That's the way most of the nicer churches are here in So Cal, and it is no problem. We know we always need faster, longer lenses anyways, and we can always get the shot under these restrictions provided we're equipped properly.
lotsky28 wrote:
most catholic /christian weddings incorporate the ' mass ', hence it takes about an hour for the whole ceremony....some priests/churches enforce the 'sacredness' of the whole ceremony...some are lenient.
Actually, I believe it's asking that the photographer not be taking group shots or something within 30 minutes of the ceremony because guests are arriving. It just asked them not to be in the sanctuary.
Same rules as many churches have, only they're not usually written out like that.
Evan Baines wrote:
That's pretty much every Saturday for me. Welcome to the Bible Belt. Restrictive is when you're banned from the sanctuary entirely and only allowed to shoot through a window.
I've only had this happen to me once, but needless to say I was shocked. We were allowed to "recreate" the ceremony after-the-fact, but it just wasnt the same. =\
Make sure the fine print of your contract covers limitations of the venue. I cover that with every couple, and they always understand when there are limitations.
This is standard etiquette, IMHO, only usually it's not written out like this. This is exactly how I operate, unless the bride informs me otherwise.
I've seen photographers/videographers sneak up on the couple and officiant from the back, sides and front. Heck, I've seen a 70-200 appear out of the fern behind the pastor. This is certainly one of the most tasteless things you can do during a service. Here's a tip, just because you're wearing black, it doesn't make you invisible!
This has come up several times, and most posters have agreed that a pro photographer needs to adapt to the circumstances of the venue.
A bride may want a wedding in a certain church because of a wide center aisle or the decor, for example, and never enter the church again. A wedding demands intensive use of the church's facilities, usually on a Saturday, while the church usually has its most intensive program scheduling on Sunday. Cleaning and straightening up after a wedding is no small chore.
This has little to do with photography, and I mention it just to share another perspective. A wedding is the formal, public occasion for a B&G to make significant commitments to each other, and a pastor focuses on that commitment when planning the ceremony and is not 'staging' it for the benefit of a photographer. Yes, the bride will be part of that planning process.
The bride needs guidance from the officiant on photography guidelines.
A recent bride in our church family was very happy with her photographer because he and his second said they would be very unobtrusive during the ceremony. A photographer roaming around during the ceremony is going to distract attention away from the ceremony.
J. Curtis summed it up well: So what's the problem?
Pretty much norm. All it states is you need to clear the sanctuary 30 minutes before the service. No flash. You must remain at the back of the church.
That's pretty much the norm.
Most photographers recognize they are there to serve the B&G and to record their ceremony and wedding activities. Part of that process is to work within the guidelines of the venue. It's not about a personal ego trip. One self-declared pro photographer said a few weeks ago that he insisted on full access to the bride's room while she and her attendants were dressing.
Guidelines and restrictions are there for a reason.
I've seen this at about 1/3rd of my weddings. Depends on the church. My first wedding said no photos during the ceremony, period. The second one I did sent us behind the window (which was an internal window to the hallway from the sanctuary). And I've had cathoic weddings where I could crawl around on the floor in front of the pews. YMMV.
BTW You'll never see the inside of an LDS or Jehovah's witness building unless you're a member.
I work for a Catholic newspaper and have to deal with this all the time. As my editor once said "this isn't a baseball game". This IS a sacred and holy ritual to some people and should be treated as such. Is that particular contract restricting? Yes. But should you be allowed to just roam wherever you want to and disrupt what the bride, groom and officiant consider a sacred rite? No! Most priests I meet are more then willing to make some compromises and meet me more then halfway from where this contract puts you though.
That is usual for many of my weddings. Just hope the couple will face each other sometime during the ceremony. Some never make the turn and back of the head images get old fast.
Nathan Whitchu wrote:
This IS a sacred and holy ritual to some people and should be treated as such..
+1
No matter what your religious beliefs may or may not be, the couple chose to get married in a facility that strongly believes that this is first and foremost a holy service and should be treated as so.
It is in return, as a professional, that you not only capture the best possible pictures for the couple, but respect the venue and its rules, not matter what.
Yep, these restrictions are pretty standard for church ceremonies. I lucked out this year and only 1/3 of my weddings were church affairs.
