I'm cross posting to the gear forums to get some eyes on this as the other forums here are pretty slow lately.
I'm looking to make some mid to high quality coffee table books and it's been years since I've printed with any labs. For those of you who have made photo books recently who are you using? I'll be looking to make approximately 100-120 page books in a landscape format to showcase full page spreads or a mix of portrait format and crops. I imagine this might cost $300+ nowadays for a high quality book?
If you've made something similar it would be appreciated if you could share the lab you used, paper type, your thoughts on the quality, pricing, and any tips you learned along the way. Photos of the actual books would be great too. I'm assuming the first step is to still get proofs made to ensure your image profiles at home are in alignment with final output on the paper you choose? This is a requirement for me as the different papers can all produce very different color/contrast. With that said I'm looking to work with a lab who offers proofs as I'm not sure all of the "book only" websites do.
Are any of you making coffee table books of your work these days?
Your best bet will probably be to use Printique, but you won't be doing "proofs" for a one off personal book - that only happens when you are producing 10,000 copies.
I really like Saal Digital. I did a review for it on my instagram. Definitely a little pricier than some others but I had a coupon and it worked out well for me.
I'm sure I can find a link to my review if you like. However, I am not sure if they do proofs which you've indicated is a requirement for you.
My friend has published several personal coffee table books using Blurb, and I’ve enjoyed each of them, but not sure how they compare to potential higher end options. They usually have at least 30% off sale at some point in the year. I believe he uses the Adobe Lightroom Book Module to do the layout for the Blurb books.
guitardirky wrote:
Your best bet will probably be to use Printique, but you won't be doing "proofs" for a one off personal book - that only happens when you are producing 10,000 copies.
I guess I should have been more clear in regards to the proofs. I did not mean getting a whole sample book made as a proof, but rather ordering some sample prints on the exact paper it will be printed on in the book. I would like to be able to submit 5-10 images and pay to have them printed on satin and matte paper so I could see the final product before the whole book is ordered. This will allow me to get my brightness/contrast/saturation dialed in before the book is printed.
I have printed three coffee table books. Two 12x12 and one 8.5x11. All three books I used Mpix.com to print them. I'm very satisfied with the results and have gotten a lot of positive comments. But I may not have the most discerning eye.
The pages are layflat and very smooth texture, but I think that's something I chose during the design portion of the process.
12x12" Premium Custom Hardcover Photo Book on Semi-Gloss Photographic
1 $107.99
Premium Custom Hardcover Photo Book
-
Soft Touch Matte Finish
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Thanks all, it looks like I was way off on my pricing estimate. At minimum I'll be paying close to $400 for a decent quality 100 page book. My favorite book I've found so far is very expensive so I'm looking for a cheaper alternative. The MILK premium photo book offers the perfect size I'm looking for (12.7" x 9.5") but it's $770 + shipping for an 80 pager.
Jeez. How do people print a few to sell or gift to family members or friends? It's cost prohibitive. Right now I just ordered my second 6x4' ArtFAB print of another one of my photos. They look impressive in person at that size. But I'm paying over $500 per photo. If a friend wants a copy - there's no way they're spending that kind of money (not my friends anyways).
I wish you luck with your endeavors. Maybe I settled with the mpix books but i'm already planning another one for my upcoming Yellowstone trip
There are two types of services. First is the CMYK printing. I think Blurb does an OK job as a CMYK printer, but it is nowhere near the same quality as printing using a quality pigment inkjet process. It is much less costly. The book is in your hands in seven to ten days. For pigment inkjet books I use MPIX (Millers). I have only used their best (top quality options) in lay flat format. and I only do so when they have a 40%-50% off sale (which happens with regularity). Their lay-flat books top out at 100 pages and are typically in my hands within three to four days. Both services have easy to use online book designing and colors are predictable if you do your part. I no longer print CMYK, but for reasons of cost, it might be preferred.
