So this lens series interests me. I sold my Z9 and still have my ZF and some nice S series Nikon glass.. I have a Megadap /Sony adapter for the Sigma contemporary line of lens's which I love.
My question is, do i get the Z series of Simera lens's or do I get a Leica M adapter and buy M series lens as I really want the 21mm offering in this line up.Im guessing M series offer a better resale as this series seems to be focused to the Leica line...HMMMMM
The current Simera in Z offers no advantage, other than use without an adapter.
If you get M mount, it's more flexible, can be used with a smart adapter for focus confirm/etc, has a wider resale market.
There is one decisive advantage to the Z-mount version, and that is the price.
M-mount Version ist almost twice as expensive as the Z-mount version.
If you factor in the cost of an adapter, it's probably more than double.
At least here in Europe, the Simera 28mm f/1.4 for M-mount costs €673.95, while the Z-/E-/RF-/X-mount versions costs €349.95.
The niche market for a manual focus (MF) non-CPU lens like this is so small that Thypoch has to offer much larger discounts to attract new customers than they would for the M-mount version.
Therefore, for me, at the price of the Z-mount version, the Simera 28mm f/1.4 silver was an absolute no-brainer.
For almost €700, and the added cost of an adapter, I would never have become a Thypoch customer.
The niche and therefore demand in the E-/Z-/RF-/X-mount is so small for such a non-CPU MF lens that Thypoch has to offer much larger discounts to generate new customers than in the M-mount.
If a portion of this small niche also opts for the M-mount version for their Sony E-mount or Nikon Z-mount bodies, this drives down the price of the E-/Z-/RF-/X-mount versions even further, because Thypoch can only generate demand outside of the M-mount by offering massive discounts.
However, if you already own other M-mount lenses, or want M-mount only lenses such as the Simera 21 or 75mm f/1.4, then the answer is clear.
Personally I think the M versions are way overpriced for a previously unknown on the market.
If I was buying, I would get the Z because of the price and not needing an adapter.
It's much easier to generate competitive prices in the M-mount for such a lens.
For the E/Z/RF mount, however, this is an absolute niche lens.
Manual focus alone is already difficult for many users to grasp in these mounts, and then there's the non-CPU version, from a Chinese manufacturer completely unknown in these mounts.
A portion of the potential buyers for this lens are already using an M-mount camera anyway, meaning they want dual-mount functionality.
That leaves very few sales of the Z/E/RF mount versions.
In these mounts, the only way to attract customers for a non CPU MF lens is through massive discounts, as one can currently see.
ISO1600 wrote:
Personally I think the M versions are way overpriced for a previously unknown on the market.
If I was buying, I would get the Z because of the price and not needing an adapter.
I wouldn't necessarily call it overpriced.
You really do get a beautiful 28mm f/1.4 for your money, and the overall build quality is excellent.
There's a reason it's not in the same price range as comparable Cosina/Voigtlander lenses.
Whether it's coatings/flare resistance, details like the inconsistent number of aperture clicks, a slightly too narrow focus throw near the MFD, or the lack of communication/non-CPU.
There is a high probability that there is no optimization for different filter stacks, although this is less problematic with the Z-mount, as it has far fewer problems in this area with M-mount optics than the E-mount.
Additionally, there's a tiny bit of play when removing the lens from the Z-mount.
It rotates a tiny bit too far, so it catches when you try to remove it; you have to turn it back slightly to release the lens from the mount.
These are minor issues that don't really detract from the lens's overall quality, but they are clear reasons why it's considerably cheaper than a Voigtlander 28mm f/1.5.
I see it more as a real bargain in the Z/E/RF/X-mount, because a 28mm lens with a maximum aperture of f/1.4 and very harmonious rendering for €350 is quite unique.
At that competitive price, even the minor flaws are perfectly acceptable.
If you are only going to ever shoot it on Z, you should buy it for Z. It's way cheaper and if I recall correctly the focusing ring turns in the Nikon direction, where the M is opposite.
You're still gonna get the same weak corners whether you shoot the native Z or the adapted M because, surprise surprise, it's the exact same lens with no consideration for sensor stack thickness.
