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Archive 2006 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

rfmiranda
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p.4 #1 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

jaapv wrote:
I am really surprised that nobody that reported banding seems to have used the relevant filter in Capture One. After reading most of the excitement on the forums across the net I came to the conclusion that we are talking about a relatively minor issue imo.

looking at discussions on other fora, most of those with the banding issue (and there are many) have indeed used the filter to no effect.

Nov 06, 2006 at 11:30 AM

jaapv
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p.4 #2 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

Yes you're right, I found some as well now. I also found somebody who had removed banding pretty effectively with Band Aide by Quantum Mechanics. I'll have to try it out as well, as soon as I have my camera this week. Personally �'m not worried, as I only make a few of such shots per year and I'm confident the problem will be solved shortly. Not only Nikon, but several high-level Canons, as I recall even the 1Ds, had this problem as well and I never hear any complaints from owners any more nowadays.

Nov 06, 2006 at 01:20 PM

jaapv
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p.4 #3 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

woodyspedden wrote:
I cannot recommend the magnifier enough, even on film camera's, I "cannot" use my 75 lux without it... But I doubt that you'll put it on permanently. You cannot see the 28 and 24 framelines with it in place on the M8. Fortunately it has a nifty little chain to attach it to the camera and an elegant little leather bag on the camera strap.

Nov 06, 2006 at 01:24 PM

kosmoskatten
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p.4 #4 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

Also bear in mind that focusing a RF is a whole other story than focusing a SLR.
If you focus close up with the 50/1.4 and then swivel the camera some you also shift the focal plane as you recompose - something you easily compensate for with the focusing screen on a SLR but it can easily be overlooked when new into RF. There are various techniques as how to work it and at first I found it hard for close range photography with the M7 and the 50/2 but as I got the hang of it it was quite easy.

Nov 06, 2006 at 03:21 PM

jaapv
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p.4 #5 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

And there is a thing called focus shift, which particularly affects wide aperture lenses like the Noctilux and Summiluxes. When closing the diaphragm the plane of focus will shift, in the case of the Noctilux towards the camera. Not much, but on a digital camera, that has a more defined DOF than a film camera, and with files that will be viewed at 100% (which one does rather seldomly on film) this will become visible.

Nov 06, 2006 at 03:41 PM

J. Borger
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p.4 #6 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

kidigital wrote:
Jaap, I'm looking forward to experimenting with this. I really like to shoot as close to wide open as I can whenever possible (personal preference, especially as gloomy, dark winter approaches.) I've had ok luck with the r-d1 and 75lux and noctilux, but want to see if in-focus shooting will be better with the M8. I haven't seen many people posting images with the 75lux yet to be able to draw any conclusions without trying myself (hopefully tomorrow.)

Kurt
Kurt,

I have no problems focussing the Noctilux on the R-D1.
But the 75 Lux at the R-D1 is hit and miss .. so i never used it in the past.

For two days i am almost exclusively using the Noctilux and the 75 Lux wide open on the M8 .. and focus is like a charm.
Much easier .. flewent .... in fact i did not miss focus once in perhaps 100 shots . wide open .. close up.

But you have to get that 1,25 magnifier, ... without the view is very limited, especially compared to the R-D1.

I really can't imagine somebody using a 90mm lens on the M8 even with the magnifier .. unless perhaps for portraits close-up.

Kind regards
Han

Nov 06, 2006 at 04:50 PM

jaapv
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p.4 #7 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

I'm envious, Han. I'm just marking time until I get my hands on this marvellous machine....

Nov 06, 2006 at 05:31 PM

J. Borger
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p.4 #8 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

kidigital wrote:
Do you have any images on your site with the M8 and the 75lux wide open?
Kurt
No, not yet.
Just testing on some people who do not like their picture on the net ....

Nov 06, 2006 at 05:46 PM

J. Borger
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p.4 #9 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

jaapv wrote:
I'm envious, Han. I'm just marking time until I get my hands on this marvellous machine....
Jaap .. the 75 lux is probably the lens i like most so far ... especially for B&W..... nice deep B&W with beautiful tonality.... just gorgeous.
I had that lens brand new in my closet for almost 2 years because use of it on the R-D1 just was not practical! On the point of selling it several times .. just glad i did not!

Nov 06, 2006 at 05:50 PM

carstenw
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p.4 #10 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

carstenw wrote:
Tom, I am having trouble focusing, but the occasional shot is really sharp, so it is just me so far. I do seem to be improving slightly, but given that I am still at work (!), it will have to wait until the evenings. I would have liked to get the 28/2.8 Asph. as well, but it is on order, so I will have to wait.

I do plan to hang on to my 5D a little, but already, when I am careful, the M8 shots are a little sharper than the 5D shots. The noise is much higher on the...Show more →

It turns out that the noise looks worse on the screen on the back of the camera than on the computer, although the 5D still beats the M8 handily. Still, I am happy enough with the M8. The raw converters seem to be able to handle the noise pattern well. The aliasing I see on the back of the M8 is also handled better by the raw converters.

I did manage to see a very small amount of purple fringing, but nothing more than the Leica lenses I use with my 5D. The banding I saw I had to work so hard to get that I am not worried at this point. I also trust Leica to do something about it. Apparently they are working hard on it.