I make an annual each November when the BF codes come out. Decent quality books are affordable then. I used Mixbook for a couple years. Quality of the paper and printing is good considering the discount. I'd have been less pleased if I was paying full price, but it's still many steps up from consumer grade printing like Shutterfly.
For the past few years though I've been using Blurb, not because it's a huge upgrade to Mixbook, but because it's less work for me using Lightroom - I can do layout and upload to Blurb without the extra conversion step. The only extra work I have to do is make the full wrap cover/spine/back in Photoshop.
I also find that the Blurb finished product better matches what I see in Lightroom where as Mixbook looked a stop or two darker. I order matte finish lay flat books. Like with Mixbook, I would not pay full price.
I mostly use a company out of New Zealand called milk books, I get the premium books mostly which I really like.
I have used a bunch of other companies like zno, shutterfly, artifact uprising, the photobook one and blurb over the years they are all ok - zno has lots of paper and options but I tend to default back to milk. It really does depend on the quality of the paper you choose and there are lots of options.
The only book I’ve ever had with milk that I want as fond of I used one of those photogenerating companies and then uploaded and the quality wasn’t great - so now I stick with the company software or something like adobe that allows me to do it myself.
I like milk books premium because they are hand stitched and lay flat without being a standard lay flat book - but you can’t have a full cover photo - for those I tend to use other companies.
artsupreme wrote:
Thanks all, it looks like I was way off on my pricing estimate. At minimum I'll be paying close to $400 for a decent quality 100 page book. My favorite book I've found so far is very expensive so I'm looking for a cheaper alternative. The MILK premium photo book offers the perfect size I'm looking for (12.7" x 9.5") but it's $770 + shipping for an 80 pager.
Should have read the comments first, milk is worth the cost but I typically make the book keep it in my account until they have a sale and you can save 20% or so which is worth it.
How comfortable are you with DIY? Full disclosure, I haven't made a book myself, but there look to be plenty of book-binding kits out there, so if you care more about the quality of the photos inside than the binding... consider that? What I _do_ have lots of experience with is this:
... which my wife and I use extensively to do dye-sub prints of our favorite photos for holiday cards, demoing work, etc. If you need full-page (8x10) prints, there are bigger (more expensive) printer options too. So print + DIY book binding == cheap at-home option?
Also have a Canon inkjet (Pixma) that I got bundled with one of my camera purchases early on, but don't have the space in NYC to set it up, so it has been un-used and un-loved, but if you wanted 11x17" prints to bind together, there are archival-quality inkjets you can use as well.
aagirlz wrote:
I mostly use a company out of New Zealand called milk books, I get the premium books mostly which I really like.
I have used a bunch of other companies like zno, shutterfly, artifact uprising, the photobook one and blurb over the years they are all ok - zno has lots of paper and options but I tend to default back to milk. It really does depend on the quality of the paper you choose and there are lots of options.
The only book I’ve ever had with milk that I want as fond of I used one of those photogenerating companies and then uploaded and the quality wasn’t great - so now I stick with the company software or something like adobe that allows me to do it myself.
I like milk books premium because they are hand stitched and lay flat without being a standard lay flat book - but you can’t have a full cover photo - for those I tend to use other companies....Show more →
I saw MILK's less expensive photo book line with the hand stitching but I wasn't sure if I would be happy with the stitching being visible or not. I guess if I don't go full spread and keep white borders the stitching will blend in better but if you do go full spread you can see the white stitching over your photos. However, considering I still love the large landscape size and can't find similar sizes anywhere else, I might have to consider the stitched photo book.
What paper did you choose? Can you order sample prints on the paper before you order the book? When you say you can't have a full cover photo you are just referring to the exterior cover of the book correct? Good tip about saving the book and waiting for a sale.
I've looked at all the companies suggested above but I'm looking for a specific size and MILK's large landscape size works best for me as of now unless I find something else. The less expensive hand stitched photo book is $307 + shipping for a 100 pager which is very reasonable to me. I like that it also tops out at 200 pages as you don't see this often.
