Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
p.2 #1Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
RoamingScott wrote:
You would think Nikon would have noticed with the Zf but they have always been overly cautious about where and when they place bets on development. The upside is that they generally get it right the first time? I think they are also stuck in their old conception of a pro photographer.All of these Japanese corporations move at a glacial pace and lack the ability to respond with the market. I'm currently working with one in a totally unrelated industry and running into so many silly roadblocks that simply don't exist here.
May be, but until the Chinese enter the camera market, it’s Japanese tradition or Leica/Hasselblad. Not like anyone else is moving fast.
ottokbre wrote
Make cameras exciting and they sell.You would think Nikon would have noticed with the Zf but they have always been overly cautious about where and when they place bets on development. The upside is that they generally get it right the first time? I think they are also stuck in their old conception of a pro photographer.
May be, but until the Chinese enter the camera market, it’s Japanese tradition or Leica/Hasselblad. Not like anyone else is moving fast.
Aug 22, 2026 at 11:52 AM
p.2 #2Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
Cliff L. wrote:
One of Nikon's biggest challenges is trying to convince their aging customer base that mirrorless cameras are not just a fad,
Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.
On which supposed facts do you base those insights?
One of Nikon's biggest challenges is trying to convince their aging customer base that mirrorless cameras are not just a fad,
Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.
On which supposed facts do you base those insights?
Aug 22, 2026 at 11:55 AM
p.2 #3Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
johnvanr wrote:
Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.On which supposed facts do you base those insights?
The fact that Nikon has lost enough market share to be overtaken by Fuji for the number 3 spot worldwide... have you not been paying attention?
Cliff L. wrote
One of Nikon's biggest challenges is trying to convince their aging customer base that mirrorless cameras are not just a fad,Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.
The fact that Nikon has lost enough market share to be overtaken by Fuji for the number 3 spot worldwide... have you not been paying attention?
Aug 22, 2026 at 12:06 PM
p.2 #4Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
Cliff L. wrote:
Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.On which supposed facts do you base those insights?The fact that Nikon has lost enough market share to be overtaken by Fuji for the number 3 spot worldwide... have you not been paying attention?
And based on that you know that Nikon has an aging customer base compared to Fuji? And you know that they don’t understand the market?
As others have said, we don’t even know exactly what the numbers mean.
johnvanr wrote
Cliff L. wrote
One of Nikon's biggest challenges is trying to convince their aging customer base that mirrorless cameras are not just a fad,Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.
And based on that you know that Nikon has an aging customer base compared to Fuji? And you know that they don’t understand the market?
As others have said, we don’t even know exactly what the numbers mean.
Aug 22, 2026 at 12:16 PM
p.2 #5Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
johnvanr wrote:
Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.On which supposed facts do you base those insights?
I like this quote I found on Reddit:
"Demanding "sources" and "evidence" every time someone gives an opinion only demonstrates laziness and mental apathy"
Cliff L. wrote
One of Nikon's biggest challenges is trying to convince their aging customer base that mirrorless cameras are not just a fad,Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.
I like this quote I found on Reddit:
"Demanding "sources" and "evidence" every time someone gives an opinion only demonstrates laziness and mental apathy"
Aug 22, 2026 at 01:10 PM
p.2 #6Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
Cliff L. wrote:
Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.On which supposed facts do you base those insights?I like this quote I found on Reddit:
"Demanding "sources" and "evidence" every time someone gives an opinion only demonstrates laziness and mental apathy"
Sometimes it is a politer way of saying, "It looks like you are just making stuff up." :-)
Especially since we know that 94.3% of such facts are just made up.
And if you aren't just making stuff up, you get the chance to share the source and provide it.
I will agree that asking for a source or evidence "every time" someone gives an opinion isn't necessary. But when someone says something like "Nikon's customer base is aging," it isn't unreasonable to ask where that comes from.
Finally, if it is just your "feeling," you can easily anticipate and sidestep that follow-up question by writing something like "what feels to me like they have an aging customer base, and it is my personal impression that they think mirrorless is a fad."
See? Easy.
johnvanr wrote
Cliff L. wrote
One of Nikon's biggest challenges is trying to convince their aging customer base that mirrorless cameras are not just a fad,Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.
"Demanding "sources" and "evidence" every time someone gives an opinion only demonstrates laziness and mental apathy"
Sometimes it is a politer way of saying, "It looks like you are just making stuff up." :-)
Especially since we know that 94.3% of such facts are just made up.
