery grip and RRS L bracket on my 5D mkI as well.
d_chiesa wrote:
Regarding AF servo tracking, i think the camera needs the mirror to be down in order to AF. Blackout time on the 7D seems like that of xxD cameras, not like the 1D. So at 8 fps, i thik it's very optimistic to think it will track well. Of course you can choose AF priority over frame rate.
Sorry guys i brought this up; i understand that in this kind of camera, with action and sport in mind, MF is wayyyyyyyyyyy more important to talk about! Good god...
By the way, i have a katz eye on my 10D and use many MF lenses, but give us a break, this is becoming pathetic.
John Power wrote:
Oh wow. A new release. So what. Trade my 5D2 for a 7D? Will it shoot in complete darkness? I am already bored with the topic. Am I alone? A voice crying in the wilderness. A modern day Robison Crusoe.
I can't even gather enough energy to open the 7D threads...
Well, we're in agreement there - isn't DPR the place for that though?
and calling Canon out on yet another blunder.
Yeah, because after all, Canon-made alternative focusing screens have been available since, oooh, waaaay back to the 40D?
Such a rich and checkered history there - how dare Canon turn its back on such a depth of tradition...
If I bitch about it, maybe, just maybe we won't get this same "gizmos, gadgets, and marketing" approach in their other "pro" cameras.
Seriously - to the vast majority of potential 7D users, the kind of MF capabilities you're hankering after are going to be as much of an anachronism in a modern-day, state of the art "action" camera as the ability to shove a roll of bloody Velvia into it, and far more of an irrelevance - and a gimmick - than the Real World improvements the 7D seems to be delivering by the bucketful.
As Tim has spelled out: we get it. You're not happy.
I guess most of us just don't care one way or another.
Paul Yi wrote:
Why doesn't anyone make Manual Focus camera anymore....like in film days...
Its economy of scale. If Canon came out with a 24 MP manual focus camera with great focusing accuracy for $800 less than the AF version then guys like Paul (Cogitech) would have a "happy ending" moment. But he would be in the minority. AF rules and AF is here to stay. Its all built into the lenses anyway.
I noticed two similar threads about the merits of manual focus on the Canon and Alt forums of this site. The response trend could not have been more different. The Canon fanboys poo-pooed manual focus in general while the Alt kids extolled the virtues and zen like communion of the craft. But as passionate as the Alt crowd may be their numbers are tiny when compared to the masses who use AF.
I for one have a lot of Canon lenses and alt glass. Generally I focus all of them with manual focus. I used to shoot professional polo with a manual focus 400/2.8 lens so I am not unfamiliar with the practice.
Still, I would definitely be interested in a cheaper manual focus option if the focus was accurate enough. It should be noticed that all the video that these DSLR's produce are with manual focus or auto focus that is preset. You cannot use AF while recording video. You also cannot use the viewfinder while recording video as Live View has to be on.
Honestly, one of the small things that I really like (since we seem to be able to drone on for pages about small things), is the ability to change the functionality of the main and quick control dials in manual. I am in Av and M 99.99% of the time, and I constantly change the wrong setting because of the dials having different behavior. Being able to keep it consistent is one thing I really like about my 1d2, and I hope they continue that flexibility into the fullframe version of the 7d. It's also great that you can set the DOF preview button to switch between AI servo and oneshot - that's another annoying thing I never understood. I can see that coming in really handy, particularly for start-stop type sports. I never liked the two-finger approach of using the "*" button, and since Canon thoughtlessly left out a split prism I don't manually focus.
I am cautiously optimistic that this camera will live up to it's hype, and definitely plan on getting one at the end of the season in december. Canon isn't stupid, so I have no doubt that the image quality will be there. Hopefully by next september there will be a fullframe 3D to pair it with.
d_chiesa wrote:
Sorry guys i brought this up; i understand that in this kind of camera, with action and sport in mind, MF is wayyyyyyyyyyy more important to talk about! Good god...
By the way, i have a katz eye on my 10D and use many MF lenses, but give us a break, this is becoming pathetic.
So, if action and sport is in mind, how is the new electronic overlay any more relevant than focusing screen options?
Pathetic or not, nobody has answered that question.
cogitech wrote:
So, if action and sport is in mind, how is the new electronic overlay any more relevant than focusing screen options?
Pathetic or not, nobody has answered that question.
You just really need attention, don't you? YOU ARE RIGHT, CANON MESSED UP AND THINKS THAT THE ONLY USEFUL SCREENS WERE THE GRIDLINE VARIETY, AND UNDERESTIMATED THE VAST MARKET FOR PRECISION FOCUS SCREENS. This huge blunder might put canon under, but hopefully katz eye will be able to buy them out in bankrupcy court.
There, your question was answered. And we all agree that you were right. You're a genious, and you should be running canon.
timbop wrote:
You just really need attention, don't you? YOU ARE RIGHT, CANON MESSED UP AND THINKS THAT THE ONLY USEFUL SCREENS WERE THE GRIDLINE VARIETY, AND UNDERESTIMATED THE VAST MARKET FOR PRECISION FOCUS SCREENS. This huge blunder might put canon under, but hopefully katz eye will be able to buy them out in bankrupcy court.
There, your question was answered. And we all agree that you were right. You're a genious, and you should be running canon.
Is that enough attention for today?
Like I said, n0b0 asked me to explain my position. I did. Then everyone tried to convince me that I am wrong, that nobody needs or wants a precision screen option in a pro camera. All I am doing is arguing the other side of it. It has nothing to do with attention. Turning it into a personal assault won't help matters. While the sarcasm is so obvious, I'll let you know that I am not a genius (my IQ is only 138), but at least I can spell "genius".
Don't know why people are angry over the lamenting of a feature offered in lower tiered cameras. If anything, you shouldn't be happy about options being taken away, even if you've never utilized it. Why? Cause watch the 1DMKIV come with LCD Overlay and replaceable focus screens.
Now if the 7D had an EVF that allowed you to zoom within the Viewfinder at the touch of a button... this would all be moot
Do we know for sure that the 7D isn't the 1D IV? It's got a lot of the pro-level features...dual processors, weather-sealing, 8fps, 19-point AF...maybe APS-H sensors are no more and this is the new pro-level crop camera, and the next SLR announcement will be a 1DS IV in the spring with 80 bazillion MP on a full-frame sensor?
veroman wrote:
>Diffraction, my friend, diffraction. The greater DOF at f/13/-16 is almost totally negated by the smearing at f/13-f/16. I can shoot f/13 with my 1Ds II and 5D, but not with my crops. Let me put it this way: I CAN shoot at f/13/-f/16 with my crops, but I don't want to.
brainiac wrote:
To take the same picture with a crop you need a shorter focal length. A shorter focal length lens has more d.o.f.. Therefore you don't need to stop down as much to get the same d.o.f.
To make it even clearer, for IDENTICAL composition, f/16 on FF is equivalent to f/10 on APS-C (1.6x crop) in terms of depth of field. So, yes, stopping down to f/10 on APS-C is good enough.
I am shocked people do not know this by now. Sigh...
)
a tough day on the job John