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Archive 2008 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!

  
 
cogitech
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p.2 #1 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


Anyway...

Here are all the Oly OM lenses http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/olympusom1n2/shared/zuiko/index.htm The only one missing from that list is the ultra-rare OM 24-40 f4.

Here are most of the Tamron Adaptalls http://www.adaptall-2.com/

And the plethora of M42 lenses http://m42.artlimited.net/site_lenses.php Only 482 of them in that list so far, but it continues to grow.

Edited on Jun 07, 2008 at 08:04 AM



Jun 07, 2008 at 08:03 AM
DocsPics
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p.2 #2 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


The amount of knowledge floating around here continues to amaze me. Thanks to all of you who have so much to contribute from those like me that don't (but so appreciate what you share).


Jun 08, 2008 at 06:15 AM
dave chilvers
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p.2 #3 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


What a great idea!

Although I only have 4 Contax lenses and 1 Olympus I would just love to see as many different makes and variations as Fred could manage to list for us.

Dave



Jun 08, 2008 at 05:30 PM
veroman
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p.2 #4 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


jcolwell wrote:
Steve, you started this...



Right you are. I started it, but I'm sure not the one to implement it, I'm sorry to say. My experience with these types of alternative lenses is pretty limited to what I own now and have owned in the past, which is really a scant few compared to what's been posted in this thread.

There are obviously many people here on FM.com with much knowledge and information to share about these lenses. I'm glad I put forth the idea. I still believe it's worth pursuing, but I'd have to leave it up to Fred and his associates to figure out the best way to get it all going as review pages.

It's a mountain of stuff to sort through, and it looks like a pretty daunting at the outset. I think, though, if we can begin with just a small list of the most popular and common types, it won't be long before the list grows and then grows and grows some more. Baby steps is probably the best direction for now. And I agree with Fred that lenses currently available as new should be included.

Fred: I'm glad to help in whatever way I can.

- Steve



Jun 08, 2008 at 10:00 PM
FranchiseJuan
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p.2 #5 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


Might I sugest a few of things.

1) Instead of trying to crop down the whole range of lenses that can be included in the list, let try and decide on a few of focal lengths to concentrate on first. For example, 50/55/58, 35, 28, 21 85/90. This could cut down the work to a managable level, and if we leave it at that list for a little while, we could give people who want to put up detailed opinions about these lenses some time to do so. At least for me this is how I shop for lenses (pick a focal lenghth and try and find one I like), so this may be of the most use to people actively seeking opinions. The list can be expanded from there after we see the response.

2) Instead of including only the lenses in current production, only include the ones that can be easily aquired. This is through a online store like KEH, or a forum like the Buy and Sell here, or other means. If the lens does not come up for sale at least once in a couple of weeks or once a month then don't include it. Lets limit the lenses to those the reader can actually hope to aquire.

3) Limit the lenses to those that don't require a mount conversion. I know there will be people who won't like this (I can think of one in particular), but in trying to make the reviews actually usefull to people, lets limit it to the ones that they can most easily use.

4) Include the most common Perspective Control solutions. While this may have a slightly smaller audience as other lenses, I personally don't feel there is a enough information available on PC lenses and adaptors, and having a central place for opinions would be great.

Well those are my thoughts. These are only thoughts to crop down all the possible lenses to a group that is easily managable to begin with.

Edited on Jun 09, 2008 at 08:57 AM



Jun 09, 2008 at 08:53 AM
Jman13
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p.2 #6 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


Any way to make it possible to add new lenses to the database ourselves, so Fred doesn't have to do all the work? We could create the page (if a form could be developed to generate it.) and that page would then be sent to Fred for perusal (to prevent poor entries or duplicates because the page creator didn't do research), and then if Fred says Go, the page posts and we all can review. We could build quite an archive that way.


Jun 09, 2008 at 09:01 AM
cogitech
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p.2 #7 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


Jman13 wrote:
Any way to make it possible to add new lenses to the database ourselves, so Fred doesn't have to do all the work? We could create the page (if a form could be developed to generate it.) and that page would then be sent to Fred for perusal (to prevent poor entries or duplicates because the page creator didn't do research), and then if Fred says Go, the page posts and we all can review. We could build quite an archive that way.


This occurred to me as well. Makes a lot of sense.



Jun 09, 2008 at 09:03 AM
pascal03
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p.2 #8 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


Not opposed to what you suggest.... just sharing thoughts on what you said....

FranchiseJuan wrote:
Might I sugest a few of things.

2) ........include the ones that can be easily aquired. This is through a online store like KEH, or a forum like the Buy and Sell here, or other means. If the lens does not come up for sale at least once in a couple of weeks or once a month then don't include it. Lets limit the lenses to those the reader can actually hope to aquire.