And if you aren't just making stuff up, you get the chance to share the source and provide it.
I will agree that asking for a source or evidence "every time" someone gives an opinion isn't necessary. But when someone says something like "Nikon's customer base is aging," it isn't unreasonable to ask where that comes from.
Finally, if it is just your "feeling," you can easily anticipate and sidestep that follow-up question by writing something like "what feels to me like they have an aging customer base, and it is my personal impression that they think mirrorless is a fad."
See? Easy.
Aug 22, 2026 at 09:09 PM
p.2 #7Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
Just imagine if Fuji gets hold of a competent CAF algorithm 😶
Aug 22, 2026 at 11:34 PM
p.2 #8Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
Cliff L. wrote:
Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.On which supposed facts do you base those insights?I like this quote I found on Reddit:
"Demanding "sources" and "evidence" every time someone gives an opinion only demonstrates laziness and mental apathy"
I actually think stating something as a fact that most likely is just an opinion demonstrates laziness and mental apathy.
But at least you admit that what you said is your opinion and not something you actually know to be true.
johnvanr wrote
Cliff L. wrote
One of Nikon's biggest challenges is trying to convince their aging customer base that mirrorless cameras are not just a fad,Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.
"Demanding "sources" and "evidence" every time someone gives an opinion only demonstrates laziness and mental apathy"
I actually think stating something as a fact that most likely is just an opinion demonstrates laziness and mental apathy.
But at least you admit that what you said is your opinion and not something you actually know to be true.
Aug 22, 2026 at 11:48 PM
p.2 #9Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
Cliff L. wrote:
One of Nikon's biggest challenges is trying to convince their aging customer base that mirrorless cameras are not just a fad,
Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.
Heh, there is a truth in this
In my camera club I see many loyal D850 users - that camera is just too good and well liked.
Nikon has very loyal use base among nature and sports photographers. Also journalism to some extend. Z9 and 8 serve those photographers very well, much like D850.
Camera market as whole is too small for all the companies and brands we have. When sales go down and products are niche, we might see more companies such as Pentax/Ricoh who just recycle the basically same camera in endless new iterations (talking about GR here). I hope Fujifilm and Nikon are still above this limit.
One of Nikon's biggest challenges is trying to convince their aging customer base that mirrorless cameras are not just a fad,
Nikon might not be worried (since they apparently no longer understand the market) but I imagine their shareholders might start feeling a little less complacent.
Heh, there is a truth in this
In my camera club I see many loyal D850 users - that camera is just too good and well liked.Nikon has very loyal use base among nature and sports photographers. Also journalism to some extend. Z9 and 8 serve those photographers very well, much like D850.
Camera market as whole is too small for all the companies and brands we have. When sales go down and products are niche, we might see more companies such as Pentax/Ricoh who just recycle the basically same camera in endless new iterations (talking about GR here). I hope Fujifilm and Nikon are still above this limit.
Aug 23, 2026 at 02:00 AM
p.2 #10Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
gdanmitchell wrote:
Fujifilm has certainly had some very popular — and in my view interesting — “serious photography” (whatever that means) products over the past decade plus. But they also have apparently made a ton of money selling the distinctly consumer Instax gear.
In 2025 Fuji sold more Instax cameras than all digital camera manufacturers combined. Which, and this sounds funny, means that film camreas continue to outsell digital cameras world-wide.
I admire Fujifilm. They outsmarted Kodak and survived the collapse of the film era through aggressive diversification, they outsmarted Socanikon via differentiation and focus... The results are the highest margins in the industry. And on top of that, they came back with a film product that eclipsed all digital gear by volume. Great business people, if only they stopped employing raccoons as software engineers and squirrels as UI designers...
Fujifilm has certainly had some very popular — and in my view interesting — “serious photography” (whatever that means) products over the past decade plus. But they also have apparently made a ton of money selling the distinctly consumer Instax gear.
In 2025 Fuji sold more Instax cameras than all digital camera manufacturers combined. Which, and this sounds funny, means that film camreas continue to outsell digital cameras world-wide.
I admire Fujifilm. They outsmarted Kodak and survived the collapse of the film era through aggressive diversification, they outsmarted Socanikon via differentiation and focus... The results are the highest margins in the industry. And on top of that, they came back with a film product that eclipsed all digital gear by volume. Great business people, if only they stopped employing raccoons as software engineers and squirrels as UI designers...
