Tentacle wrote:
...........
Oh well ... The EF-S argument against a non-APS-C sensor for the 40D has been coined before. If I look at the existing EF-S line-up, I can only say that I'm not convinced that the mere existence of EF-S is somehow a guarantee that the xxD range will remain APS-C. There is too much to be gained in image quality by going to a bigger sensor area to let it be railroaded by EF-S.
But that's just my idea/estimation/instinct/guess.
You may be right. But then there is the argument that given that cameras such as
the XTi provide a useful low end (more in terms of cost than IQ) for various reasons, there may well be much to be financially gained by Canon in offering an "upper end"
to the APS-C range in the same way that there are differentiations within marques in
other industries. While the 30D may not be the most popular DSLR in the Canon
lineup, does anyone think that Canon is losing money on it ?
nads wrote:
At least not until the 1DIIII is released
Uh, that really should be the 1DiV, as 4 in roman numerals is IV.... Although I expect that Canon will move to another naming scheme, with the next set of cameras, the 1D space is getting too crowded, and the designations getting to complex.
Janez Nori wrote:
So what do you think about 7-8th March announcements? I'm pretty sure 1Ds mkIII is not going to be announced as well as 6D, because it would hurt the 1Ds mkII sales if Canon intorduced it before mkIII (but I still hope for 5D mkII, with same sensor, but antidust, weather sealing, DIGIC III and some minor improvements). 40D perhaps...
I expect Canon will announce the new 1Ds as soon as they can determine a release date. If anyone was likely to delay purchasing a 1DsMk11 before, they certainly will now, if they can. The new features of the 1D Mk III bode a significant suite of upgrades for the 1Ds Mk III as well...and perhaps even a price not much higher than the current street price of the 1Ds Mk II.
I seriously doubt the 1Ds Mk II is even still in production and Canon Inc probably moved every one out of its shipping channels long ago, so Canon Inc can't make a dime more on it.
About the 30D. It is like a mini 5D, it has picture-style and the bigger back screen,faster dials and access to faster shooting. it has spot meter and alot of little improvements to the 20D . This was a camera that was hearld when introduced(20D) and it shoots(30D) really fast and feels like a camera should. I always feel that. I would like the 5D, but it does sacrifice alot of zoom and with me shooting nature and sports it is a great deal as well as useful camera for my needs. It is a 1/2 of the price of the 5D and is not FF, that is about it. What I don't see is the photographers that are crying over the 8 vs 10 mgs and the sensor cleaner are not mentioning that the XTI is a toy. The feel and overall usefullness of the 30D never comes up as a benefit as if it is no good. The 40D would be great . but the improvements will be like better shocks on a car. They will not magically make a person a better photographer getting this or that improvement, as they find that maybe what was lacking as they say is not in their stars , but in themselves...Rich
I don't know about you guys, but I'm profoundly disappointed in Canon's latest announcement of new products pre-PMA.
Let me explain:
I'm pleased as punch for all the sports and wildlife shooters, photojournalists worldwide who must be lining up for the extraordinary new 1D M III! The list of really significant upgrades is impressive: 14 bit processing (12K more tonal gradations!!); a 50% decrease in shadow noise; 10 fps; two Digic 3 processors; expanded ISO; increased DR; the list goes on.
Oh, & I almost forgot: dust control, jeez, finally dust control; i've just about had it with the cloning and healing brushes!! Changing many lenses in the dusty field means despite all efforts to regularly remove the dreaded bunnies, they always return. How great will it be to slay that irritating and time-consuming dragon!?
As well, finally the release of a hopefully seriously upgraded wide angle zoom to address the long-acknowledged problem of edge and corner softness, especially for FF bodies.
What all this portends for the 1Ds MIII when it finally does come out is just incredible!! All the 1D upgrades plus even more & the new 16-35 is pointing to some serious improvement in IQ.. As a fine arts landscape photographer I constantly compete with medium and large format film shooters and I've been anxiously awaiting Canon's 1Ds upgrade.
And that's the problem and thus the disapointment: HOW MUCH LONGER DO I HAVE TO WAIT!!!?? Nothing at Photokina, 2006; nothing now for PMA; and no real major shows for the rest of the year, at least none that Canon has any history of making major product announcements. Two major shows, rumors galore, daily monitoring of Keith's Northlight website, huge hopes built up only to be dashed!!
One can only hope that for all the important Canon anniversaries this year it just has to mean they'll be announcing this long-awaited and overdue upgrade sometime this year.
But still, it means that with product lag after the eventual announcement and the inevitable rush to upgrade that should come from shooters eager to upgrade their now three year old 1Ds: man, it could be well into 2008 before I can get my hands on a new one.
Anyone else out there feeling the pain??
Edited by D. von Briesen on Feb 25, 2007 at 12:20 PM GMT
It takes an enormous amount of money to design and retool for a new model and a high end model will be very expensive and sell a lot less than a 400D
By making the 1D3 Canon have leapt ahead of Nikon in the eyes of most photographers but they seem to feel that the really high end camera can wait. I think it is just economies of scale - they will sell a lot more 1D3's than they will 1DsIII's
It will come, in the mean time for the stuff you do a 1DsII or a 5D will do you just as well
I don't see how you are saying it's 'over due' for an update. I guess I don't really feel your pain, the 1Ds2 does everything it needs to for me. I'd love to have better shadow noise (not that it's bad right now anyway...) and more dynamic range, but I don't think the 1Ds2 is by any means absolutely needing an update.