Every lens you can think of can be acquired. You would be amazed at what you can get if you have the $$$'s for it.
KEH rarely lists lenses like the CZ 15mm f3.5, CZ 35mm f2.8 PC Shift, OM 24mm f3.5 PC Shift, OM 50mm f1.2, OM 50mm f2.0, OM 21mm f2.0 or f3.5 Macro, OM 16mm f3.5, OM 18mm f3.5, OM 90mm f2.0, OM 100mm f2.0, OM 180mm f2.0, OM 250mm f2.0, OM 500mm f8.0 Mirror, CZ 500mm f8.0 Mirror, CZ 55mm f1.2, CZ 85mm f1.2, CZ 70-200mm f3.5 Macro, Leica 80-200mm f4.0 etc. to name a few.
But these do come up for sale once in a while and if you really need any of these right away, there are atleast a dozen stores around the world that will have them in stock - in some cases, as new in box - never used - old dealer stock. Who's to decide if the reader is going to be someone who has $100 saved up for an alternate lens or $10,000 saved up for a unique hard to find lens.


FranchiseJuan wrote
3) Limit the lenses to those that don't require a mount conversion. I know there will be people who won't like this (I can think of one in particular), but in trying to make the reviews actually usefull to people, lets limit it to the ones that they can most easily use.


So I take it all Contax N-mount lenses or Minolta Rokkor mount converted lenses are out. Any reason why you think reviews of some of the best lenses in the world would not be useful to people.
There are quite a few users of these lenses here on FM and several more on other forums who don't even know such lenses exist or that the conversion exists. Why bother having a review site and not listing the best lenses available for anyone who is interested in getting the best there is.

FranchiseJuan wrote
4) Include the most common Perspective Control solutions. While this may have a slightly smaller audience as other lenses, I personally don't feel there is a enough information available on PC lenses and adaptors, and having a central place for opinions would be great.


However, your suggestion in #2 would void out some of the best PC lenses avaialble. The CZ 35mm f2.8 PC, OM 24mm f3.5, OM 35mm f2.8 MC, Nikon 28mm f3.5 PC, Pentax 35mm f3.8 PC etc. are not really that easily available.... not to mention rather pricey.
The OM 24mm f3.5, if it ever surfaces for sale, goes for $1900 - $2600 depending on the condition of the lens. The CZ 35mm f2.8 is another hard to find lens and when it is offered for sale, goes for $1500-$1700. So I guess the list would be limited to the Nikon 35mm f2.8 PC Shift.







Jun 09, 2008 at 10:22 AM
FranchiseJuan
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p.2 #9 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


My sugestions were only intended to focuse the first batch of review/opinions. The way I see it, if everyone goes and review their favorite lenses (cause lets face it, we would all love to tell the world about our favorites first), then we would have alot of reviews, but each lens would not have alot of reviews.

By concentrating reviews on a smaller selection of lenses to begin with, it creates a more useful resource, Then as the list of lenses expands, it expands on an already usefull resource, and will hopefully mean more eye balls.

In no way do I want sugest we should exclude any lenses. I actually agree with others in this thread, that every lens that can be used should eventually be included. This is just my way of talking what to me seems a manmoth task, and deviding it into managable chuncks.

Finally I think I intended point number 4 to somewhat overide point number 2.



Jun 09, 2008 at 10:44 AM
davidearls
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p.2 #10 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


Seems like conducting a poll to see what the most commonly used alt gears are would be a good, objective place to start. Not only are people passionate about their gear, they get passionate about who gets to decide what's on and off the list. We should avoid a messy "who gets to decide" fight. Reviewing the lenses most commonly in use (which to some extent reflects their availability) carries the imprimatur of being objective.

I'm sort of seeing a third category in the Canon Lens Review section for alternative lenses, since the overwhelming number of alt gearheads are adapting to EOS - but we should poll for this to be sure. Price should not be a consideration for inclusion or exclusion; how could you leave off Leica big guns or the Distagon 21 or some of the PCs, if they're being used?

The section should include links to mount conversions, mirror shaving, etc - any hardware alterations beyond the adapter. Info on adapters would also be helpful. Let's face it, as things are, it takes a certain amount of raw courage to "go alt" - a well-designed, well executed review section would make it a lot easier.

Also +1 to JMAN's suggestion about adding to the database. It's probably going to take a moderator (maybe even multiple moderators, one for each manufacturer) to screen the new adds -



Jun 09, 2008 at 02:14 PM
Paul Yi
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p.2 #11 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


I'm pretty new in Alt. Gear Forum, and this review forum was available, it would have been a tremendous help in choosing my lenses.
if starting with 100s of different lens database immediately is a problem, I'd love to see it start with some of the best lenses (most likely that were popuplar in this forum) by focal length category or by brand name.

I really want to see this thing get started....
And I think JMAN's suggestion should be seriously considered to expand the lens selection.