Aug 25, 2026 at 11:12 PM
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p.2 #11Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
But that is the example where what does market share mean if the per camera average is only a couple hundred?
Is Funji > Nikon in average digital camera selling price and total Yens also?
EBH
Is Funji > Nikon in average digital camera selling price and total Yens also?
EBH
Aug 26, 2026 at 05:11 PM
p.2 #12Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
The major camera companies have been battling it out for decades. That will never end. The difference now is the quality of photos that can be taken with a smartphone and the 3rd party apps that drive those cameras keep evolving as well.
That alone has taken a huge bite out of the camera makers' market sector. I don't see that changing either. I see that market getting even more competitive for camera makers.
Far fewer people in society buy dedicated cameras now because they carry one in their pocket every day anyway. I'm 68 and grew up with cameras. For most of my life it seemed as though just about everyone had one - even if it was just a Kodak Instamatic or Polaroid. That market has been turned on end with the advent and technology leaps in smartphone cameras.
The way I look at i now, the camera market, in some ways, is a niche market aimed at certain target customer groups. That's a totally different market dynamic the camera makers have not had to battle against.
I added the Leica camera app to my iPhone recently. All I will say is that it's pretty darn good. This coming from a person that owns three Leica's.
I think the camera makers need to invent new ideas that are outside the box they currently work in. And the competition for market share goes on...
That alone has taken a huge bite out of the camera makers' market sector. I don't see that changing either. I see that market getting even more competitive for camera makers.
Far fewer people in society buy dedicated cameras now because they carry one in their pocket every day anyway. I'm 68 and grew up with cameras. For most of my life it seemed as though just about everyone had one - even if it was just a Kodak Instamatic or Polaroid. That market has been turned on end with the advent and technology leaps in smartphone cameras.
The way I look at i now, the camera market, in some ways, is a niche market aimed at certain target customer groups. That's a totally different market dynamic the camera makers have not had to battle against.
I added the Leica camera app to my iPhone recently. All I will say is that it's pretty darn good. This coming from a person that owns three Leica's.
I think the camera makers need to invent new ideas that are outside the box they currently work in. And the competition for market share goes on...
Aug 26, 2026 at 06:04 PM
p.2 #13Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
DrLogik wrote:
The major camera companies have been battling it out for decades. That will never end. The difference now is the quality of photos that can be taken with a smartphone and the 3rd party apps that drive those cameras keep evolving as well.
That alone has taken a huge bite out of the camera makers' market sector. I don't see that changing either. I see that market getting even more competitive for camera makers.
Far fewer people in society buy dedicated cameras now because they carry one in their pocket every day anyway. I'm 68 and grew up with cameras. For...Show more →
Kids and young adults want cameras- What they don’t want is the camera of their fathers- They want the camera of their grandfathers with some modern flare-
The best example of that is the camera no one ever talks about or uses on this forum…..Fuji’s #1 seller
The major camera companies have been battling it out for decades. That will never end. The difference now is the quality of photos that can be taken with a smartphone and the 3rd party apps that drive those cameras keep evolving as well.
That alone has taken a huge bite out of the camera makers' market sector. I don't see that changing either. I see that market getting even more competitive for camera makers.
Far fewer people in society buy dedicated cameras now because they carry one in their pocket every day anyway. I'm 68 and grew up with cameras. For...Show more →
Kids and young adults want cameras- What they don’t want is the camera of their fathers- They want the camera of their grandfathers with some modern flare-
The best example of that is the camera no one ever talks about or uses on this forum…..Fuji’s #1 seller
Aug 27, 2026 at 09:17 AM
p.2 #14Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
The camera in the phone is marvellous, always with you, at least as good IQ as a P&S managed. Great for capturing significant moments in life. But not easy to control if even possible.
All you need in a camera is the ability to control shutter speed, aperture and focus, in combination you want to give output you can 'process' after to get the image you want. That hasn't changedwith electronics.
Automation is often a distraction, usually 'averages', and you spend time modifying what it gives, take control yourself from the start.
Knobs, bells and whistles attract sales from equipment collectors, good for business but rarely good for the artistic quality of the images.
Gerry
All you need in a camera is the ability to control shutter speed, aperture and focus, in combination you want to give output you can 'process' after to get the image you want. That hasn't changedwith electronics.
Automation is often a distraction, usually 'averages', and you spend time modifying what it gives, take control yourself from the start.
