PixiPhotography wrote: thank you for filling me in, than perhaps the same AF as before? Maybe improved algo's?
I'd bet on improved algorithms and processing power. Possibly a predictive AI coprocessor (we've seen with the A7RV and the A1II how effective that can be for some subjects). NB - I do think that dual Expeed7+AI coprocessor might happen instead of Expeed8.
Be interesting if they can speed the sensor up to 240fps without on-sensor changes. The scan speed of the sensor is fast enough to support that, but I don't know if the rest of the on-sensor pipeline can do so. Current Z8/9 readout is 120fps from all I've been able to gather (this would also allow for 1080p240 video might even allow achieving 4k120). As the current sensor scan speed is 1/270, it's fast enough to complete scans at 240fps. Increasing the fps of the AF readout has significant possibilities for improving AF so long as the rest of the pipeline can handle it.
PixiPhotography wrote:
Based on the firmware features added to the Z9, like shutter angle. I doubt the Z9 II will be announced until maybe November. Perhaps Nikon has some more features up their sleeves for the Z9 in the form of firmware updates.
But a Z9 II with the 5.76m EVF, 8+ stop IBIS, Pre-Raw, new video features would definitely amount to a nice update. Kinda like the D810 was to the D800. A lot of little updates that made a nice update.
I wish Nikon would now focus on making some other niche lenses like Sony’s 20-70 F4. Amazing carry around lens, overall sharp and good range. They’re still due tilt shifts. ...Show more →
I'm not sure about the IBIS. I have used A9III and Z8 side by side. I think Z8 is superior. I could be wrong. I'm not sure if I need anything more than what Z8 offers now.
1/30 and 1/25 sec hand held at 800mm just around sunrise
Z8 and Z 800mm f/6.3 VR S @ 1/30sec, f/6.3, ISO 160, 31.6MP(6889X4592), Effective FL 960mm, Distance 30ft, AF Area Mode Auto
Z8 and Z 800mm f/6.3 VR S @ 1/25sec, f/6.3, ISO 1400, 37.8MP(7422X5089), Effective FL 890mm, Distance 48ft, AF Area Mode Auto
Jemini wrote:
I'm not sure about the IBIS. I have used A9III and Z8 side by side. I think Z8 is superior. I could be wrong. I'm not sure if I need anything more than what Z8 offers now.
Just curious why you found the Z8 superior? Not looking to start a brand war and I'm just interested in your personal experience.
mawz wrote:
I'd bet on improved algorithms and processing power. Possibly a predictive AI coprocessor (we've seen with the A7RV and the A1II how effective that can be for some subjects). NB - I do think that dual Expeed7+AI coprocessor might happen instead of Expeed8.
Be interesting if they can speed the sensor up to 240fps without on-sensor changes. The scan speed of the sensor is fast enough to support that, but I don't know if the rest of the on-sensor pipeline can do so. Current Z8/9 readout is 120fps from all I've been able to gather (this would also allow for 1080p240 video might even allow achieving 4k120). As the current sensor scan speed is 1/270, it's fast enough to complete scans at 240fps. Increasing the fps of the AF readout has significant possibilities for improving AF so long as the rest of the pipeline can handle it. ...Show more →
"Possibly a predictive AI coprocessor"
As someone used A1 in the past and tried A9III for a month, I'm not sure if having a 'AI processor' makes any huge difference. It made a huge difference for Sony cameras (A1 to A9III). Whatever Nikon did with Z9/Z8 works.
A9III struggles in certain situations (eg - bird on water with waves - camera tend to focus on foreground waves). Both A9III and Z8 didn't find Alligator's eye. Z8 fails on long necked birds like heron and sandhill crane. Overall the difference isn't that great.
I think A9III track birds in flight much more effectively. It's hard to judge. I hope Nikon will improve here with 30 or higher FPS.
mawz wrote:
I'd bet on improved algorithms and processing power. Possibly a predictive AI coprocessor (we've seen with the A7RV and the A1II how effective that can be for some subjects). NB - I do think that dual Expeed7+AI coprocessor might happen instead of Expeed8.
Be interesting if they can speed the sensor up to 240fps without on-sensor changes. The scan speed of the sensor is fast enough to support that, but I don't know if the rest of the on-sensor pipeline can do so. Current Z8/9 readout is 120fps from all I've been able to gather (this would also allow for 1080p240 video might even allow achieving 4k120). As the current sensor scan speed is 1/270, it's fast enough to complete scans at 240fps. Increasing the fps of the AF readout has significant possibilities for improving AF so long as the rest of the pipeline can handle it. ...Show more →
Based on the leaps in processor improvements in every category (mobile, computers, AI) I think enough time has gone by between the introduction of Expeed7 which I think they were working on during Z6 II developement or shortly after. But I also like the idea what you said, Expeed7 with an AI processor.