A similar 100 page book at printique is $407 and I'm not sure if the quality is as good as MILK, or worth $100 more. This is their 10" x 12.5" landscape layflat hardcover book. This book tops out at 100 pages so if I wanted to make a 150 pager I wouldn't be able to have matching books:
As I sit here with my purchased coffee table books of similar size, they all range between 250-300 pages which makes for a nice solid piece. If I comb out only the first 100 pages of these books to visualize, the book looks pretty thin and much less substantial. So for now, I guess the MILK hand stitched book is still at the top of the list considering quality, size, and ability to print up to 200 pages.
CanonMark wrote:
How comfortable are you with DIY? Full disclosure, I haven't made a book myself, but there look to be plenty of book-binding kits out there, so if you care more about the quality of the photos inside than the binding... consider that? What I _do_ have lots of experience with is this:
... which my wife and I use extensively to do dye-sub prints of our favorite photos for holiday cards, demoing work, etc. If you need full-page (8x10) prints, there are bigger (more expensive) printer options too. So print + DIY book binding == cheap at-home option?
Also have a Canon inkjet (Pixma) that I got bundled with one of my camera purchases early on, but don't have the space in NYC to set it up, so it has been un-used and un-loved, but if you wanted 11x17" prints to bind together, there are archival-quality inkjets you can use as well....Show more →
I'm fine with DIY as I used to own a fine art print house but I'm done with printing now unless I want to print very large giclees for the wall.
artsupreme wrote:
I saw MILK's less expensive photo book line with the hand stitching but I wasn't sure if I would be happy with the stitching being visible or not. I guess if I don't go full spread and keep white borders the stitching will blend in better but if you do go full spread you can see the white stitching over your photos. However, considering I still love the large landscape size and can't find similar sizes anywhere else, I might have to consider the stitched photo book.
What paper did you choose? Can you order sample prints on the paper before you order the book? When you say you can't have a full cover photo you are just referring to the exterior cover of the book correct? Good tip about saving the book and waiting for a sale.
I've looked at all the companies suggested above but I'm looking for a specific size and MILK's large landscape size works best for me as of now unless I find something else. The less expensive hand stitched photo book is $307 + shipping for a 100 pager which is very reasonable to me. I like that it also tops out at 200 pages as you don't see this often.
A similar 100 page book at printique is $407 and I'm not sure if the quality is as good as MILK, or worth $100 more. This is their 10" x 12.5" landscape layflat hardcover book. This book tops out at 100 pages so if I wanted to make a 150 pager I wouldn't be able to have matching books:
As I sit here with my purchased coffee table books of similar size, they all range between 250-300 pages which makes for a nice solid piece. If I comb out only the first 100 pages of these books to visualize, the book looks pretty thin and much less substantial. So for now, I guess the MILK hand stitched book is still at the top of the list considering quality, size, and ability to print up to 200 pages. ...Show more →
I don’t have any of the photo albums because I dislike the thickness of the pages and they top out at 80 pages, mist of the books I have are the premium photobooks, for me it doesn’t bother me that there is stitching in the middle I prefer this to a page that is not lay flat with stitching you can see the whole photo, if they have used traditional binding the middle part is missing ( this is the classic books) most lat flat photo books print the whole page and then stick them back to back which makes the pages thicker - for albums they typically put a 3-5mm substrate between the pages when glueing together, this makes an 80 page book very thick. With the premium photobook from milk if you have a photo that doesn’t go over the middle I doubt you will really notice thestitching, and the stitching is only every couple of pages anyway. If you have while boarders and single sided photos it’s a non issue it blends well, it blends fairly well into light skies but like I said I prefer stitching to non lay flat binding methods. Premium photobooks have only one paper type option I really like it too me it seems a satin type finish that I like. I also have the softcover and moleskin books neither of which would be what you would want but for what I wanted these for they are good too. Milkbooks staff are always helpful and quick to respond.