Knobs, bells and whistles attract sales from equipment collectors, good for business but rarely good for the artistic quality of the images.
Gerry
Aug 27, 2026 at 12:38 PM
p.2 #15Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
RustyRus wrote:
Kids and young adults want cameras- What they don’t want is the camera of their fathers- They want the camera of their grandfathers with some modern flare-
I have a theory that this pattern of rejecting what was popular with parents and embracing what was popular with grandparents is more general than just being about photography.
I’ve seen it in the music field to some extent, and I think you can find elements of it in politics. (Though that’s a little more muddled.)
As for smartphone cameras: They match or exceed (really, exceed) the IQ from the P&S cameras, and they have all of the pluses of small size (zero extra size — or cost! ‚ if you carry a phone anyway), tons of storage, easy sharing, etc. It is easy to see why the P&S business basically tanked. (It isn’t gone, and if you travel you still do see some people with P&S cameras, but not many.)
But, in a rough way, the relationship between old P&S and “serious” film cameras was a lot like the relationship between the smartphone camera and today's serious cameras: most people will be happy with the former but some will graduate to the latter.
(edited)
Kids and young adults want cameras- What they don’t want is the camera of their fathers- They want the camera of their grandfathers with some modern flare-
I have a theory that this pattern of rejecting what was popular with parents and embracing what was popular with grandparents is more general than just being about photography.
I’ve seen it in the music field to some extent, and I think you can find elements of it in politics. (Though that’s a little more muddled.)
As for smartphone cameras: They match or exceed (really, exceed) the IQ from the P&S cameras, and they have all of the pluses of small size (zero extra size — or cost! ‚ if you carry a phone anyway), tons of storage, easy sharing, etc. It is easy to see why the P&S business basically tanked. (It isn’t gone, and if you travel you still do see some people with P&S cameras, but not many.)
But, in a rough way, the relationship between old P&S and “serious” film cameras was a lot like the relationship between the smartphone camera and today's serious cameras: most people will be happy with the former but some will graduate to the latter.
(edited)
Aug 27, 2026 at 12:55 PM
p.2 #16Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
gdanmitchell wrote:
I have a theory that this pattern of rejecting what was popular with parents and embracing what was popular with grandparents is more general than just being about photography.
But for how long? I'm not seeing an increase in attention span. After the initial use of old stuff the novelty tends to wear out.
EBH
I have a theory that this pattern of rejecting what was popular with parents and embracing what was popular with grandparents is more general than just being about photography.
But for how long? I'm not seeing an increase in attention span. After the initial use of old stuff the novelty tends to wear out.
EBH
Aug 27, 2026 at 11:06 PM
p.2 #17Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
EB-1 wrote:
But for how long? I'm not seeing an increase in attention span. After the initial use of old stuff the novelty tends to wear out.
EBH
But that has also always been the case. It is not a new thing to see people “get into photography,” buy some fancy new gear, use it for a while, and move on to a different hobby.
I’m not saying that things will play out exactly the same as they did in the pre-digital era, but I think that the parallels are likely to be pretty strong, based on consumer behavior.
It isn’t just photography, by the way. I’ve seen lots of people “get into music,” buy an instrument, become very excited about it, only to eventually realize that it isn’t their main thing. (And, yes, some recent age do get even more serious, but the majority don’t.) We see it with sports, too — think of all the folks who, for example, “get into cycling” for a while and eventually the passion wanes. And on and on…
gdanmitchell wrote
I have a theory that this pattern of rejecting what was popular with parents and embracing what was popular with grandparents is more general than just being about photography.EBH
But that has also always been the case. It is not a new thing to see people “get into photography,” buy some fancy new gear, use it for a while, and move on to a different hobby.
I’m not saying that things will play out exactly the same as they did in the pre-digital era, but I think that the parallels are likely to be pretty strong, based on consumer behavior.
It isn’t just photography, by the way. I’ve seen lots of people “get into music,” buy an instrument, become very excited about it, only to eventually realize that it isn’t their main thing. (And, yes, some recent age do get even more serious, but the majority don’t.) We see it with sports, too — think of all the folks who, for example, “get into cycling” for a while and eventually the passion wanes. And on and on…
Aug 28, 2026 at 08:40 AM
p.2 #18Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
gdanmitchell wrote:
I have a theory that this pattern of rejecting what was popular with parents and embracing what was popular with grandparents is more general than just being about photography.
