Hello, I don't know if this topic has already been discussed..
But I would like to know if users who have had the A7 IV and then the A7R V have noticed a better RAW color? (Many say it's the same, but many say it actually changes) I experienced a slight change from A7 III to an A7R IV (The colors are a headache in this model) that's why I ask users who have switched from the A7 IV to the A7R V, did they notice an improvement? A better color and easy to reveal?
Thank you in advance, I have an A7 III and I want to update, all landscape photographs and my longing is the dynamic range, that if the RV is $1000 more expensive, I still have a lens that is enough for me and it is the Sigma 28-45mm DH DN 1.8
Yon_01RAW. wrote:
Hello, I don't know if this topic has already been discussed..
But I would like to know if users who have had the A7 IV and then the A7R V have noticed a better RAW color? (Many say it's the same, but many say it actually changes) I experienced a slight change from A7 III to an A7R IV (The colors are a headache in this model) that's why I ask users who have switched from the A7 IV to the A7R V, did they notice an improvement? A better color and easy to reveal?
Thank you in advance, I have an A7 III and I want to update, all landscape photographs and my longing is the dynamic range, that if the RV is $1000 more expensive, I still have a lens that is enough for me and it is the Sigma 28-45mm DH DN 1.8...Show more →
What is a good color? You can judge this for yourself.
At DPR they have and raw files from the cameras you can download them and compare using your favorite raw converter. Please remember the colors you get really depend on the profile(s) you are using. Best practise seem to be to make your own profile and work the images from there.
These questions about colors, unfortunately called "[brand name] color science" pops up every now and then. There is a lot more (facts and confusion) to read if you do a search.
I find both cameras to have excellent color, I don't think you will be disappointed in the color output of either. With that said though, I find every new camera I have to dial in colors a bit how I like them. I will start with selecting a camera profile that I like, either one of my own using Calibrate Color Passport color swatches that I'll photograph with the camera and then build, or Adobe Color or one of the Sony camera profiles like VV or NT, then making adjustments in the camera calibration tab, HSL, vibrance, saturation, tone curve, clarity, etc.. Then I set that as a default profile in Lightroom for that camera model so upon import it will automatically apply that profile. I will also often create a couple presets based on that camera model based on whether I'm photographing people, landscapes, or something I want very neutral, then select that preset even after it has imported and applied my default preset. I have my default preset for landscape images with a lot of color saturation and contrast, but often change that for people, architecture and other subjects. I find it easy overall to get colors you like especially tweaking some of the standard ones to your taste and saving as a preset.
This is all dependent on the raw converter (profiles etc) you are using, not on the “color science” of the camera.
Download some sample images and put them into the various raw converters and judge for yourself.
Yon_01RAW. wrote:
...have noticed a better RAW color?
There is no such thing. Within the scope of a modern digital camera, color is entirely a software concept. In practice, this means that a color profile can be built for any camera to recreate any image created by any other camera. Basically, sans DR clipping, there are no color differences between cameras.
The color difference between two cameras that you observe comes entirely from the contents of their respective DCP files.
I have some questions about this video,
First , is it 100% the same ? I mean , if I take the same photo with a Leica and my sony , even with the same lens ,and also with the same edit software- the color 'value' of a certain pixel will be the same ?
If so , 2 images from different cameras with the same profile will be identical .
Did anyone tried that ? or using it frequently?
ronno wrote:
Regarding what I wrote above, watch this: ?si=9rliZjq1dzEbTbvx
Garmadon wrote:
if I take the same photo with a Leica and my sony , even with the same lens ,and also with the same edit software- the color 'value' of a certain pixel will be the same ?
No. Because each of these cameras will have slight differences in their CFA, and a bigger difference in their DCP profiles, assuming Adobe RAW. But... if you build your own color profiles for your cameras using the same workflow, you will be able to make identical images.
The point is: digital color is a software-defined concept which is inherently malleable. Your camera does not "lock" you into a specific color palette/gamut, it's just a computer which comes with some preloaded software. You're free to use a different one, which is what RAW is for. This is why "RAW color" is a misnomer.
