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Archive 2009Canon EOS 7D Master thread
p.13 #1Canon EOS 7D Master thread
cogitech wrote:
I think it is simply a case of Canon designers getting a big boner for the fancy new, half-baked overlay feature, then realizing "oops, how do we offer different screen options?" "Uhhh, we just won't, but we'll market in such a way that people think it's really friggin' cool."
I think it's wise to wait until the next higher-end cameras come out with the LCD overlay before declaring it technically impossible to offer optional focusing screens with it. Could just be a matter of Canon saving something for the 1-series yet again. It's not like they went completely baby-1-series with the 7D--plenty of stuff that they held back from it. Let's see how the new 1-series cams (and the FF 7D if it materializes) do with focusing screens before declaring it a total loss.
I think it is simply a case of Canon designers getting a big boner for the fancy new, half-baked overlay feature, then realizing "oops, how do we offer different screen options?" "Uhhh, we just won't, but we'll market in such a way that people think it's really friggin' cool."
I think it's wise to wait until the next higher-end cameras come out with the LCD overlay before declaring it technically impossible to offer optional focusing screens with it. Could just be a matter of Canon saving something for the 1-series yet again. It's not like they went completely baby-1-series with the 7D--plenty of stuff that they held back from it. Let's see how the new 1-series cams (and the FF 7D if it materializes) do with focusing screens before declaring it a total loss.
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:20 PM
p.13 #2Canon EOS 7D Master thread
cogitech wrote:
Ahhh, so since I am in the minority, my opinion doesn't matter?
That's exactly right, your opinion doesn't matter to Canon. Does it honestly come as a huge shocker that Canon doesn't care about this extremely tiny portion of the market...at least not enough to offer additional focus screens?
Ahhh, so since I am in the minority, my opinion doesn't matter?
That's exactly right, your opinion doesn't matter to Canon. Does it honestly come as a huge shocker that Canon doesn't care about this extremely tiny portion of the market...at least not enough to offer additional focus screens?
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:21 PM
p.13 #3Canon EOS 7D Master thread
I have the 5D II and I use Live View for manual focusing all the time...
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:22 PM
p.13 #4Canon EOS 7D Master thread
I don't see where Live View is mentioned buy in one place for the 7D. I find it odd that under specifications it isn't mentioned unless I missed it.
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:25 PM
p.13 #5Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Regarding AF servo tracking, i think the camera needs the mirror to be down in order to AF. Blackout time on the 7D seems like that of xxD cameras, not like the 1D. So at 8 fps, i thik it's very optimistic to think it will track well. Of course you can choose AF priority over frame rate.
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:25 PM
p.13 #6Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Paolo Dolina wrote:
The 1D3 was $3999 last April '07 and street was lower than that. So it breaching $4,000 is unlikely especially if Nikon updates the D3 and lowers prices some more.
Having Nikon isn't all that bad. It eggs Canon along to do better.
The 1DMk3 was introduced at $4500, and still retails for $3700 today, 2 and 1/2 years later. Canon loves to protect it's high margins and exclusivity on the 1 series. They will ask a high price. Of course if you are willing to wait the price will be lower.
jerrykur wrote
What is your budget. 1DMK4 will likely be in the $4,000+ range.Having Nikon isn't all that bad. It eggs Canon along to do better.
The 1DMk3 was introduced at $4500, and still retails for $3700 today, 2 and 1/2 years later. Canon loves to protect it's high margins and exclusivity on the 1 series. They will ask a high price. Of course if you are willing to wait the price will be lower.
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:25 PM
p.13 #7Canon EOS 7D Master thread
OK. So let's say it isn't such a technical impossibility. Maybe it is even quite simple an cheap for them to do. Why not offer it?
This is why I maintain that it is either a) technically difficult and/or expensive and not likely to appear in the foreseeable future, or b) easy to implement but they've intentionally crippled an otherwise very nice camera.
So it is either a technical compromise for a practically useless new "feature" or an outright "nah, they're just not getting that feature".