Jun 09, 2008 at 05:38 PM
burningheart
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p.2 #12 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


burningheart wrote:
I would like to see the new lenses by Zeiss

25mm F/2.8 ZF Distagon
28mm F/2 ZF Distagon
35mm F/2 ZF Distagon
50mm F/1.4 ZF Planar
85mm F/1.4 ZF Planar
50mm F/2 ZF Makro-Planar
100mm F/2 ZF Makro-Planar

Coastal Optics 60mm F/4 UV-VIS-IR-lens



Coastal Optics website
http://www.coastalopt.com/

Here is a link for those interested with shots taken with this lens on te Fujifilm UV/IR, Canon 5D and Canon 5D modified for IR. There is also 3 shots with a Nikon Series E lens. Some comparison shots are incuded comparing the Nikon 105mm UV lens with the Coastal Optics lens.

http://www.robert-chisholm.com/Multispectrum/index.htm




Jun 10, 2008 at 11:28 PM
davidearls
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p.2 #13 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


burningheart wrote:
Coastal Optics website
http://www.coastalopt.com/

Here is a link for those interested with shots taken with this lens on te Fujifilm UV/IR, Canon 5D and Canon 5D modified for IR. There is also 3 shots with a Nikon Series E lens. Some comparison shots are incuded comparing the Nikon 105mm UV lens with the Coastal Optics lens.

http://www.robert-chisholm.com/Multispectrum/index.htm





Questions as to how this post applies to the thread topic aside, we haven't had any "meaningful" activity on it in almost two days. Does anybody know where we are? Has anything been submitted to Fred? Are we expecting him to make all the decisions?

It seems like we'd get something going if we approached Fred with some specifics. We've had a number of suggestions about which lenses to include, but we haven't agreed to anything yet. I'd favor a poll of the suggestions submitted so far, and then approaching Fred with the one that gets the most traction.



Jun 11, 2008 at 12:12 PM
veroman
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p.2 #14 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


davidearls wrote:
[Questions as to how this post applies to the thread topic aside, we haven't had any "meaningful" activity on it in almost two days. Does anybody know where we are? Has anything been submitted to Fred? Are we expecting him to make all the decisions?

It seems like we'd get something going if we approached Fred with some specifics. We've had a number of suggestions about which lenses to include, but we haven't agreed to anything yet. I'd favor a poll of the suggestions submitted so far, and then approaching Fred with the one that gets the most traction.


I was in contact with Fred via PM a couple of days ago. The value of this kind of review page remains unquestioned, and it's being thought threw.

Not to put words in Fred's mouth or to suggest that this is written in stone: I believe he's heading in the direction of beginning with lenses that are currently for sale at the usual places, ie B&H, Adorama, KEH, etc. and providing links to those sellers so that FMers can get additional information and pricing. I'm sure Fred will have more to say about all this in due time.

- Steve



Jun 11, 2008 at 02:07 PM
brainiac
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p.2 #15 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


If it is community built, as suggested, I think it will work greatly. However, I suspect that many people who come here want to see both old and new lenses. When someone is looking for a 28mm to use on her 5D, and is prepared to try alts, it would be a real shame not to have a review of the Distagon 28 f2.8. Completeness should be the goal. People on this forum are an encyclopaedia. This could become an important community resource. I know that often I just can't bring myself to discuss the Distagon 28 for the 12th time. Searching the threads is great, but a more formal vector onto the knowledge would be apposite.

Edited on Jun 11, 2008 at 06:59 PM



Jun 11, 2008 at 06:59 PM
veroman
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p.2 #16 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


brainiac wrote:
If it is community built, as suggested, I think it will work greatly. However, I suspect that many people who come here want to see both old and new lenses. When someone is looking for a 28mm to use on her 5D, and is prepared to try alts, it would be a real shame not to have a review of the Distagon 28 f2.8. Completeness should be the goal. People on this forum are an encyclopaedia. This could become an important community resource. I know that often I just can't bring myself to discuss the Distagon 28 for the 12th
...Show more

I hear you, and I have to assume ... so does Fred. But I think if we start with a blend of old AND new lenses, ie lenses currently available at the retail level, it will be a long, long while before this particular review page gets going. Starting with new lenses gets it going. The Distagon 28 and so many of the older gems can be added one by one or two by two or eight by eight (whatever) as time goes by.

By any measure, a review page of this type is going to be ... at some point in time ... one of the longest of them all, don't you think?

- Steve

Edited on Jun 11, 2008 at 07:07 PM



Jun 11, 2008 at 07:06 PM
cogitech
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p.2 #17 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


I hope it isn't time to shoot this horse.


Jun 12, 2008 at 07:32 PM
pascal03
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p.2 #18 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


Wasn't this thread pin'd on top...


Jun 12, 2008 at 11:01 PM
bacilonur
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p.2 #19 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


The funny thing is, there are hundreds of reviews for all the popular lenses and bodies already, and we still get hourly 85L vs 85 1.8, 40D vs 5D, and 24-70 vs 24-105 posts.


Jun 17, 2008 at 06:30 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.2 #20 · "Alternative Lenses" review pages!


Thanks for all suggestions. I may start adding a few lenses this weekend.
Best,
Fred



Jun 17, 2008 at 06:37 PM
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