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Archive 2009 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs

  
 
flyfishcamera
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p.1 #1 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


Hopefully I am in the right forum.

My son will graduate from high school in 2010. He's looking at colleges.
In high school he has been taking lots of photos for the yearbook, student newspaper, etc. and wants to explore a Photography degree in a four year college. To date he's looking at specific schools Pratt and Brooks. He's also looing at traditional programs (choice of photojournalism or fine arts photography) Ohio University and Western Kentucky.

Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.



Apr 10, 2009 at 10:05 AM
Mike Ip
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p.1 #2 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


I would highly suggest looking at Western Kentucky. I attended there and it's simply a great program. The student community as well with the professional community and alumni will open a lot of doors. The program is very much a documentary photojournalism program and it's arguably the best in the country.

Other schools I'd recommend to look at would be RIT, UNC-Chapel Hill, Florida, Missouri and San Francisco State.



Apr 10, 2009 at 12:01 PM
rodrickreidsma
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p.1 #3 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


Mike Ip wrote:
The student community as well with the professional community and alumni will open a lot of doors.


Nothing will open doors but the quality of your work.



Apr 10, 2009 at 09:22 PM
Mike Ip
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p.1 #4 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


rodrickreidsma wrote:
Nothing will open doors but the quality of your work.


Strongly disagree with this statement. You can be a good shooter, but if no one knows you or your work, you're on your own. If you have connections and networks, it helps a bit.



Apr 10, 2009 at 09:24 PM
rodrickreidsma
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p.1 #5 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


A bit?


Apr 10, 2009 at 10:07 PM
indyjones
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p.1 #6 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


Another nod for Mizzou, regarded as one of the best PJ schools in the land.


Apr 10, 2009 at 10:24 PM
shatterkiss
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p.1 #7 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


I'd also consider the International Center for Photography and Columbia College in Chicago. Were your son to be considering more commercial photography I'd add RISD and School of Visual Arts.


Apr 10, 2009 at 10:35 PM
csm
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p.1 #8 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


Good suggestions here and would add that an important distinction is fine art photography or photo journalism or a commercial bent. RIT and always RISD. For fine art photography, this is from US World and New Reports:

1 Yale University New Haven, CT
2 School of the Art Institute of Chicago Chicago, IL
3 Rhode Island School of Design Providence, RI
Rochester Institute of Technology Rochester, NY
5 University of New Mexico Albuquerque, NM
6 California Institute of the Arts Valencia, CA
7 San Francisco Art Institute San Francisco, CA
School of Visual Arts New York, NY
University of California--Los Angeles Los Angeles, CA
10 Arizona State University Tempe, AZ
California College of the Arts San Francisco, CA
Cranbrook Academy of Art Bloomfield Hills, MI

PJ is a largely different list and needs its own homework as does commerical photography.

So after you get past the first choice, then you need to consider a 4-year university setting or a "art" school. Most of the PJ schools are national. Many of the commercial photography schools are not attached to a university.

I'd say if serious, some serious talking with the school college placement officer, experienced teachers at the high school, and some outside sources...and there are people that offer placement advice on a fee basis. Have him go to an NPPA flying short course for the two day program...full of real life PJ professionals that work and hire at the highest levels of the profession. They also a free portfolio review...brutal and priceless. Look up Pulitzer winners, see if any live near you...have him call a couple, maybe see one or talk on the phone. These folks are more willing to talk to aspiring young people than you might think...just an idea.

It is a lot of work but worth it. I recently went through this for my daughter, who is just now accepted into the BFA track in Fashion Design at VCU Arts--fourth best art school in the nation and number 1 for public university art programs (sorry, daddy is having a 'proud of my kid moment'..in public, certainly shameful ...and we got very lucky, in-state rates, not to be underestimated!). Not the same degree, but the same process. Good luck!