Sounds just like the Canon we all know and love (?).
This is why I maintain that it is either a) technically difficult and/or expensive and not likely to appear in the foreseeable future, or b) easy to implement but they've intentionally crippled an otherwise very nice camera.
So it is either a technical compromise for a practically useless new "feature" or an outright "nah, they're just not getting that feature".
Sounds just like the Canon we all know and love (?).
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:26 PM
p.13 #8Canon EOS 7D Master thread
M Vers wrote:
That's exactly right, your opinion doesn't matter to Canon. Does it honestly come as a huge shocker that Canon doesn't care about this extremely tiny portion of the market...at least not enough to offer additional focus screens?
But they do offer these screens in cameras such as the 40D, 5D, and 1-Series (maybe the 50D too? I haven't looked into that).
Like I said. Not including this feature was either due to technical difficulty related to this new bell (or whistle, your call) or it was an outright "nah, let's leave that out specifically to alienate people who use MF/fast glass.
cogitech wrote
Ahhh, so since I am in the minority, my opinion doesn't matter?But they do offer these screens in cameras such as the 40D, 5D, and 1-Series (maybe the 50D too? I haven't looked into that).
Like I said. Not including this feature was either due to technical difficulty related to this new bell (or whistle, your call) or it was an outright "nah, let's leave that out specifically to alienate people who use MF/fast glass.
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:30 PM
p.13 #9Canon EOS 7D Master thread
The 7D has Live View. Its critical for the whole video capture feature. On my 5D II I use Live View a lot and the magnification options, 5X and 10X, are great for nailing down focus. The small thumb wheel lets you rotate the center of the magnification point as well, which is great if you want ensure the critical focus is in a corner etc.
I went through the whole laborious exercise of swapping in the Ee screen and the screen washer (shim) on my 5D mkI and doing all kinds of testing to get decent focus with fast manual lenses like the 58/1.2 Rokkor. I have no such plans with the 5DII however.
I went through the whole laborious exercise of swapping in the Ee screen and the screen washer (shim) on my 5D mkI and doing all kinds of testing to get decent focus with fast manual lenses like the 58/1.2 Rokkor. I have no such plans with the 5DII however.
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:30 PM
p.13 #10Canon EOS 7D Master thread
snowboarder wrote:
Thank you for those. I have to admit - the camera looks quite amazing.
Why, why wouldn't they make a FF version?
Because I called them and said I want a great cropper
love it
Paolo Dolina wrote
Official 7D Product Videos. Warner Music Group silenced the first clip for some odd reason.Why, why wouldn't they make a FF version?
Because I called them and said I want a great cropper
love it Sep 02, 2009 at 02:32 PM
p.13 #11Canon EOS 7D Master thread
PhotoMaximum wrote:
I have the 5D II and I use Live View for manual focusing all the time...
For what?
How do you maintain any sense of spontaneity? How do you maintain perfect composition? How do you grab that once-in-a-lifetime moment while frigging around with buttons and whatnot?
I have the 5D II and I use Live View for manual focusing all the time...
For what?
How do you maintain any sense of spontaneity? How do you maintain perfect composition? How do you grab that once-in-a-lifetime moment while frigging around with buttons and whatnot?
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:32 PM
p.13 #12Canon EOS 7D Master thread
cogitech wrote:
...
So it is either a technical compromise for a practically useless new "feature" or an outright "nah, they're just not getting that feature".
Sounds just like the Canon we all know and love (?).
Yes, it does. But what else is new Still, I'm personally withholding judgment until we see how the 1-series handle the focusing screen issue. If there are eventually no cameras with super precision focusing screens as options, then I'll start hyper-ventilating. For now my 5D classic + Ee-S is doing just fine.
Maybe I'm just calmer because a pro-ish 1.6x was never on my radar? Were you really considering a 1.6x cam for use with your alt lenses? Sounds like a recipe for torture to me with a 1.6x viewfinder, even if it is 100% and 1.0x mag.
...