The thing I hate about being restricted to the back, especially during Catholic ceremonies, is that the couple is facing forward 95% of the ceremony. I've even had some ceremonies where they said their vows facing forward (toward the Priest), and the only times they looked at each other were during the ring exchange/first kiss. There's nothing like 50 photos of your backs to remember your ceremony
What I really hate is when you get a couple who knows the rules and wants you to break them. I had that happen 2 years ago. There was a strict "no photographers in the sanctuary" rule. I couldn't even be in the sanctuary for the processional. The bride pleaded with the church lady to make an exception but she refused (the priest couldn't have cared less). So, as I'm standing outside the sanctuary with the bride and her dad before he walks her up the aisle, she looks at me with pleading eyes and asked me to go inside for the processional. I had to respect the rules that were very firmly given to me and to which I had to agree with in writing. The bride was annoyed with me, but what was I supposed to do? She also knew the rules.
CRFTony wrote:
Yep, these restrictions are pretty standard for church ceremonies..
Have to disagree - most Catholic services are a free-for-all. As are most services I have ever seen. Only in very rare cases does someone forget their professional responsibilities and impose silly rules.
Well, not really. The minister doesn't make the rules. The rules are made be a committee of church members (in most churches it is the property committee or worship committee, something like that) who are elected/appointed by the church leadership. The minister has input, but usually isn't the final authority.
I don't want to split denominational hairs with you, but when it comes to a worship service, which a wedding ceremony is, the pastor in most mainline denominations (Methodist, Episcopalian, Presbyterian, Lutheren, etc.) have final authority. I've served as a church leader for many years and have a son and daughter-in-law who are pastors.
The rules posted here seem reasonable and were certainly the norm when I photographed weddings many moons ago.
The good thing with the OP message and circumstance is that the guidelines are in writing and presented to the couple and not capricious. This is much better than having an officiant run rampant and impose arbitrary restrictions to no one's advantage.
The people being married are often the sons and daughters of the folk whose volunteer labour constructed the edifice in the first place and it is a pity that they cannot enjoy the fruit of their progenitors sweat.
My personal experience is that the officiant and church lady invariably back down and take a more reasoned approach than the initial bark indicates.
I don't see the problem. This is a Bride and Groom issue not a photographers. You get what you can within the guidelines and thats it. They need a portion at the bottom for the B&G to sign stating that they understand this as well.
Can someone quote the chapter and verse in the Bible where it specifies no photography??
Didnt God create light...which is the essence of what we do Now I dont mind not being allowed up on the altar...I dont really want to be up there anyway. But off to the sides...especially if you can be out of the direct view of the guests....should be allowed imo. I have been banished to shoot thru a door...and for what All that resulted was a host of cell phone cameras and p&S's got to shoot the event, and not the photographer with the fast glass who could have easily done it with no flash at all. Now which one was more disruptive And for goodness sake why would a videographer be allowed to be up front and not a photographer? I cant tell you how many times I've seen that one.
The images that are obtained from a frontal view of the bride and groom are often some of the most treasured images captured from the entire day. They reflect the pure emotion of the moment...and it is at that moment before God...and all their families when the true magic happens. You simply cant recreate that afterward as so many ministers pontificate.
To have those memories forever captured should be considered extra special in the eyes of the church, not banished.
This is the very essence of what we do...capturing the moment of all moments. God didnt say go to the back of the church...that idea was thought of by those with misplaced ideals of what religion is all about. We dont disrupt the sanctity of the event, we preserve it forever for those brides lucky enough not to be encumbered by such overzealous church leadership. Sure there have been a few overzealous photographers that have caused more of a ruckus...but there are just as many overzealous ministers out there. Perhaps instead of banning photographers, they should aid in the selection such that it might ensure they dont use Uncle Bob or Debbie Digital who dont have clue....and instead seek out a qualified professional with the equipment, skills, and experience to carry out the task without being a pain....
ok..sorry I'll get off my soapbox and stop preaching now
Good grief, this is ridiculous. Some of you can't seem to understand that it's DISTRACTING when the doofus... er, I mean phototog, stands front and center and otherwise makes a spectacle of himself. It would be rude, regardless of whether or not it was in a church. Some of you need to get off your high horse. It's NOT about you or your artistic vision... or whatever.
Now I dont mind not being allowed up on the altar...I dont really want to be up there anyway. But off to the sides...especially if you can be out of the direct view of the guests....should be allowed imo. I have been banished to shoot thru a door...and for what