Apr 10, 2009 at 11:15 PM
thebeginning
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p.1 #9 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


Hallmark Institute


Apr 11, 2009 at 12:29 PM
c.d.embrey
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p.1 #10 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


Art Center College of Design in Pasadena, CA http://www.artcenter.edu/

They are well respected in the commercial/business world. Also they are an art/design school. Get a well rounded education in the arts.

Degree Programs:

+ Advertising
+ Entertainment Design
+ Environmental Design
+ Film
+ Fine Art
+ Graphic Design
+ Illustration
+ Photography + Imaging
+ Product Design
+ Transportation Design




Apr 11, 2009 at 02:30 PM
skibum5
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p.1 #11 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


flyfishcamera wrote:
Hopefully I am in the right forum.

My son will graduate from high school in 2010. He's looking at colleges.
In high school he has been taking lots of photos for the yearbook, student newspaper, etc. and wants to explore a Photography degree in a four year college. To date he's looking at specific schools Pratt and Brooks. He's also looing at traditional programs (choice of photojournalism or fine arts photography) Ohio University and Western Kentucky.

Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.


UNC-CH might not be a bad choice, especially if he is into sports (he could easily find himself shooting players who have won gold medals or national championships in a wide array of sports and the local sports pros and official school photographers are all very nice and helpful). But the sports angle is just a bonus, I don't at all mean to make it sound as if though it's primarily a sports PJ program, not at all.

I've seen students get sent on amazing PJ trips to Asia, Europe, South America, etc. and it seems like students have pretty good success at getting internships while they are here, whatever their focus.

Furthermore, when I was shooting sports, I noticed that at quite a few events quite a few pros (working for various newspapers, Getty, etc.) were former UNC students. At times, it seemed like very other person at the ACC basketball champs had been in some way associated with the school , maybe that is a little exaggerated, but there were certainly a lot.

The students seem to do pretty well in the regional and even national PJ contests.

There is a pretty major school newspaper too (very large circulation daily) and the yearbook provides lots of opportunities as well. I mean really great opportunities (though a few of the photo people have tended to be overly clique-ish and defensive, to put it diplomatically, the last two years about ever letting students who are not actually officially in the School of Journalism program itself from ever getting to be in positions higher than general staff, but that probably wouldn't affect him and, regardless of any of that, just as a regular staff member, he could pick up tons of great experience and get 100% support doing the regular stuff. It really is a great opportunity and he could quite probably get more experience there as general staff member than he could as head photo editor at most other school papers.)


They also seem to be covering multimedia/internet skills now too. It appears as if everyone needs to also produce a full video project and create a custom website with slideshows and so on and that they don't soley focus on pure stills.

Really the only bad thing is if he has allergies. It is a savage part of the country for anyone with those sorts of issues....

Anyway, I was never part of the photography program itself so I can only comment a bit from the outside, but the program appears to be pretty well liked by the students and seems to provide good networking, they get internships at major papers, National Geographic, etc. OTOH, I guess sometimes people say it can be better to be a big fish in a small pond and this is a big pond, but i'm not sure, with how badly journalism is doing these days (really do hear pretty grim stories....), that small pond would give enough connections (certainly in many fields merely being skilled really doesn't appear to me to be enough to make easy progress)??

But do more research, I've only just barely dabbled at the edges of this field so there are surely better people to talk to than myself.

(you can look at the US News type reports too they might work better for stuff like this, but at least in terms of general undergrad rankings, which granted is not the point at hand, I think it is safe to say their methodology leaves something to be desired and looking at individual rankings like say 2 vs 3 or 15 vs 25 is rather nonsense IMO for a variety of reasons, maybe taking schools in bunches of 15 or 30 it makes some sense in some ways though).




Edited on Apr 12, 2009 at 12:36 PM · View previous versions



Apr 11, 2009 at 02:58 PM
JDeV
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p.1 #12 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


shatterkiss wrote:
I'd also consider the International Center for Photography and Columbia College in Chicago. Were your son to be considering more commercial photography I'd add RISD and School of Visual Arts.