So it is either a technical compromise for a practically useless new "feature" or an outright "nah, they're just not getting that feature".
Sounds just like the Canon we all know and love (?).
Yes, it does. But what else is new
Still, I'm personally withholding judgment until we see how the 1-series handle the focusing screen issue. If there are eventually no cameras with super precision focusing screens as options, then I'll start hyper-ventilating. For now my 5D classic + Ee-S is doing just fine.Maybe I'm just calmer because a pro-ish 1.6x was never on my radar? Were you really considering a 1.6x cam for use with your alt lenses? Sounds like a recipe for torture to me with a 1.6x viewfinder, even if it is 100% and 1.0x mag.
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:32 PM
p.13 #13Canon EOS 7D Master thread
I find it perfectly legit to miss those focusing screens, although myself I am going to use the electronic level more often than MF.
jamato8:
LiveView is there, with face detection.
jamato8:
LiveView is there, with face detection.
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:33 PM
p.13 #14Canon EOS 7D Master thread
PhotoMaximum wrote:
The 7D has Live View. Its critical for the whole video capture feature. On my 5D II I use Live View a lot and the magnification options, 5X and 10X, are great for nailing down focus. The small thumb wheel lets you rotate the center of the magnification point as well, which is great if you want ensure the critical focus is in a corner etc.
I went through the whole laborious exercise of swapping in the Ee screen and the screen washer (shim) on my 5D mkI and doing all kinds of testing to get decent focus with fast manual...Show more →
Max,
Have you seen my Cirque du Soleil series or any of my wedding photos?
If so, please explain how you would have used Live View to shoot such photos?
The 7D has Live View. Its critical for the whole video capture feature. On my 5D II I use Live View a lot and the magnification options, 5X and 10X, are great for nailing down focus. The small thumb wheel lets you rotate the center of the magnification point as well, which is great if you want ensure the critical focus is in a corner etc.
I went through the whole laborious exercise of swapping in the Ee screen and the screen washer (shim) on my 5D mkI and doing all kinds of testing to get decent focus with fast manual...Show more →
Max,
Have you seen my Cirque du Soleil series or any of my wedding photos?
If so, please explain how you would have used Live View to shoot such photos?
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:35 PM
p.13 #15Canon EOS 7D Master thread
I bet the non interchangeable viewing screen option on the 7D is like the coating on a pinhead when compared to the outrage that 5DII video buffs have over the fact that the 7D offers different film (video) rates while the 5DII does not.
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:37 PM
p.13 #16Canon EOS 7D Master thread
cogitech wrote:
And so it is, you should know 
Remember you are the minority, Canon doesn't care about you or the other 1% of photographers who shoot MF more often than not, They won't loose sleep, let alone sales, because you can't use it with a Canon branded focus screen with one specific camera designed for action photography. They didn't implement a 19 pt. AF system in the 7D so you can MF better.Ahhh, so since I am in the minority, my opinion doesn't matter?
Balls!
The 40D, 5D, and all the 1-Series have an S type screen option. Many pro photographers consider this an essential option. The 7D, a pro-caliber camera, does not include this option because Canon preferred to add some stupid electronic overlay to show AF points and grid lines.
Now, tell me, if most buyers of this camera will use it for it's AF abilities, how many will be switching the AF points off?
If most buyers of this camera are sports and BIF shooters, how many of them need a bloody...Show more →
OK, we get it. You aren't happy. you've made your point. Over and over. Beaten it to death. You've come back to tell us one more time. The camera's not for you. You appeared to get that yesterday, but yet you keep coming back to it. Don't buy the camera. Keep what you have. We heard you that not having the S series screen is a dealbreaker for you. Got it. We understand. Yep, you need a "real" camera for your way of shooting. Canon should build a fullframe camera (beyond the 3 they've already made) to fulfill YOUR needs. Uh-huh, we heard you. We understood you. At some point, you're going to have to let it go. The camera isn't your cup of tea, and you explained why. Understood.
Now, are you going to continue to throw an hourly tantrum, or are you planning to grow up just enough to move on?