Here are my overall impressions, which I don't want to repost here. I find that I like to post M8 stuff on LCU:

http://www.leica-camera-user.com/digital-forum/8800-m8-impressions.html

Nov 06, 2006 at 06:19 PM

carstenw
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p.4 #11 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

Guy Mancuso wrote:
Carsten congrats on the M8 , can't believe you beat me and i am having no freaking luck at all. Starting to get pissed. Should have got the silver when I had the chance

I feel so sorry that I got mine before you got yours, Guy. If anyone deserves it, it is you. I hope you get it soon. Focus on something else, and before you know it you will get a call.

AGeoJO wrote:
The viewfinder magnification of the M8 is less than that of the typical film M cameras, making it a tad more difficult to focus. Since you have an f/1.4 lens that is optically great at larger apertures, chances are you barely stop the lens down, creating shallow DoF. If I am not mistaken, the M8 uses 0.58 or 0.62 or something like that instead of the standard 0.72. You should consider getting a magnifier, like 1.25 (Leica) or 1.3 (Japanese version) for easier focusing. I plan to put one on permanently on my M8 when I get it.

The magnification is 0.68x, almost the same. Still, I am buying the loupe tomorrow. I have already decided.

Is the banding apparent on high ISO shots only? Is that similar to those of the high ISO shots of a bearded man that Paoletto took?

I had to take a picture of chandelier with crystal pendants to get something. I would not worry about it yet, if I were you. It seems that it is quite possible to provoke, but it doesn't happen in all the situations you might fear. I walked home from a cafe tonight, taking pictures of all store windows with bright lights I could, and only managed to get it twice. It seems somehow quite specific, and I don't see the pattern yet.

kidigital wrote:
Excellent news Carsten. Had to be tempted to play hooky from work, no? Looks like my chrome version will be arriving tomorrow. As Joshua has indicated, as soon as my M8 arrives, I will be attaching a magnifier. I want to be able to use the 75lux a lot and I'm guessing that the magnifier will be critical for large aperature shooting.

Well, I did leave 1/2 hour early... :) I went to my other camera store today, and saw a 75 Lux for sale, almost as new, for �1700. If someone wants it, let me know, and I will tell you which store. I was tempted, but I have a vaccuum in my wallet, and I think I will get the Apo-75 instead. It is smaller and sharper...

About focusing, I was not trying to take beautifully composed shots today, just focus and shoot, no stopping down, no recomposing, nothing. Just concentrate, focus, shoot, to see if I could focus. I failed most of the time :) I will learn it. Maybe I need a diopter for it. My vision is not perfect, although on my right eye it is probably close to the -0,50 that Leica claims is built into the M8. I will schedule an eye appointment.

I love the camera. I had it sitting next to me on the bench in the cafe today, and it occurred to me how natural it felt there. I think I have found my camera. I love the 5D, but I always felt self-conscious with it. With the M8, I feel relaxed. It just has to let me focus it properly, and our relationship will be well. Oh, and I need to figure out that magenta thing.

Nov 06, 2006 at 06:29 PM

osera
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p.4 #12 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

Just a little walking around today with the 90cron on the M8. I used the 1.25 magnifier. All were at iso 160. Mostly cloudy skies.

Images seem very DMR-like to me on this first pass, more like the R 90 than the R 80.

Here's a full frame. (?f/8)

Nov 06, 2006 at 06:40 PM

osera
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p.4 #13 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

and a crop.

Nov 06, 2006 at 06:41 PM

osera
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p.4 #14 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

another full frame, probably around f/2.8.

Nov 06, 2006 at 06:43 PM

osera
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p.4 #15 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

and a crop.

(These are basically right out of the camera, converted in C1, with resizing. I think, like the DMR files, they look so much better on my calibrated monitor than on the web. I need to try some prints.)

Exposure was A. They seemed a tiny bit hot, I might try backing off half a stop or so next time.

Nov 06, 2006 at 06:45 PM

DaveEP
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p.4 #16 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

Great stuff Allen. Really looking forward to mine, but alas I am way down the list.... looks like January best guess, with one dealer telling me April !

Nov 06, 2006 at 06:47 PM

carstenw
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p.4 #17 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

How do you get full frame? My M8 is 1.33x crop...

:)

Nov 06, 2006 at 06:55 PM

osera
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p.4 #18 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

What? Your M8 must be defective!

Yes, you are correct. I should say they are uncropped.

Nov 06, 2006 at 06:58 PM

jeff weir
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p.4 #19 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

Very pretty shot of the lilly pads. One of the best M8 shots so far. Keep up the good work
Jeff

Nov 06, 2006 at 07:10 PM

osera
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p.4 #20 · �Hands-On� Leica M8

Guy-

My first impression is that I like it better than I thought I would. With the 1.25 magnifier, focusing is quite easy. (No obvious front focusing.) My 90 is a bit stiff to focus, probably need to have that smoothed out. Color, sharpness and OOF areas are really good to my eye so far.

Have you tried a long lens on a rangefinder yet? Just like on film, you see a fully sharp image throught the viewfinder, then a razor thin DOF on the image. With digital, this aspect is really well seen and also with instant feedback, and I think will get me much better results with this lens than I ever got with film. That's just me.

The lens on the camera balances nicely, gives me something to hang on to.

Any luck on the M8 hunt?

Nov 06, 2006 at 07:19 PM

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