School of Visual Arts always fascinated me. I know Palma Kolansky taught there...she was always one of my favorite "beauty" photographers.

Simon, do you know of any other guest faculty members? I always thought that that would be a great benefit of going to school in N.Y... the guest faculty. I know the OP's son might be more into PJ, but maybe they get those shooters to teach there too.

Jon




Apr 11, 2009 at 10:42 PM
rbranan
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p.1 #13 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


he should read carefully about what is going on in this field--have him flip through the message board on sportsshooter or other trade threads and read about the layoffs, reduction in contracts, bankrupt papers, and so forth. this is an industry in flux and i would think someone in his situation should really understand where it might be in 10 or 15 years before committing to it. there are SO many photo journalist with amazing degrees and awards looking at wedding photography as lifeboat. at a minimum, he should call the placement centers at the top 5 or so journalism schools and ask them about how job offers are going this year.


Apr 12, 2009 at 12:16 AM
skibum5
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p.1 #14 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


rbranan wrote:
he should read carefully about what is going on in this field--have him flip through the message board on sportsshooter or other trade threads and read about the layoffs, reduction in contracts, bankrupt papers, and so forth. this is an industry in flux and i would think someone in his situation should really understand where it might be in 10 or 15 years before committing to it. there are SO many photo journalist with amazing degrees and awards looking at wedding photography as lifeboat. at a minimum, he should call the placement centers at the top 5 or so journalism
...Show more

come to think of it, it does seem like many do seem to be entering into post-grad internships as opposed to actual jobs and some are going into weddings....



Apr 12, 2009 at 12:24 AM
csm
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p.1 #15 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


rbranan wrote:
he should read carefully about what is going on in this field--have him flip through the message board on sportsshooter or other trade threads and read about the layoffs, reduction in contracts, bankrupt papers, and so forth. this is an industry in flux and i would think someone in his situation should really understand where it might be in 10 or 15 years before committing to it. there are SO many photo journalist with amazing degrees and awards looking at wedding photography as lifeboat. at a minimum, he should call the placement centers at the top 5 or so journalism
...Show more

Very true and great suggestions. And the latest trend seems to be having PJs add video to thier skill set.



Apr 12, 2009 at 09:27 AM
Nathan Whitchu
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p.1 #16 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


I would be hesitant to steer him towards a PJ school. I can tell you with some first hand experience in a mid-sized market that coming into this field will simply get you either a $12/hour job or a job at starbucks. We have on 120k+ daily readership newspaper that is currently in 'negotiations' with the union to try and dump another like 10% of their employees and just folded a paper in SF, several 30kish readership papers that have layed off people in ones and twos (or simply not replaced people retiring) and the only papers hiring are a series of weekly's coming out of two smaller sized papers owned by the same parent company. They're only hiring 20 hours a week and paying WELL under a living wage. The only other photo companies hiring are your standard mall photo places for $8-10/hour and the school portrait places hiring seasonally for $10-12, and guess what, they don't CARE about your degree.

I can also tell you first hand that the TV industry is in the SAME boat, not renewing contracts laying off cameramen, and two have actually combined their school sports photogs and share the footage and will most likely start combining several other departments where they know that their just going to both send someone anyways.

Will this change in the next four years? I think by that time the dust will settle, whoever is going under will go under and whoever will stay will pick up the slack, but I doubt the market will get any better. You will have the same amount of people clamoring for the few jobs that are left!



Apr 12, 2009 at 09:34 AM
johnny12
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p.1 #17 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


Paier College of Art in Hamden, CT. I believe this is a commuter only school. No on campus housing.


Apr 12, 2009 at 09:41 AM
shatterkiss
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p.1 #18 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


JDeV wrote:
School of Visual Arts always fascinated me. I know Palma Kolansky taught there...she was always one of my favorite "beauty" photographers.

Simon, do you know of any other guest faculty members? I always thought that that would be a great benefit of going to school in N.Y... the guest faculty. I know the OP's son might be more into PJ, but maybe they get those shooters to teach there too.


