Maybe you're struggling to get started, or struggling financial -- or will be shooting a wedding in a different area so you're willing to pick up a cheap wedding on the side while there? There are so many better ways to have some weddings booked and cash in pocket, without killing the industry you're getting into (or are in).
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The one that got me tonight is a package that gives away everything for $299 from a talented proven photographer. Either you don't know what's wrong with that or you're hurting as much as me just reading that. Up the price, cut the time, don't include the cd of processed images. Have that as an ad-on.
There have also been photog's from out of state advertising cut-rate (cut-throat) prices for weddings during certain time-frames when they'll be here anyway. What's wrong with charging your regular rate or enjoy the vacation without additional work? Advertise no travel fees. Is your work really worth what you charge or not? I wonder how your booked brides would feel seeing that low discounted price.
I saw some C list ads posted in the Wichita C list by people from out of state. Several of them. I got the impression that they're booking weddings and then hiring someone local to shoot them, but now I'm wondering if they're scammers, ripping people off. I flagged them. Can't advertise out of your area on CL. I didn't go back to check or police the events listings though. I have better things to concern myself with.
It really hurts us all. But wait you will see the same guys that say its ok to copy saying its just business. Why not pick up some business while in another state. Its just free enterprise and its natural.
I also saw some $300 ads from a very talented/experieced photog in our area. It's impossible to compete with. Eventually he has to figure out that there's just no way to pay his rent like that. But, in the meantime the damage gets done.
The ones posting from out of state really drive me bonkers.
They post that they're coming on vacation and want to shoot on vacation to make it a biz expense...
Considering the area that I'm in... that happens a lot more than it would in most areas... and it really hurts. I mean, our market is already saturated, we're all just trying to make a living, last thing we need is people advertising they'll travel in from out of state. We have a lot of VERY good photogs here, it's not like we're lacking in choices. They do it with Google adwords too.
sboerup wrote:
Very very very bad move even for desparate times. Hold fast, weather the storm, it will pass.
No one will stay in business at those prices, so yeah, it will pass. Not even partimers (who cater the crowd that would never pay a full time pro the going rate anyway).
But it will get worse before it gets better. The slow economy will encourage lots of folks to pic up extra cash by shooting a wedding. Better to shoot a wedding then sell off a lens to pay the car payment, right?
And people will still be getting married, but on tighter budgets, so there will be demand for these low end shooters.
When the economy turns around those that are serious about the biz will prosper like never before - there will be TONS of horror stories out there of bad weekend warriors, folks not around after the wedding, etc.
When the economy turns around those that are serious about the biz will prosper like never before - there will be TONS of horror stories out there of bad weekend warriors, folks not around after the wedding, etc.
I hope so. Right now, the business for serious and experienced photographers in my area seems to have completely dried up.
it must be a tough lesson to learn, that people can in lean times replace your services with a cousin who is pretty handy with her camera, and charges a fraction of the fee.
philosophize all you want about it, or choose to be angry, but many professional wedding photogs remind me of professional elevator attendants (a la 1915). eventually, technology made it possible to run elevators without trained help. the digital era and the internet are producing pretty good, low costs wedding photographers in overabundance. go back to school and get a law degree or something.
Unfortunately, we live in a free-market capitalist society (at least on the micro level), and people do what they feel is best for them. If he's comfortable selling his time for that price, tough titties. If your work stands out as worth what you charge then you have nothing to worry about. If it doesn't, well then... I hear Alaska is nice this time of year! There probably isn't much competition so I bet you could charge whatever you want and not have to worry about being undercut
abam wrote:
it must be a tough lesson to learn, that people can in lean times replace your services with a cousin who is pretty handy with her camera, and charges a fraction of the fee.
philosophize all you want about it, or choose to be angry, but many professional wedding photogs remind me of professional elevator attendants (a la 1915). eventually, technology made it possible to run elevators without trained help. the digital era and the internet are producing pretty good, low costs wedding photographers in overabundance. go back to school and get a law degree or something.
hmmmmm, sounds like someone ^^^^^^ doesn't appreciate photography-but i won't call that person out
if you think that the only thing standing between some random person and a brilliant photo is technology, you're in the wrong forum-maybe a DP Review gearhead forum is for you
Not knowing the content of the ad you are referring to, I can see an ad offering $299 wedding shoot, then making up the difference in the photo packages, books, etc....marketing 101. I come from a strong sales background and am confident that if I can talk to and show someone in the market for a photog, I can sell the job and get a bump in the process. I view some of these ads as nothing more than an ad for a new car for $12,000, when you go look at the car it has manual trans., no air conditioner, am radio, no cruise, and only one such model on the lot. You leave driving a $17,000 car of the same model. I think a lot of good photogs could benefit greatly from some sales training.