The one HUGE potential bonus for splurging for the M is if you already have a Techart, so that you can potentially get both AF and focus confirmation on Z. Otherwise, you're looking at over $1000 investment for what's a $300 dollar lens.
Have this lens in the Z mount. I knew what I was signing up for with no EXIF and no focus confirmation. Thought I'd work on my skill level of not using these features. I have a workaround with the record button as a quick in and out zoom for focus confirmation and if you have the eye-AF on, the camera still recognizes the eye and will zoom straight to it. It's not perfect, but it works, the cost was great and the image quality is fantastic.
But those caps that fall off all the time.......senseless, irritating issue. Of all things to not get right, it's the caps that fall off. Grrrr.....
ISO1600 wrote:
Personally I think the M versions are way overpriced for a previously unknown on the market.
If I was buying, I would get the Z because of the price and not needing an adapter.
Agree...I prefer no adapter whenever possible. One note: It is possible that the extra cost for M mount has to do with the extra precision machining necessary for the focus cam mechanism required by M mount lenses, but not present on any other mount..
urbanwild wrote:
Have this lens in the Z mount. I knew what I was signing up for with no EXIF and no focus confirmation. Thought I'd work on my skill level of not using these features. I have a workaround with the record button as a quick in and out zoom for focus confirmation and if you have the eye-AF on, the camera still recognizes the eye and will zoom straight to it. It's not perfect, but it works, the cost was great and the image quality is fantastic.
But those caps that fall off all the time.......senseless, irritating issue. Of all things to not get right, it's the caps that fall off. Grrrr........Show more →
How do compare this lens with the Nikon 28mm 1.4ED in regards to strengths and weaknesses?
As you know I have the Nikon 28 1.4, the I really like, but for a walk around lens I find it a little bit awkward mounted with the FTZ adaptor on my Z7.
Because 28mm is one of my favorite focal lengths, I'm trying to find a Z mount 28mm companion to the 28mm 1.4.
It's only available in M-mount. Bastian at Phillip Reeve reports it goes better on Sony than M-mount, lol:
'When looking at the performance on the Sony A7rII the M-mount version of the Voigtländer VM 21mm 1.4 Nokton performed pretty bad: midzone dip at wider apertures and mediocre corners. This Thypoch 21mm 1.4 Simera only shows a slight midzone dip and the corners actually look better than on the Leica. On the Sony A7rII this lens shows great across frame performance from f/4.0.'
Under 'Handling and Build Quality', Bastian is more into handling (haptics, ergo) and does not even mention build. I will, but I fear I'm not going to help here by saying this: this is the most elegant, solid, well built lens I've used in over 30 years at it.
So much for cheap Chinese lenses, as it sells for $100 more at B&H right now, than the lens it was based on - the Voigtlander 21mm f1.4 Nokton. It's a big improvement for what I want: smooth bokeh, low weight, image depth (3D), true-to-life rendering, close MFD, great color. And yes, it will be most appealing to M users. But that will take time.
Adapters? Most all are leaf spring numbers (not good enough for heavy cine use), but as it happens Thypoch seems to have decided to only release the later Simera and Simera-C lenses in M-mount (28, 35 and 50 photography lenses do come in Z).
Accordingly, they retail the best adapter I've used, and it comes in M>Z. Maybe some close focus ones are as good but it's unlikely because this one uses a double locking PL mount style mechanism. It grabs the lens in a vice grip.
Adapter links:
https://thypoch.com/en/adapter
adapter YT review: title 'The Future of mobile Cinema is ... an adapter??'
by Nick Salazar
youie wrote:
How do compare this lens with the Nikon 28mm 1.4ED in regards to strengths and weaknesses?
As you know I have the Nikon 28 1.4, the I really like, but for a walk around lens I find it a little bit awkward mounted with the FTZ adaptor on my Z7.
Because 28mm is one of my favorite focal lengths, I'm trying to find a Z mount 28mm companion to the 28mm 1.4.
