Commenting on the 30D being a "tweener": I agree. Not that the name matters all that much, but it should've been called the 20Dn or something similar to the 1D Mark IIn. The 30D didn't really deserve a completely new name. When you consider that the 30D was such a minor upgrade, it's almost like the 40D is actually an upgrade 3 years in the making since the 20D was released.
About the specs, now that you've seen a more complete listing and description of the improvements, does the 40D seem like a more significant upgrade to you? Not everybody will be impressed enough to upgrade, but there are so many significant improvements that it's at least worthy of consideration.
thehawkins wrote:
I preordered the 40D with the 28-135mm lens and it says so on my receipt from Amazon but when I click on the link under Order History it says 18-55mm IS. So I'm confused. No big deal since I might just cancel this and just stick with the body because the last thing I need is another kit lens, despite how sexy this sounds.
Seems like Amazon in just put up the disclaimer that there has been a high volume of preorders and there is no date in terms of their supply after their initial stock. I hope my order is within the first batch. I preordered early so I'm hesistant to cancel for any reason and re-order and be put at the end of the list. I'm sure supply is going to be tight for the first couple of months.
If no one is in a rush there is probably a rebate session this winter - just a couple of months after the release. But no guarantees that the 40D will be on the list for rebate.
Aug 21, 2007 at 01:15 PM
Allen Maestas Offline • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
alfarmer wrote:
It's not a question of whether others think it's a tweener, it's a question of whether or not Canon has made a tweener. Clearly, in hindsight, they did with the 30D. Doesn't mean it's not a good camera or doesn't server people well.
But if Canon wants people like me to upgrade to a 5D++ they'll likely need to have a lot more than a bigger LCD screen. I'm hoping that alone will obviate the value of any 5D upgrade propositions from Canon.
For example, the new 1Ds is clearly an upgrade. But at $7K I'll be sticking with the 5D for a bit longer... :-)
The 5D is an upgrade from the 40D, thus the price difference. You got a 5D so why bother even thinking about a 40D? Seems strange to me? If I could afford a 5D, I would get that over a 40D any day, and so on and so forth. Canon is not trying to rip people off, they are trying to make cameras that people will buy, just like any other manufacturer. People are sure quick to try and put a conspiracy theory on everything.
Pretty simple, the higher the price the better the camera. Now tell yourself, do I need all the features of the $7K camera? No, well maybe the next down the list will meet your needs? Maybe you have a lot of money, and you don't care if you will need all the features, you just want the best camera, well then get what you want.
When it comes down to it, all the manufactures make a decent SLR, and they are all fighting for your business, competition and capitalism are good things. When I started photography, I bought a Canon, because that's what my father used to use. Had he used a Nikon, I would have bought one of those and been just as happy.
alfarmer wrote:
I understand it's an upgrade from the 20D, I just don't see the big jump from the 30D.
Lower noise? How do we know that?
sRAW? Is that significant?
Higher frame rate? I must've read a different spec sheet.
Live view? Meh.
Silent shutter? The 30D was loud?
Viewfinder update? Missed that one in the spec sheet too. I really need to get my info. from somewhere else it seems. (NOT sarcasm! I really mean my source seems to suck.)
Bigger LCD? I thought it was the same size? And nobody seemed to care about the bigger LCD on the 30D...
ISO always on? Could do that with a 30D firmware update.
New menu system? LoL, um, okay...
Digic III and 10MP? That's the only real upgrade as far as I can tell.
Deeper buffer? Of course it's bigger -- because of 10MP. Same number of pictures stored.
So what you all seem to be saying is the 30D was a desperate, revenue-generating release -- as was the MkIIN, apparently. But at least they were honest by marking that an "N" instead of giving it a new model number.
So the lesson is to never buy an in-between model from Canon. How does one know which products are tweeners if they don't apply "N" or something?
LotsToLearn wrote:
Vistek has 'em listed and you can click the buy now button. I don't know if there's an actual waitlist. 40D
Thanks, LotsToLearn, I'll check it out.
Without getting too deep into the cross border shopping debate, I'll just mention that Amazon has a Canadian subsidiary, which I'd be happy to buy from (or any other Canadian company) -- at this point I'm more interested in making sure I get the camera in time for the trip than saving a few dollars. However, I was frustrated by the fact that Amazon.com had a waitlist, but Amazon.ca didn't.
For those that want to see it retail. I just got back from Best Buy and asked about the 40D. The guy looked it up and it shows sales price of $1599.99 with the 28-135 IS USM lense and the available date is Sept. 2, 2007. I saw it on his screen as well so it's not just something he make-up.
thehawkins wrote:
I preordered the 40D with the 28-135mm lens and it says so on my receipt from Amazon but when I click on the link under Order History it says 18-55mm IS. So I'm confused. No big deal since I might just cancel this and just stick with the body because the last thing I need is another kit lens, despite how sexy this sounds.