That's a pretty well-known concept already, sometimes referred to in pop-sci circles as a "pendulum effect"
RustyRus wrote
Kids and young adults want cameras- What they don’t want is the camera of their fathers- They want the camera of their grandfathers with some modern flare-That's a pretty well-known concept already, sometimes referred to in pop-sci circles as a "pendulum effect"
Aug 28, 2026 at 08:47 AM
p.2 #19Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
I think we're all yearning for a bit more... tangibility? As was pointed out above, point & shoots make no sense from a practical standpoint; phones are better in basically every way, significantly less idiosyncratic and several orders of magnitude more convenient. And yet, The Camera as a standalone object seems to have more talismanic power now than it ever has. I'm 36, so I remember going to parties in 2007 and 2008 where the only cameras present were point & shoots, and people were like, "oh, cool, someone brought a camera." Nowadays, when I take my P&S out at a party, it's cradled and revered almost like its a biblical artifact.
I've also noticed that, in a world where everyone is so conscious of not just how they look but *how they look in pictures*, younger people are gravitating towards P&S cameras because they actually have worse image quality by every meaningful metric. Last week I went to the fair with a bunch of 26-36 year olds, and I brought my R5II with 35 1.4 VCM. Broadly speaking, people loved the pictures I took of other people, but uniformly did not like the photos I took of them specifically. Part of it may be me -- Annie Leibovitz I am not -- but a big part of it is the fact that 45MP and L glass is going to pick up on every crease and pimple and pore, and young people just do not like that. And I know, because I've done it a bunch, that had I taken those same photos with my X100V and a 1/8 mist filter, everyone would have been over the moon.
I think all this makes for a pretty pleasant outcome, honestly. More cool little cameras, less time on phones, more fun with your friends, more creativity, and (hopefully) more money coming into an industry that is genuinely interesting and innovative and important. I feel for companies like Olympus and Panasonic who were early to this party by about a decade and suffered considerably for it. I hope they're not too far behind the curve this time.
I've also noticed that, in a world where everyone is so conscious of not just how they look but *how they look in pictures*, younger people are gravitating towards P&S cameras because they actually have worse image quality by every meaningful metric. Last week I went to the fair with a bunch of 26-36 year olds, and I brought my R5II with 35 1.4 VCM. Broadly speaking, people loved the pictures I took of other people, but uniformly did not like the photos I took of them specifically. Part of it may be me -- Annie Leibovitz I am not -- but a big part of it is the fact that 45MP and L glass is going to pick up on every crease and pimple and pore, and young people just do not like that. And I know, because I've done it a bunch, that had I taken those same photos with my X100V and a 1/8 mist filter, everyone would have been over the moon.
I think all this makes for a pretty pleasant outcome, honestly. More cool little cameras, less time on phones, more fun with your friends, more creativity, and (hopefully) more money coming into an industry that is genuinely interesting and innovative and important. I feel for companies like Olympus and Panasonic who were early to this party by about a decade and suffered considerably for it. I hope they're not too far behind the curve this time.
Aug 28, 2026 at 09:09 AM
p.2 #20Fujifilm Dethrones Nikon, Claims #3 Worldwide
gdanmitchell wrote:
But for how long? I'm not seeing an increase in attention span. After the initial use of old stuff the novelty tends to wear out.
EBHBut that has also always been the case. It is not a new thing to see people “get into photography,” buy some fancy new gear, use it for a while, and move on to a different hobby.
I’m not saying that things will play out exactly the same as they did in the pre-digital era, but I think that the parallels are likely to be pretty strong, based on consumer behavior.
It isn’t just photography, by the way. I’ve seen lots of people “get into music,” buy an instrument, become very excited about it, only to eventually realize that it...Show more →
I defer to your expertise. I mostly don't interact with normal people, especially the youths.
EBH
EB-1 wrote
gdanmitchell wrote
I have a theory that this pattern of rejecting what was popular with parents and embracing what was popular with grandparents is more general than just being about photography.EBH
I’m not saying that things will play out exactly the same as they did in the pre-digital era, but I think that the parallels are likely to be pretty strong, based on consumer behavior.
It isn’t just photography, by the way. I’ve seen lots of people “get into music,” buy an instrument, become very excited about it, only to eventually realize that it...Show more →
I defer to your expertise. I mostly don't interact with normal people, especially the youths.
EBH
Aug 28, 2026 at 02:02 PM