Happy new year to you! I have to admit that I have some work to do for a proper comparison. For the last few months I've focused on working through the last few years of photos more than actually shooting (plus a busier life outside of photography). So I'll need a bit more time to give you a proper response. But from a high level, I would say that this lens is the closest thing to the 1.4E that I have found so far (optically speaking). It's quite nice overall with good bokeh at 1.4 and very sharp when stepped down. The vignetting is strong which one would expect, but seemingly more difficult to correct than with the 1.4E unless that's just my bad memory. For portraits, I'd reach for the 1.4E every time. I want that autofocus in these cases. I'm certainly not selling that lens anytime soon even if I haven't used it as much as I should. It's the better lens still.
Agree with you re: the 1.4E being a bit big on the ftz for a walk-around lens. The Thypoch fits the bill for those times and it's nice to have 1.4 when I may want to throw in some unexpected portraits or other short depth of field shots should they occur. It's sharper than the 28mm f2.8SE and it produces a more beautiful looking image to me. I intend to use it a lot with street photography. It's yet another classic case of having three different lenses for one focal length where all three have a unique advantage....lol, damn you commercialism....can't one lens be perfect in every regard?!!!
I don't know if this will actually happen, but Thypoch emailed me that they were going to produce a second version of this lens and it will have contacts for EXIF and focus confirmation with Nikon Z. If this will indeed be the case, I would most certainly hold off until then.
urbanwild wrote:
Happy new year to you! I have to admit that I have some work to do for a proper comparison. For the last few months I've focused on working through the last few years of photos more than actually shooting (plus a busier life outside of photography). So I'll need a bit more time to give you a proper response. But from a high level, I would say that this lens is the closest thing to the 1.4E that I have found so far (optically speaking). It's quite nice overall with good bokeh at 1.4 and very sharp when stepped down. The vignetting is strong which one would expect, but seemingly more difficult to correct than with the 1.4E unless that's just my bad memory. For portraits, I'd reach for the 1.4E every time. I want that autofocus in these cases. I'm certainly not selling that lens anytime soon even if I haven't used it as much as I should. It's the better lens still.
Agree with you re: the 1.4E being a bit big on the ftz for a walk-around lens. The Thypoch fits the bill for those times and it's nice to have 1.4 when I may want to throw in some unexpected portraits or other short depth of field shots should they occur. It's sharper than the 28mm f2.8SE and it produces a more beautiful looking image to me. I intend to use it a lot with street photography. It's yet another classic case of having three different lenses for one focal length where all three have a unique advantage....lol, damn you commercialism....can't one lens be perfect in every regard?!!!
I don't know if this will actually happen, but Thypoch emailed me that they were going to produce a second version of this lens and it will have contacts for EXIF and focus confirmation with Nikon Z. If this will indeed be the case, I would most certainly hold off until then. ...Show more →
happy new year to you too Rich! Thank you for the reply, I'm quite impressed by the output of Thypoch, clearly the lens has some drawbacks, but for the price that you pay, it's almost a no brainer.
I'm also eyeing the Voigtlander 28mm f/2 APO-Lanthar, it looks also looks like a very good 28mm on the Sony mount, but the asking price for Nikon Z mount will be $1349 cnd once it comes out.
I'm not sure if you have any voigtlanders or not, but I have the apo-lanthars 35 and 50. Amazing lenses! Very sharp, contrasty, nice colours and work flawlessly on a Z. Great build quality and the caps stay on
That said, the bokeh is a bit rougher than the Nikon equivalents and the Thypoch when standing back from the subject. Any lens bokeh will look good with a subject tight to the camera of course. We'll see how the new CV 28mm apo lens does but I would expect it to behave similarly to the 35 and 50.
For a manual 28mm street option where I'm doing range focus shooting, I don't really need anything more than the thypoch (ahem, other than caps that work).....and it's nice to know the Thypoch can also fill in for the odd portrait with the 1.4. So for me the Thypoch is the better option. I just wished it had contacts and caps like the Voigtlanders!
They're all fanastic lenses though and reasons to spend that hard earned money!
Surprisingly, I have no problems with the Simera 28/1.4 Z lens cap.
However, the lens hood is permanently attached to my silver Simera, so I only use the rectangular cap for the hood, and that works fine.
However, I don't use the rear element cap at all, as the lens has been mounted on one of my two Z bodies since I bought it.