I also pre-ordered from Amazon with the 28-135mm for $1,499 and it still shows 28-135mm under my order history. I hope it stays that way as the 28-135mm appears to be a more valuable lens than the new 18-55IS.
If the kit comes with the 18-55IS then I also might cancel the order and just purchase the body. But then I know I'm very high on the Amazon list as I ordered right when they accidentally showed the webpage. I'd like to keep my order at Amazon since shipping/tax is free and they've got a lenient return policy.
For us Canadians it looks like Vistek has it for pre-order http://www.vistek.ca/details/details.aspx?WebCode=233536 that is the body only for 1399$. I havent read all 45 pages (stopped after 19) so far they are the only Canadian site to list it. McBain and Henry's do not have it listed yet, will have to check McBain when I get on days off again and pre-order mine.
DallasPhoto wrote:
For those that want to see it retail. I just got back from Best Buy and asked about the 40D. The guy looked it up and it shows sales price of $1599.99 with the 28-135 IS USM lense and the available date is Sept. 2, 2007. I saw it on his screen as well so it's not just something he make-up.
I dont want to ruffle feathers, but the people at my local Best Buy couldnt make up something like this...
Several people have asked so just to be clear: I've never had any intention of buying a 40D. I'm not examining this issue from that perspective, but rather analyzing Canon's behavior in hopes it'll help me better gauge their 5D upgrade offerings in the future. Timing-wise, I'm guessing they'll come out with something next spring. And I don't think of it as merely an emotional choice.
As to whether the 40D is a notable upgrade, it certainly has enough features to justify going from a 20D -- and if I'd just purchased a 30D I'd be angry.
I wonder if Canon will let Rob G. test their two new camera's? I bet not. "Sorry Mr. Galbraith, but we have no pre-production cameras to send you, as a matter of fact, we have no camera's at all to send you" Looks like the two new camera's have reworked AF systems.
Aug 21, 2007 at 03:12 PM
Lars Johnsson Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
Richard Steer wrote:
Just been thinking that I've seen used 1D2 bodies sell for about the same as the 40D will retail at. Throws another interesting option into the mix...
Lars Johnsson wrote:
Where do you see 1D2 cameras for $ 1300 US
NZ$2500, which is currently US$1750. We don't see many, but I've seen a couple sell for approx that in the last few months on the NZ equivalent of Ebay...
Richard Steer wrote:
NZ$2500, which is currently US$1750. We don't see many, but I've seen a couple sell for approx that in the last few months on the NZ equivalent of Ebay...
One item that barely got any mention in the 40D/1DsIII announcement was new versions of the PC software.
DPReview discusses the new picture style editor (http://www.dpreview.com/previews/canoneos40d/page4.asp), but what I find exciting is the the update to DPP coming with the 1DsIII (which I assume will be available for download for all cameras):
Particularly noteworthy in DPP 3.2 is a new Lens Aberration Correction Function that corrects various image defects such as chromatic aberration, color blur, vignetting and distortion. Initially, the Lens Aberration Correction Function will support images captured by the EOS-1Ds Mark III and 11 other EOS Digital SLRs using any of 29 individual EF and EF-S lenses.
That 17-85mm lens is suddenly looking like a much better option.
(I know this functionality has been available from 3rd party vendors, but with Canon bundling it, it brings it to a wider audience.)
"And I don't think of it as merely an emotional choice."
You're responses are full of emotional responses.
Ex. "and if I'd just purchased a 30D I'd be angry." If it were done purely for logical rational, there'd be no anger.
Canon has already told us, through their behavior, what their product cycles are so Canon's products cycles not enigmatic. If you know Canon gear, you know what the features are and what your needs are; emotion and you know what you're looking for in an upgrade, more emotion.. Canon "purposely" half-steps product development rollouts, to keep the buzz alive and us reaching for our credit cards. It's called marketing and they intentionally conspire to mess with our weak kneed emotions. Canon knows what strings they're pulling and most here are onto this string pulling and eagerly continue letting Canon push our emotions around like little push cars.
You asked the question; "How will I know?", so it's not up to you to decide how one answers as what you think has no bearing on anybody's response to your question. Trust me, the answer to "How will I know?", is an emotional response cause if there's no emotional response, you knowing the specs of the camera you're upgrading from (5D to 5D Mk II), then it's not worth upgrading to cause sans the emotion of need, there's no need to upgrade.
When it's worth upgrading to, you'll know and eighteen months later, Canon will come out with another half-step model, just so as to keep the money coming in their direction and we are their willing financial pawns, much as the aphid are to the ants or the taxpayer is to a legislator trying to get reelected via vote curring by spending your legislated tax dollars on someone else's pet project. It's all about emotion and logic has nothing to do with it.
Aug 21, 2007 at 04:03 PM
Lars Johnsson Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
I bet not. "Sorry Mr. Galbraith, but we have no pre-production cameras to send you, as a matter of fact, we have no camera's at all to send you" Looks like the two new camera's have reworked AF systems.
