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Archive 2008 · Good D300 kit?

adorski
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p.3 #1 · Good D300 kit?

save your money and go for the best
AF-S 12-24 f/4
AF-S 24-70 f/2.8
AF-S 70-200 f/2.8 VR
AF-S 200-400 f/4

May 09, 2008 at 11:31 PM

James R
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p.3 #2 · Good D300 kit?

Money aside, all but 1 is f2.8:
1. 14-24 and 24-70
2. 24-70 and 105 VR Macro
3. 12-24(f4) and 17-55 (saves a few bucks)

May 10, 2008 at 12:04 AM

tom in mpls
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p.3 #3 · Good D300 kit?

I have seen several reviews that like the Tamron very much. Of course it is a winner on price; if one ignores price differences, please tell me how it compares to some of the other lenses under discussion. Has anyone compared it directly to other lenses being mentioned here?

Edited on May 10, 2008 at 01:48 PM

May 10, 2008 at 01:48 PM

Jammy Straub
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p.3 #4 · Good D300 kit?

tom in mpls wrote:
I have seen several reviews that like the Tamron very much. Of course it is a winner on price; if one ignores price differences, please tell me how it compares to some of the other lenses under discussion. Has anyone compared it directly to other lenses being mentioned here?

Compared to its direct Nikon counterpart the 17-55 f/2.8G SWM the Tamron has an average level of consumer build quality, whereas the Nikon is a tank of a lens. It's also not as fast on the focus department, my experience on Canon tells me the Tamron has a little more tendency to hunt in low light as well. The Tamron is an extending lens while the Nikkor is not (well technically it extends a hair but it's hid by the lends hood.)

Optically they are very similar.

May 10, 2008 at 03:08 PM

tom in mpls
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p.3 #5 · Good D300 kit?

Jammy Straub wrote:
Optically they are very similar.

I favor the Tamron for it's smaller size. If the images are of equal quality, the slower focus and lesser build quality is a trade off I could live with. To me, this is the critical focal range that I would use 98% of the time and the Tammy is the only one that has the full combination of wide aperture, small size, and first rate images. That's my take so far.

May 10, 2008 at 03:27 PM

sflxn
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p.3 #6 · Good D300 kit?

tom in mpls wrote:
I favor the Tamron for it's smaller size. If the images are of equal quality, the slower focus and lesser build quality is a trade off I could live with. To me, this is the critical focal range that I would use 98% of the time and the Tammy is the only one that has the full combination of wide aperture, small size, and first rate images. That's my take so far.

Are you sure the Tamron will always focus properly all the time? One of the reason for getting a D300 is for the amazing autofocus. Plus, the D300 will automatically fix known lens problem with the 17-55/2.8. It's definitely one of the more useful features of the camera. If you're going to spend big money on a D300, you should go all the way. If you're coming from Canon and get a Tamron, what was the point of switching? I can tell you now that the IQ will not be improved over Canon. Well, that was my situation. I switched from the 5D for the D300's build quality and the autofocus system. I made sure I got maximum benefit from the switch. I actually wished the 70-200VR focused as fast as the L version -- feel a little cheated by this.

May 11, 2008 at 03:13 AM

Andre Labonte
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p.3 #7 · Good D300 kit?

May 11, 2008 at 07:00 AM

Mark Kenfield
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p.3 #8 · Good D300 kit?

You may be interested to know that the screw-drive Tamron has now been discontinued, and replaced with a version featuring an internal focussing motor.

May 11, 2008 at 07:18 AM

Tom Conte
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p.3 #9 · Good D300 kit?

TC's experiences with lenses on the D300, here coming from a 5D with a top-end Canon L kit:

18-200VR - overrated, soft corners, bad aperture range for anything but bright daylight
17-55/2.8 - nice lens, but would have liked VR in it. Colors/contrast not quite punchy for some reason
50/1.4D - don't need the D version on a D300, save some cash and use a non-D as a non-CPU lens. Sweet little lens, good bokeh, reasonable build quality (better than Canon 50/1.4, IMHO)
60/2.8D Micro AF - Get this, used. the new AFS version is making the non-S version drop in price. Nice portrait lens on the DX sensor size, very (very) sharp, plus you get a nice macro lens for when bugs and flowers catch your fancy
Sig. 12-24 HSM - Great lens, nice even wide open, and a lot cheaper than the Nikon DX version. Plus it will work on FX once (if) I move to FX.
24-70/2.8 AF-S - The best zoom I've ever used. Wow. Great colors, contrast, sharpness. Prime-quality images throughout its range. 36-105 effective focal length on a DX camera suits my style of shooting (candids) pretty darn well. Save up your lunch money and get this. You won't be disappointed, and it will be the last lens you buy!

Tom

May 11, 2008 at 08:54 AM

Tom Conte
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p.3 #10 · Good D300 kit?

I should add that the 24-70/2.8 is significantly smaller than Canon's 24-70/2.8L. The weight is reasonable on the D300. It's a tad 'long' feeling but you get used to it. It balances and handles much better than the 24-70/2.8L on the 5D. Nikon has built a legend in this lens!