I have never used Adorama ( printique) it is not accessible where I live unless you use a mail forwarding company. I believe from the research and reviews I have done over the years the quality is very good, definitely equal if not better than milk, but I’ve never used them. If I could have I would have tried them.
Companies like zno will send you sample packs of the paper etc. I ordered the little black book with luster paper to try it out, I like that you can get thin lay flat pages with this company. It was nice I would order again if they had a size I wanted in a book. From shutterfly I ordered a delux lay flat book with Matt pages, it was nice but I doubt I would order from them again. I am historically not a fan of blurb, I personally find the Lightroom software painful to use and the quality not great, that said to be fair the last time I ordered from them was in 2013 and their products have changed since. Like milk books their sizes are different from other companies so if doing portrait or landscape books really need to be designed specifically for that size. That said I am currently doing a 2025 year in review book with blurb because I like the size to try them out again. I believe the paper option w itch places like blurb make a big difference in quality.
I do like options such as the ability to print foil wording etc on covers places like zno, artifact uprising offer this, milkbooks does not, for the right project it really enhances it.
I do find I have to look at the number of pages I intend to use when selecting a product. Most projects for me are between 60 and 130 pages which makes a nice book with lay flat, if it uses traditional binding and thinner paper I have a few more pages typically between 200-350. I used different companies for the latter product
aagirlz wrote:
I don’t have any of the photo albums because I dislike the thickness of the pages and they top out at 80 pages, mist of the books I have are the premium photobooks, for me it doesn’t bother me that there is stitching in the middle I prefer this to a page that is not lay flat with stitching you can see the whole photo, if they have used traditional binding the middle part is missing ( this is the classic books) most lat flat photo books print the whole page and then stick them back to back which makes the pages thicker - for albums they typically put a 3-5mm substrate between the pages when glueing together, this makes an 80 page book very thick. With the premium photobook from milk if you have a photo that doesn’t go over the middle I doubt you will really notice thestitching, and the stitching is only every couple of pages anyway. If you have while boarders and single sided photos it’s a non issue it blends well, it blends fairly well into light skies but like I said I prefer stitching to non lay flat binding methods. Premium photobooks have only one paper type option I really like it too me it seems a satin type finish that I like. I also have the softcover and moleskin books neither of which would be what you would want but for what I wanted these for they are good too. Milkbooks staff are always helpful and quick to respond.
I have never used Adorama ( printique) it is not accessible where I live unless you use a mail forwarding company. I believe from the research and reviews I have done over the years the quality is very good, definitely equal if not better than milk, but I’ve never used them. If I could have I would have tried them.
Companies like zno will send you sample packs of the paper etc. I ordered the little black book with luster paper to try it out, I like that you can get thin lay flat pages with this company. It was nice I would order again if they had a size I wanted in a book. From shutterfly I ordered a delux lay flat book with Matt pages, it was nice but I doubt I would order from them again. I am historically not a fan of blurb, I personally find the Lightroom software painful to use and the quality not great, that said to be fair the last time I ordered from them was in 2013 and their products have changed since. Like milk books their sizes are different from other companies so if doing portrait or landscape books really need to be designed specifically for that size. That said I am currently doing a 2025 year in review book with blurb because I like the size to try them out again. I believe the paper option w itch places like blurb make a big difference in quality.
I do like options such as the ability to print foil wording etc on covers places like zno, artifact uprising offer this, milkbooks does not, for the right project it really enhances it.
I do find I have to look at the number of pages I intend to use when selecting a product. Most projects for me are between 60 and 130 pages which makes a nice book with lay flat, if it uses traditional binding and thinner paper I have a few more pages typically between 200-350. I used different companies for the latter product
Thanks for all the great info, it sounds like I'll be happy with MILK's premium photo book line with the hand stitching. I'll give them a try.
Which size are you going with at Blurb? I just looked at Blurb again and I guess I could live with their large 13"x11" landscape book as it looks decently priced for 100+ pages with the mohawk prophoto pearl paper.