This is not exactly on topic, but this video compares skin tones on Sony Cameras vs Canon. If you are not happy with the skin tones of your raw files, there are some good tips in this video.
Nifty Fifty wrote:
And I previously thought SONY images tended to have a green tint.
Most likely caused by AWB which differs across cameras. Sony's auto white balance implementation varies from model to model, even within the same generation. My A1 II and A7R V often disagree on AWB on the same photoshoot, under the same light.
rosewell wrote:
This is not exactly on topic, but this video compares skin tones on Sony Cameras vs Canon. If you are not happy with the skin tones of your raw files, there are some good tips in this video.
How about finally banning the phrase "skin tones" on this forum?
I’m interested in what people who use a color profile per body do with different lenses. I normally shoot events with two different bodies, each paired with a different zoom lens, and process the white balance for each camera body differently. At the last event I shot, I actually used the prime lens I brought, which never happens. I was pretty startled when I got home at the difference in white balance adjustments between the Sigma 24-70 DG DN and the Sony 20G. It took a bit of tweaking before the white balance from photos from these two lenses on the same body looked “close enough”.
I think a lot of comes down to WB. I set my back dial to manually control WB with Kelvin. This has been a game changer for me on Sony. I have also been using the camera matching Sony profile "ST" in LR which does a nice job with colors.
I've recently transitioned from an A7RIVa to an A7RV and have noticed a difference in the overall color balance and fidelity with the A7RV being better. For exterior shooting, I manually set the white balance but for interiors I've gotten the best results with AWB unless I'm using a color checker and then I will manually set that as well. I process images in C1 usually do some color correction in post. To the OP's question, I do believe the A7RV captures color better, based on my experience.
That said, I am not anywhere near as well informed about this as others on this forum and defer to their technical expertise. One thing I would say, before you make any large purchase take the time to ensure that your monitors, printers, etc. are calibrated. Otherwise your color management will come up short, regardless of what equipment you are using.
The opinions of the 'cameras do color' people seem to be implying that you can repiicate any image by the use of profiles. It won't happen for many reasons, but a simple one is that lenses vary greatly by contrast profiles - the changes in contrast across the image.
Contrast is a major determinant of color attributes like saturation, tone values and more. Also resolution will render the copied image potentially very different to its source.
Maybe they do not suggest it, but it's best to clear it up. That's a lot of malleability to take on.
Sony knows their colors aren't perfect. That's why they instruct all youtubers and creators to change the color settings to +1 blue and +1 magenta, whenever they shoot with new Sony cameras. This helps remove the famous green cast. AWB should also be set to "Keep White".
I believe that by selecting "As Shot" in the white balance settings in your post processing software, you will keep these fixes in the raw files too.
Edit: It is possible that this color and white balance shift has been implemented as standard in the A7RV (and A7CR), and that's why the colors look more natural, pleasing, agreeable to the eye.
I think they are HORRIBLE on the A7RV. For me they come out extremely red/orange no mater what I do. I only use the sony profile when not shooting people. Otherwise its Adobe Color every time.
A major factor in the color science comes down to the RAW processing (de-mosaicing)
For post processing I decided to go with C1, as their raw demosaicing engine handles Sony raw files best imo
Initially Came to that thought because back in the day C1 was given for free to Sony users - and I’m guessing that C1 worked in colab with Sony and Sony subsidized those free C1 memberships - so that the Sony files would look as good as possible
To the OP, I use the A73 for better low light and when I don’t need all the cropable detail, and the A7R3 for when I want more detail
I sold my A7RV because honestly, it was more than I needed in terms of resolution
I find the A7RV to be the very best colour from any Sony camera ever, including the SLT's like the A99. That's not to say the A74 is bad or even the A73, I thought the A7R2 was good, but the RV is just perfect, reminds me of my Nikon D3, D700, D800 etc. glorious colour every time in every scenario including mixed lighting, infallible auto white balance. Not sure how or why but the 7RV is the king for AWB, better than the A1 and what imo was the previous champ, the A9.
I do still like my Z7 colours, I find Canon too warm and in case it matters I process with Adobe camera raw, not Lightroom or any other program.