I can't quote specific names, but I can definitely back up your impression. SVA (as well as ICP and FIT) all tend to hire faculty who are working pros in their fields, rather than professional teachers. The downside of this is that many of them are better at their chosen trade than they are at teaching, but the upside is that you get people with actual industry experience and exposure rather than career educators who go straight from college to grad school to teaching...the academic incubator, essentially. (Full disclosure: I grew up on college campuses and in a family of educators, so I've probably got a little backlash against this.)

I spent two years at SVA in the film program as well as some time in the continuing ed program picking up some extra skills. I really appreciated that you saw your instructors still working: my screenwriting teachers had projects currently in production and lots of credits to their names, my photo teachers had gallery shows hanging, my film editing teacher was an Oscar-winner, a directing teacher was written about in many of my textbooks. Guest lecturers were pulled from the major industry, often with the lectures co-sponsored by publications like PDN or American Cinematographer or Aperture. It's also worth noting the networking angle, since NYC is one of the largest media hubs in the world: a directing instructor of mine brought me onto a documentary he was shooting as a camera operator and referred me to direct a theater workshop when he needed to back out, a cinematography instructor I had brought me in as an assistant camera operator for what lead to two years of steady shooting for network television and PBS shows. My experience wasn't atypical in that way - people I know who dropped out did so because they had been exposed to professional work opportunities via school that were too good to pass up.

If you're interested in primarily PJ work, especially the type of longer-term stories and editorial projects like the NY Times or Rocky Mountain News or AP or National Geographic might commission, then I'd suggest that ICP would be a better fit...SVA has a much more commercial bent.



Apr 12, 2009 at 09:42 AM
csm
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p.1 #19 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


Simon, interesting to hear your stories...the NYC angle can be a good and interesting one. I have a couple of friends that run the in-house clothes design departments for two VERY large commercial concerns. Neither of them are located in NYC. Thier biggest problem with getting top talent is luring recent grads out of or away from the pull of NYC, a constant issue that money alone can't solve. Does not seem to apply to PJ (have no idea really), but it seems to be an issue for fashion design, likely commercial photography too--but you would have a great read on that. NYC seems to 'the' place for jobs, experience, much talent, etc. And going to school there in the thick of it all could be a tangile plus (assuming the kid actually pursues using these connections).

Another angle for a kid starting out is doing a program that is part of a national univeristy or liberal arts college vs. a program that more like 'trade' school for lack of a better term. If the kid REALLY knows the field of work they want, great jump up to get specialized early. Otherwise, not sure the specialized school works in thier best interst long-term. A large university that offers many programs as a back up and has a large number of reqired general ed studies as part of graduation requirements may save a lot of un-transferrable credits later. In my kid's case, she has been into this for years, all through high school, did a huge amount of art classes in high school (all of them really), studies at the Corcoran and other art schools every summer, learned how to sew early, has had all the fashion mags piled all over her room for years, etc. But really, most of her friends just don't know what they want to do with life so end up in general degree programs as they try to figure it out. Just a thought for FM'ers with high school kids.



Apr 12, 2009 at 10:28 AM
JDeV
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p.1 #20 · Four year colleges with good Photography programs


As far as learning from working pros, I had a very small but tremendous opportunity to learn from Michael O'Neill, Dick Frank, and Steve Krongard at various times at the Maine Photographic(now Media) workshops. I went to a small art school in Cleveland...took the "Commercial Photography" course that was taught by one of the best studio still life photographers in the Midwest. My school had no business courses offered.

This brings me to my recommendation to the OP and his son. Try to find a school that has a guest faculty where "working pros" come in to teach some courses. Look into summer programs such as the Maine Media Workshops which also are taught by working pros. Look at both the "real life" education you get and also the net-working possibilities(possibly becoming an assistant), and last but not least, take business courses, and more business courses, and even more business courses.

Jon

ps...did I mention business courses?



Apr 12, 2009 at 10:36 AM
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