May 11, 2008 at 08:57 AM

tom in mpls
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p.3 #11 · Good D300 kit?

sflxn wrote:
Are you sure the Tamron will always focus properly all the time? One of the reason for getting a D300 is for the amazing autofocus. Plus, the D300 will automatically fix known lens problem with the 17-55/2.8. It's definitely one of the more useful features of the camera. If you're going to spend big money on a D300, you should go all the way. If you're coming from Canon and get a Tamron, what was the point of switching? I can tell you now that the IQ will not be improved over Canon. Well, that was my situation. I switched...Show more →

I was thinking about this possibility, very helpful for someone who knows to confirm this point. One thing is new to me: what is the "known lens problem" with the 17-55/2.8, and what does the D300 "automatically" fix; that is, I'd like to know more about this feature of the camera.

Tom Conte wrote:
Sig. 12-24 HSM - Great lens, nice even wide open, and a lot cheaper than the Nikon DX version. Plus it will work on FX once (if) I move to FX.
24-70/2.8 AF-S - The best zoom I've ever used. Wow. Great colors, contrast, sharpness. Prime-quality images throughout its range. 36-105 effective focal length on a DX camera suits my style of shooting (candids) pretty darn well.

Hi, Tom, glad to bump into you again. Can I ask why you switched from Canon? As to the Sigma, is it free of the yellow cast problem that I am familiar with on the Sigmas? And the 24-70 (sigh) I'd jump on that one in a second for FF shooting, but I do think it does not go wide enough for me. the 12-24 range is nice and I would want it, but it would be used only on occasion since it doesn't go long enough.

Edited on May 11, 2008 at 09:26 AM

May 11, 2008 at 09:21 AM

Avi B
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p.3 #12 · Good D300 kit?

Yeah, I'm interested in knowing this "known lens problem" on the 17-55 too... First I ever heard about it.

May 11, 2008 at 10:47 AM

Tom Conte
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p.3 #13 · Good D300 kit?

tom in mpls wrote:
Hi, Tom, glad to bump into you again. Can I ask why you switched from Canon? As to the Sigma, is it free of the yellow cast problem that I am familiar with on the Sigmas? And the 24-70 (sigh) I'd jump on that one in a second for FF shooting, but I do think it does not go wide enough for me. the 12-24 range is nice and I would want it, but it would be used only on occasion since it doesn't go long enough.

Hi Tom!

I switched because of several reasons. The Nikon ergonomics are better than Canon. Canon used to have a leg up with USM lenses, but Nikon's AF-S selection is now wide enough that it isn't an issue. Canon used to have the upper hand on noise performance, too, but that's gone away.

Canon seems to have a "consumer and high priced top end" philosophy that Nikon doesn't share: the D200 and now the D300 are very reasonably priced. The 40D was a nice camera, but it took forever for Canon to evolve from the D30 to D60 to 10D to 20D to 30D to 40D, with a detour into the 5D. Note that each of them, save perhaps the 30D and 40D, had serious design flaws that Canon could have fixed at the time of introduction. The evolution of those cameras remind me of the joke about Porsche 911 designers: the laziest car designers in the world! Canon's drip-drip-drip approach to rolling out new features sure does maximize their profits, but it also alienates their serious customers in the long run.

Nikon lenses seem to give more bang for the buck, and I like the sharpness and color they show. Nikon isn't without its flaws (read Thom Hogan's site if you want a very critical but balanced list of them!), but they understand pros better.

Watching the 1DIII fiasco and the cynical delay in releasing the 5D so as to push high end amateurs towards the 1DIII, a trick Canon marketing seems to play all the time, caused huge frustration for me. I decided, ok, let's try a D300 and see and it was a pretty quick decision! The D300 is a real pro camera, on the order of an F-series film camera, with no compromises. Heck, Nikon eclipsed their own D2X by introducing it! Way to go, Nikon!

One other amazing thing about Nikons: you can pick up a 30 year old AI lens and mount it on these cameras, then go out shooting! There is a near infinite world of old manual focus glass to play with, if you want to. Amazing!

As for the Sigma, no I have not noticed the infamous yellow cast with that lens. IMHO, it's the best FF wide zoom to be had for under $1k. Get one used or get a very competitive price new at sigma4less.com, either way it's a fantastic lens and one you can use to make cool images like, well, this:

http://k43.pbase.com/g6/60/17560/2/81083685.ZWl3NoPp.jpg

Tom

May 11, 2008 at 11:42 AM

kejago
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p.3 #14 · Good D300 kit?

Very interesting thread. It is really not easy what to choose, especially if you have not had Nikon kit before.

I used to shoot film, with a Canon EOS600. I still have the 35-105, and 100-300L. These are not ultrasonic lenses, more like what Canon originally introduced with the EOS system. However, even at that time, the Nikon F4 was my dream. I chose the Canon EOS based on my requirements and budget at the time. It served me well, and I was happy with it for many years.

Now to jump to from film to digital, and my new quandry: Use these lenses on a Canon 5D (or the 5D mkII), while saving for better lenses, or switch systems totally.