M Vers wrote
cogitech wrote
But ignorance is bliss, so if you want to go on believing that S type screens are unimportant, then by all means... Remember you are the minority, Canon doesn't care about you or the other 1% of photographers who shoot MF more often than not, They won't loose sleep, let alone sales, because you can't use it with a Canon branded focus screen with one specific camera designed for action photography. They didn't implement a 19 pt. AF system in the 7D so you can MF better.Balls!
The 40D, 5D, and all the 1-Series have an S type screen option. Many pro photographers consider this an essential option. The 7D, a pro-caliber camera, does not include this option because Canon preferred to add some stupid electronic overlay to show AF points and grid lines.
Now, tell me, if most buyers of this camera will use it for it's AF abilities, how many will be switching the AF points off?
If most buyers of this camera are sports and BIF shooters, how many of them need a bloody...Show more →
OK, we get it. You aren't happy. you've made your point. Over and over. Beaten it to death. You've come back to tell us one more time. The camera's not for you. You appeared to get that yesterday, but yet you keep coming back to it. Don't buy the camera. Keep what you have. We heard you that not having the S series screen is a dealbreaker for you. Got it. We understand. Yep, you need a "real" camera for your way of shooting. Canon should build a fullframe camera (beyond the 3 they've already made) to fulfill YOUR needs. Uh-huh, we heard you. We understood you. At some point, you're going to have to let it go. The camera isn't your cup of tea, and you explained why. Understood.
Now, are you going to continue to throw an hourly tantrum, or are you planning to grow up just enough to move on?
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:38 PM
p.13 #17Canon EOS 7D Master thread
I finally found all the information on Live View on the Canon page. So the sync speed is 250? That would be nice.
And I read somewhere that it has remote flash syncro built in for single or multiple flashes?
And I read somewhere that it has remote flash syncro built in for single or multiple flashes?
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:38 PM
p.13 #18Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Yohan Pamudji wrote:
So it is either a technical compromise for a practically useless new "feature" or an outright "nah, they're just not getting that feature".
Sounds just like the Canon we all know and love (?).Yes, it does. But what else is new Still, I'm personally withholding judgment until we see how the 1-series handle the focusing screen issue. If there are eventually no cameras with super precision focusing screens as options, then I'll start hyper-ventilating. For now my 5D classic + Ee-S is doing just fine.
Maybe I'm just calmer because a pro-ish 1.6x was never on my radar? Were you really considering a 1.6x cam for use with your alt lenses? Sounds like a recipe for torture to me with a 1.6x viewfinder, even if it is 100% and 1.0x mag.
No, I never considered it at all and I am extremely happy with 5D + Ee-S, as you are.
I'm just stirring up shit and calling Canon out on yet another blunder. If I bitch about it, maybe, just maybe we won't get this same "gizmos, gadgets, and marketing" approach in their other "pro" cameras.
cogitech wrote
...So it is either a technical compromise for a practically useless new "feature" or an outright "nah, they're just not getting that feature".
Sounds just like the Canon we all know and love (?).
Still, I'm personally withholding judgment until we see how the 1-series handle the focusing screen issue. If there are eventually no cameras with super precision focusing screens as options, then I'll start hyper-ventilating. For now my 5D classic + Ee-S is doing just fine.Maybe I'm just calmer because a pro-ish 1.6x was never on my radar? Were you really considering a 1.6x cam for use with your alt lenses? Sounds like a recipe for torture to me with a 1.6x viewfinder, even if it is 100% and 1.0x mag.
No, I never considered it at all and I am extremely happy with 5D + Ee-S, as you are.
I'm just stirring up shit and calling Canon out on yet another blunder. If I bitch about it, maybe, just maybe we won't get this same "gizmos, gadgets, and marketing" approach in their other "pro" cameras.
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:41 PM
p.13 #19Canon EOS 7D Master thread
scott f wrote:
There is no way a 5D will have features like the 7D, if it did, then it makes the top 1D redundant and a poor investment. The 5D is a different market segment and will be kept separate. The 1D series will have , at the time of release , the best that Canon has at the time. The "problem" with digital is that it marches forward so the top tier ends up looking a little tired prior to the next generation.