They're going to milk everybody's wallets using the Mk3 first, and when the ASP drops (average selling price), the sales volume drops, or competition steps up, then that's when they'll introduce the 1DsMk3. Canon has no reason to release that now.
Intel has also been playing this game with us for decades. We should be used to it by now...
Well, don't get me wrong, it's a damn fine camera. It and its FF predecessor were and continue to be groundbreaking. I've sold many a fine art gallery print as large as 36"x72" (a three shot pano merge admitted) so it's been good to me.
It's not that there's anything inherantly wrong with the 1Ds but for landscape, some of the innovations of the new 1D will be especially welcome. Dust removal is a no brainer. Those 12K extra tonal gradations will bring a large increase in IQ especially in large prints as will the 50% decrease in shadow noise. The extra dynamic range always helps when shooting wide DR landscapes (always!). The 5D hinted at what promises to be even greater IQ with the new Digic III processor. My bet is people will be ecstatic over the IQ improvments of the 1DMIII.
As well, while not absolutely necessary, the little improvements will make life easier. I'm sure they'll finally address the mirror lock-up problem (a 4 button push menu item as I'm sure many of you know only too well). As will an easier system for multi-image exposure bracketing to integrate better with Photoshop's steady improvments in HDR capabiliites. A larger LCD will be nice. Lighter, with longer lasting Li batteries, means the world to hard hiking backcountry landscape shooters.
And although it's not going to be particularly significant increase in overall resolution, the anticipated 22mp with all the aforementioned improvements to IQ will raise the bar even higher.
Given the product cycle has been about 2 years with the two previous FF models of the 1 series, what is now looking to be at least 3 years is fairly long. Think of the list of Canon cameras that have come out since the 1Ds M2.
It's been a great camera for me (and will continue to be for the near future) and I certainly understand all the economics of expensive R & D combined with relatively low sales. But if the camera on the whole wasn't a money maker in some form or another, why would they continue to produce it? Having the world's most sophisticated and highest quality digital SLR camera certainly doesn't hurt company prestige and I guarantee you they're making money on it.
I know sales are much higher of a 1DM3 and they have a constant need to compete with Nikon for the sports and photojournalists of the world. The incredible improvements of the 1DM3 will mean continued control of that market share for quite some time.
I just can't help but envy all those placing their orders as we speak.
Canon is already *MILES* ahead of it's nearest competitor IMHO and has no real reason to feel pressured.
They sell gazillions of 400D's, millions of 40D's and hundreds of thousands of 1D3's with Nikon having no product anything like the 1DsII.
Canon is in a safe place and also coming up against the 'theoretical limits' of the current lenses. It is perfectly possible they could produce the most fantastic 1DsIII that wouldn't shine because of resolution limits - that would be rather a problem!
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if the next 1Ds series was just a 1D3 with a mildly upgraded 1DsII sensor - which could then be priced more competitively
It appears Canon is really working the final bugs out of the 1Ds III. I'm know it's a bummer waiting for what seems like forever, but I'll bet the 1Ds III will be worth the wait and Canon's extra effort will be well received. It'll be announced this fall I'm sure.
I'd crop to the sweet spot in FF anyway just like I always do with 35mm film so I wouldn't mind an APS-C xxD with some of the 1D3 features.
There's two sides to this. First, APS-H sits in between APS-C and full frame. So with APS-H you still drop the outer regions of the full image projection circle.
And then there is the new EF 16-35/2.8L Mk II. With, according to Canon, better edge performance. That pretty much makes it clear in which direction Canon wants to go, doesn't it?
D. von Briesen wrote:
Anyone else out there feeling the pain??
not really. while the 1Ds3 will undoubtedly be capable of recording higher-quality images, i as a photographer will still be making the same photos. some of the new features will make my job easier but i don't feel limited by my equipment -- even if the only tool in my hands is a 35mm disposable with a fixed polycarbonate lens.
the 1Ds has done an excellent job for me over the last few years, recorded some great images, made some money, and put some smiles on people's faces along the way. for that i have no complaints or disappointment.
sometimes we get so caught up in the gear that we forget that it's the end result that matters, regardless of what was used to make the image.
with that said, i can't wait until the 1Ds3 is announced. i'm ready for the upgrade, that's for sure.
Seriously - if you want the best results, get the best lens you can afford and don't crop.
____________________________
Richard
After 3 years of experimenting, I have arrived at the same conclusion. By the way, the 3D has the same pixel diameter as the 1Ds2....7.2 microns. With the appropriate lens fitted, shouldn't this yield the same detail ?
dhphoto wrote:
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if the next 1Ds series was just a 1D3 with a mildly upgraded 1DsII sensor - which could then be priced more competitively
David
I think that's all some of us would like. The usability and ergonomic changes with the 1D III fix almost every gripe I have ever had with the EOS-1 bodies. I no longer lust after a D2X.
?? Nothing at Photokina, 2006; nothing now for PMA; and no real major shows for the rest of the year, at least none that Canon has any history of making major product announcements. Two major shows, rumors galore, daily monitoring of Keith's Northlight website, huge hopes built up only to be dashed!!