Everything I have read about D300 = fantastic camera. The only thing scarying me a bit, is the choice of lenses and will the 1.5 crop factor be a dead end. Will everything eventually go full frame?. I would only be able to afford the body and one good lens to start off with. With that in mind, where the hell do you start? I do not want to compramise on the lens. It must be good, and it must be able to make the jump should sensor size / crop factor change.

When I make the investment and jump into DSLR, I want to do it right. Threads like this one help, so thanks for all the really good comments.

May 31, 2008 at 07:25 AM

Kuan
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p.3 #15 · Good D300 kit?

I moved recently from Canon to Nikon.

My Nikon kit now includes:
Tokina 12-24 f4
Nikon 17-55 f2.8
SIgma 50-150 f2.8 mkII
Sigma 30 f1.4

My main complaint about Nikon lens line up is the the lack of a pro quality fast wide prime like the 24L or 35L. There are some other nice unique primes in the long end however.

I might drop the Nikon 17-55 as I don't need a zoom in this range and would prefer to pick up a couple other fast primes.

As you can see from my lens line up, I'm not scared to use crop lenses. I believe its a format on its own. Full format all round at the affordable price is far off. THe camera companies are going to continue producing crop cameras for some time to come. They will not become obsolete overnight. If they do, I will buy up a bunch of D300s or is successor and keep on going. No worries.

Kejago, I don't think there is only ONE way to do it right. There are too many variables. Mainly for me is affordability. I bought every single piece of my Nikon kit used (apart from the SIgma 50-150) at thousands of dollars savings. So for me that was doing it right.

May 31, 2008 at 09:21 AM

camerapapi
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p.3 #16 · Good D300 kit?

The gentleman asked about a lens in the 18-80 range and was wiling to go to 12 mm also. Although I see excellent recommendations in the different posts looks to me we are recommending lenses all over the place.
I would say go 17-55 and 12-24 since those are the focal lengths you suggested.
If there is any money left, well talk to us again.
William Rodriguez
Miami, Florida.

May 31, 2008 at 10:15 AM

Spydweb
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p.3 #17 · Good D300 kit?

Picked up a D300, 17-55, and 35 f2 the other day, I find the Nikon glass very good, but the D300 has been kind of a dissapointment to me so far, I know this is a diffrent beast, and is better in many ways then my 5D, maybe I pixel peep to much. I find that the metering using matrix seems to over expose, and I have to use -ev, also I think it is noisy, perhaps the 5D sensor is the best, I don't know.

No flame war intended here, as I have been getting better picts every day I have it, but it just has not wowed me like the 5D did from the start.

Edited on May 31, 2008 at 01:26 PM

May 31, 2008 at 01:25 PM

Jammy Straub
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p.3 #18 · Good D300 kit?

Spydweb wrote:
Picked up a D300, 17-55, and 35 f2 the other day, I find the Nikon glass very good, but the D300 has been kind of a dissapointment to me so far, I know this is a diffrent beast, and is better in many ways then my 5D, maybe I pixel peep to much. I find that the metering using matrix seems to over expose, and I have to use -ev, also I think it is noisy, perhaps the 5D sensor is the best, I don't know.

No flame war intended here, as I have been getting better picts every day I...Show more →

You'll find the D300 meter pushes the histogram as far to the right at possible. It's not always the perfect out of camera exposure, but more often than not it lets you get as much shadow detail as possible without blowing the highlights. You can dial in a global exposure adjustment from one of the menu's that will tailor it to taste.

The on a per-pixel level the 5D does indeed look a hair better, no surprise there really. Properly exposed raw files from each should have a very similar level of noise in my experience. They do have a different look though.

Spend time getting to know the AF options and the actual bodies capabilities, that's where it far outshines the 5D, not necessarily the sensor.

May 31, 2008 at 01:34 PM

Rodolfo Paiz
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p.3 #19 · Good D300 kit?

Spydweb, give yourself time. Each camera maker has different electronics and philosophies, and the cameras will shoot differently. That's not a bad thing, it's what comes from cameras evolving into optical computers. Remember, even the LCD viewers on the back are different!

I'll wager that you are creating most of that noise for yourself. In Nikon cameras, underexposing brings out noise, especially if you then ever have to increase the exposure in PP. Instead, let the camera use its preferred exposure without forcing it down with -EV, then use levels (PS) or black (LR/ACR) to increase the dynamic range and darken the shadows. You'll get an amazing image, with a very, very low noise level.

To help you feel comfortable with the camera's exposure level, I'd suggest you lower the brightness of the camera's rear LCD screen a notch or two. The images will look more like what you want then, and the on-computer results will be far better too, I think.

Moving systems (C-to-N or N-to-C) is not just about changing your gear. You also have to change a fair amount of how you think, how you shoot, and how you process.

May 31, 2008 at 01:44 PM

Spydweb
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p.3 #20 · Good D300 kit?

Jammy, I know you are right, there are many great things about the D300, great autofocus being #1 for me.. It just seems to have a bigger learning curve than I expected.

May 31, 2008 at 01:46 PM

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