I disagree. I think we will se a 5D upgrade with the same features as the 7D with a 24MP sensor. I also think we will see a 1DMKIV with a 18MP sensor and a 1DsMKIV with a 30MP sensor.
I would be surprised if Canon would put less than 18MP in a 1DMKIV and their not going to join the 24MP crowd with their next version of the 1DsMKIV. They will want to better the others with a higher MP count like they always have with their Ds series.
Jim
There is no way a 5D will have features like the 7D, if it did, then it makes the top 1D redundant and a poor investment. The 5D is a different market segment and will be kept separate. The 1D series will have , at the time of release , the best that Canon has at the time. The "problem" with digital is that it marches forward so the top tier ends up looking a little tired prior to the next generation.
I disagree. I think we will se a 5D upgrade with the same features as the 7D with a 24MP sensor. I also think we will see a 1DMKIV with a 18MP sensor and a 1DsMKIV with a 30MP sensor.
I would be surprised if Canon would put less than 18MP in a 1DMKIV and their not going to join the 24MP crowd with their next version of the 1DsMKIV. They will want to better the others with a higher MP count like they always have with their Ds series.
Jim
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:41 PM
p.13 #20Canon EOS 7D Master thread
cogitech wrote:
And so it is, you should know Remember you are the minority, Canon doesn't care about you or the other 1% of photographers who shoot MF more often than not, They won't loose sleep, let alone sales, because you can't use it with a Canon branded focus screen with one specific camera designed for action photography. They didn't implement a 19 pt. AF system in the 7D so you can MF better.Ahhh, so since I am in the minority, my opinion doesn't matter?
Balls!
The 40D, 5D, and all the 1-Series have an S type screen option. Many pro photographers consider this an essential option. The 7D, a pro-caliber camera, does not include this option because Canon preferred to add some stupid electronic overlay to show AF points and grid lines.
Now, tell me, if most buyers of this camera will use it for it's AF abilities, how many will be switching the AF points off?
If most buyers of this camera are sports and BIF shooters, how many of them need a bloody...Show more →
i have to say i find a nice MF screen WAYYYYYY more useful than some electronic grid. This and autoiso seem like the two mistakes IMO. But hey, they did do a hekc of a lot of other stuff they haven't before and I always have my 5D2 for MF. It is a shame to waste the new giant 100% VF though, sort of bizarre really....
anyway it is a shame IMO, bu tnot the end of the world.
Edited on Sep 02, 2009 at 02:47 PM · View previous versions
M Vers wrote
cogitech wrote
But ignorance is bliss, so if you want to go on believing that S type screens are unimportant, then by all means... Remember you are the minority, Canon doesn't care about you or the other 1% of photographers who shoot MF more often than not, They won't loose sleep, let alone sales, because you can't use it with a Canon branded focus screen with one specific camera designed for action photography. They didn't implement a 19 pt. AF system in the 7D so you can MF better.Balls!
The 40D, 5D, and all the 1-Series have an S type screen option. Many pro photographers consider this an essential option. The 7D, a pro-caliber camera, does not include this option because Canon preferred to add some stupid electronic overlay to show AF points and grid lines.
Now, tell me, if most buyers of this camera will use it for it's AF abilities, how many will be switching the AF points off?
If most buyers of this camera are sports and BIF shooters, how many of them need a bloody...Show more →
i have to say i find a nice MF screen WAYYYYYY more useful than some electronic grid. This and autoiso seem like the two mistakes IMO. But hey, they did do a hekc of a lot of other stuff they haven't before and I always have my 5D2 for MF. It is a shame to waste the new giant 100% VF though, sort of bizarre really....
anyway it is a shame IMO, bu tnot the end of the world.
Edited on Sep 02, 2009 at 02:47 PM · View previous versions
Sep 02, 2009 at 02:44 PM