BTW, I don't advertise and derive most of my income in an unrelated field...just my $.02
I really don't worry about what someone else charges. There are brides out there looking to spend $500.00 because that is all they have. When we charged $475.00 we booked a lot of weddings our first year. Thank goodness for the photographer with a backup camera with a decent flash. Better he get the job than Uncle Bob with his point and shoot.
On another note, let's not be too quick to judge someone because they decide to lower their prices. Everyone does what they have to do in order to pay their bills, feed their family, and keep a roof over their head. I've heard so many say that they hurt the industry. I really don't see how someone that charges 1/4 of what we charge has an effect on my business. The ones charging $1000.00 to $1500.00 for color corrected detailed images burned to CD will take more business from me. They can always go back and get the album later. Yvette
I didn't mean for it to come across as judgemental. I really was hoping for this to be a bit more informative about why it's hurtful and how to price it in better ways. I've learned so much from this forum and I might have been one posting something like that if it weren't for this place.
For a talented photographer to give a full day's coverage with all processed images for $299, yes, that hurts! Them more than me. Really. Whether you need the experience or need the money, as Tom said, work on the ad-ons. That's what I meant in my first post.
For my first 2009 wedding that was booked in early 2008, I did the engagement session for only $100 and the wedding for only $650. I booked it with non-wedding samples before I shot my first wedding last February. With ad-ons I'll making more than $900 from it, but I set up their expectations too high for little $$ and we had to deal with that a bit. (no, I'm not staying until midnight! ) Yes, you get so much more respect when you demand it, and if offering low dollar deals maybe try a 2-3 hour package instead of all-day, all-inclusive.
Our expenses aren't little. The gear, the software, the knowledge, the talent, the misc. time involved. It's all worth something. Have pride in yourself and your work and learn how to charge for it. If you have questions, ask. It's all right here in these forums and there are many people willing to help you get there.
abam wrote:
it must be a tough lesson to learn, that people can in lean times replace your services with a cousin who is pretty handy with her camera, and charges a fraction of the fee.
philosophize all you want about it, or choose to be angry, but many professional wedding photogs remind me of professional elevator attendants (a la 1915). eventually, technology made it possible to run elevators without trained help. the digital era and the internet are producing pretty good, low costs wedding photographers in overabundance. go back to school and get a law degree or something.
i think the absolute opposite, maybe because i'm not a wedding photographer (i'm looking to get into it, which is why i lurk this forum) but a commercial artist by trade and education, but the digital age has really separated the talent from the mediocre and awful. the quicker someone has access to something, the less likely they're going to stick around very long once they realize that this is an actual craft that like any other art takes years to master. i haven't seen many on CL, albeit in my area, that were very talented, in fact, it's usually a tiny percentage that are above average, and honestly, there ARE a lot of dinosaur photogs out there who refuse to change their methods, and would rather lower prices than actually relearn certain aspects of their industry that have changed.
Tom Basore wrote:
Not knowing the content of the ad you are referring to, I can see an ad offering $299 wedding shoot, then making up the difference in the photo packages, books, etc....marketing 101. I come from a strong sales background and am confident that if I can talk to and show someone in the market for a photog, I can sell the job and get a bump in the process. I view some of these ads as nothing more than an ad for a new car for $12,000, when you go look at the car it has manual trans., no air conditioner, am radio, no cruise, and only one such model on the lot. You leave driving a $17,000 car of the same model. I think a lot of good photogs could benefit greatly from some sales training.
BTW, I don't advertise and derive most of my income in an unrelated field...just my $.02...Show more →
Very good point. it's not what they pay up front but what they pay by the time they leave.
A buddy of mine booked a wedding recently when the couples said they could only afford $1000. He broke down the cost $600 for his time and cost, $400 credit.
They'll spend anything between $3000 - $5000 by the time he wraps with them and they'll be smiling when they walk away with their album.
and its natural.
