Tina Kino wrote:
I suppose the majority of the questions you're asking yourself only you can answer - by figuring out what it is you want (or by try and error) 💁♂️
Regarding the developing your own film though I'd strongly suggest you do a dozen rolls of black & white before trying c-41 or e-6, as the latter is much more of a hassle.
From my experience, C-41 or E-6 are very much alike B&W film development just with temperature control. Ignore all the videos out there which try to make you buy into expensive rollers or automation for color negative or slide development! Just use your std development tank added into a water bath of a vanity around 39 deg C. Pre-warm the developer(s) and BLIX also in a water bath to the same temperature. Put 39 deg C warm water into the development tank with inserted film first to adjust the inside of the development tank to the needed temperature and rinsing off some protective color layer of the film. Rest is straight forward. I developed hundreds of color negative and slide films very successfully here. Hardest thing is actually to know when the first developer can't be used anymore because it is used up or getting too old in solution. Development time has to be adjusted for the number of film rolls which have been developed with the developer before. I also found the temperature can vary a 1-2 degree C without affecting image quality.
James Markus wrote:
Jim, Is it possible you are over analyzing this?... If you enjoy it - does any of the other bits matter?
Over-analyzing? Of course! It has been said that the journey is more important than the destination. One could add that planning the journey is half, okay only a third, of the fun of the journey itself.
Do the other bits matter? Well, yes if the journey leads down a dead end, or costs $6395 per turn, I mean per picture.
jimmuller wrote:
Over-analyzing? Of course! It has been said that the journey is more important than the destination. One could add that planning the journey is half, okay only a third, of the fun of the journey itself.
Do the other bits matter? Well, yes if the journey leads down a dead end, or costs $6395 per turn, I mean per picture.
In that case - I rest my case. Enjoy the journey and where it leads.
retrofocus wrote:
From my experience, C-41 or E-6 are very much alike B&W film development just with temperature control.
I suppose you could put it that way, but still - to somebody who apparently has no experience with home developing so far I'd still very much recommend to start with b&w.
I agree C-41 and E-6 is "straightforward", it is more complex though (more steps), and temperature control is a big pain in the ass.
I did use a sous-vide / a huge water bath and pre-heat all the things thoroughly, mixed everything pecisely, followed instructions and times etc. closely but still found it a hassle. Black and white, for me, is a walk in the park, in comparison.
Temperature variation of 0.5 to 1°C lead to severe color shifts, especially with E-6, which in turn lead to much frustration during scanning and post-processing. I'm really unsure how you're getting away with 1-2 degrees of variation to be frank.
I'm planning on shooting more color this summer and getting another Bellini C-41 kit, but I don't think I'll do E-6 any more at home.
Tina Kino wrote:
I suppose you could put it that way, but still - to somebody who apparently has no experience with home developing so far I'd still very much recommend to start with b&w.
I agree C-41 and E-6 is "straightforward", it is more complex though (more steps), and temperature control is a big pain in the ass.
I did use a sous-vide / a huge water bath and pre-heat all the things thoroughly, mixed everything pecisely, followed instructions and times etc. closely but still found it a hassle. Black and white, for me, is a walk in the park, in comparison.
Temperature variation of 0.5 to 1°C lead to severe color shifts, especially with E-6, which in turn lead to much frustration during scanning and post-processing. I'm really unsure how you're getting away with 1-2 degrees of variation to be frank.
I'm planning on shooting more color this summer and getting another Bellini C-41 kit, but I don't think I'll do E-6 any more at home.
1-2 deg C difference make no visible difference in the development from my experience - the range between 38-41 deg C is absolutely safe to use! E-6 is easy - just uses two developers and a mix of beach and fixer as third. Not sure why you would think E-6 is more complicate - in comparison to C-41 it just uses B&W developer followed by color developer. Scanning positives I found actually much easier to do than color negatives. If something frustrated me, then it was color negative scanning. I recommend Vuescan or Negative Lab Pro to use for best color reproduction from color negatives.
If you really want fun try the cumbersome RA-4 process. This one indeed is tedious - making color prints on silver gelatin paper. The developer is not stable in air and needs to be handled quickly. I gave up on doing the RA-4 after I used it a couple of times.
Developing always was fun for me - I admit what might have helped me is that I am a PhD (more exactly Dr. rer. nat. since I graduated in Germany) chemist by education, so working with chemicals and development equipment is kind of in my nature.
retrofocus wrote:
E-6 is easy - just uses two developers and a mix of beach and fixer as third. Not sure why you would think E-6 is more complicate - in comparison to C-41 it just uses B&W developer followed by color developer.
I did not say that I think E-6 is more complicated.
What I said was that both E-6 and C-41 are straightforward, but more complex (as in: more steps, compared to black and white).
Tina Kino wrote:
...
I agree C-41 and E-6 is "straightforward", it is more complex though (more steps), and temperature control is a big pain in the ass.
I did use a sous-vide / a huge water bath and pre-heat all the things thoroughly, mixed everything pecisely, followed instructions and times etc. closely but still found it a hassle. Black and white, for me, is a walk in the park, in comparison.
Temperature variation of 0.5 to 1°C lead to severe color shifts, especially with E-6, which in turn lead to much frustration during scanning and post-processing. I'm really unsure how you're getting away with 1-2 degrees of variation to be frank.
I'm planning on shooting more color this summer and getting another Bellini C-41 kit, but I don't think I'll do E-6 any more at home.
retrofocus wrote:
1-2 deg C difference make no visible difference in the development from my experience - the range between 38-41 deg C is absolutely safe to use! E-6 is easy - just uses two developers and a mix of beach and fixer as third. Not sure why you would think E-6 is more complicate - in comparison to C-41 it just uses B&W developer followed by color developer. Scanning positives I found actually much easier to do than color negatives. If something frustrated me, then it was color negative scanning. I recommend Vuescan or Negative Lab Pro to use for best color reproduction from color negatives.
If you really want fun try the cumbersome RA-4 process. This one indeed is tedious - making color prints on silver gelatin paper. The developer is not stable in air and needs to be handled quickly. I gave up on doing the RA-4 after I used it a couple of times.
Developing always was fun for me - I admit what might have helped me is that I am a PhD (more exactly Dr. rer. nat. since I graduated in Germany) chemist by education, so working with chemicals and development equipment is kind of in my nature. ...Show more →
You two are certainly ratifying the comment by @OffTrail "Dropping off at a lab is an entirely valid way to engage with film."
I could handle the chemistry and find the patience but I have no space, and until retirement kicks in, no time either for all that!
Tina Kino wrote:
I did not say that I think E-6 is more complicated.
What I said was that both E-6 and C-41 are straightforward, but more complex (as in: more steps, compared to black and white).
Would love to see some pics you did with a simplified 3-bath E-6 kit at 41°C.
I never use the stabilizer solution. Also the reversal developer step I never use with my E-6 Arista Rapid Processing (just first and color developer). Steps 6 to 8 are one step in my procedure with blended bleach/fixer. I am doing the E-6 process at 41-42 deg C with development times specified in the Arista manual (6.5 min for first and 4.5 min for second developer). Examples in 35 mm and 6x6 cm slide formats below - all home developed as described. For scanning, I am using an Epson V850 for the middle format positives, and a Plustek OpticFilm 8200i for 35 mm positives.