JasonTheBirder wrote:
Just curious why you found the Z8 superior? Not looking to start a brand war and I'm just interested in your personal experience.
I know we can't talk bad about other brands here
In my experience with A9III it's very hard to get sharp images below 1/100 sec at 420mm. As above example shows with Z8 I can get many keepers below 1/100 at 800mm.
BTW I was talking about IBIS only. If Sony ever come out with lenses I want (hand holdable 500/4 is one of them), I will jump back. So NO brand loyalty here
PixiPhotography wrote:
Based on the leaps in processor improvements in every category (mobile, computers, AI) I think enough time has gone by between the introduction of Expeed7 which I think they were working on during Z6 II developement or shortly after. But I also like the idea what you said, Expeed7 with an AI processor.
Expeed 7 has been around for 4 long years, this is more than enough time for a very important jump in processor performance while keeping or reducing power consumption. Expeed 8 must be ready and I would guess it may be 2~4 times faster than Expeed 7. The beauty with these arm based processors is that you just need to shrink the process to be able to add more cores.
bernardl wrote:
Expeed 7 has been around for 4 long years, this is more than enough time for a very important jump in processor performance while keeping or reducing power consumption. Expeed 8 must be ready and I would guess it may be 2~4 times faster than Expeed 7. The beauty with these arm based processors is that you just need to shrink the process to be able to add more cores.
Cheers,
Bernard
I've never been able to find the nanometer process of E7, do you know what it is? I saw the very first version was 90mm which is kind of stunning.
RoamingScott wrote:
I've never been able to find the nanometer process of E7, do you know what it is? I saw the very first version was 90mm which is kind of stunning.
I can't find the source back but I think they are also using a very old process for Expeed 7, probably 40 nm. Which means that the margin for progress is simply huge.
I believe that the latest 3nm process would not be available to them, but even moving to a 6-7yo node (around 10nm) they could increase the performance by a factor of 2 or 3 without increasing power consumption and without major re-design.
This is where Nikon's energy has been going for the past few months. That's some big changes to Red firmware. I suspect they haven't done much on the 9ii.
Alistair1 wrote:
This is where Nikon's energy has been going for the past few months. That's some big changes to Red firmware. I suspect they haven't done much on the 9ii.
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They certainly worked on that, but they have been working on the Z9II for 3+ years and have the size to manage several projects in //. :-)
I would hope Nikon pushes to get the Z9II out sooner rather then later. Adding in a new processor(Expeed 8) with the Z6III EVF or better would be good upgrades. The RED features would make it an amazing steal for whatever price they can launch it at.
Nikon please add redundant video! Video shooters will still not be totally comfortable with shooting video on Nikons if their is risk of losing your work due to a bad memory card.
Jemini wrote:
I'm not sure about the IBIS. I have used A9III and Z8 side by side. I think Z8 is superior. I could be wrong. I'm not sure if I need anything more than what Z8 offers now.
1/30 and 1/25 sec hand held at 800mm just around sunrise
It's cool you got good sharpness at such a low shutter but I wouldn't in any way try to pass off using a human tripod planted 8 inches off the ground as an honest representation of "hand held"
Having dual card writing of video to two CFexpress cards might cause overheating as the cards tend to run hot. Mixed CFexpress / SD writing might work but probably would limit the video formats that can be selected. A possible solution might be that the camera would allow writing a high bitrate codec to CFexpress and a basic h.265 to the SD card, but I don't know if this would require additional chips to support such parallel activities.
When using high-quality CFExpress type B cards, I suspect card failure is a very unusual event and not the most likely point of failure on a shoot. However, if dual card writing is critical for you then you need to use a camera that supports that. Let's hope that camera has no other issues such as overheating.
MirrorBeGone wrote:
I would hope Nikon pushes to get the Z9II out sooner rather then later. Adding in a new processor(Expeed 8) with the Z6III EVF or better would be good upgrades. The RED features would make it an amazing steal for whatever price they can launch it at.
Nikon please add redundant video! Video shooters will still not be totally comfortable with shooting video on Nikons if their is risk of losing your work due to a bad memory card.
Sure. Whatever help to act fast enough to get the shot work for me. I usually keep the tripod foot at the top and use it as a handle while ground level shooting. Camera/lens will be hanging like a kettle and my hand will be acting as a gimbal. I use the knee as support for slightly higher shots
wwwest wrote:
It's cool you got good sharpness at such a low shutter but I wouldn't in any way try to pass off using a human tripod planted 8 inches off the ground as an honest representation of "hand held"
RoamingScott wrote:
I've never been able to find the nanometer process of E7, do you know what it is? I saw the very first version was 90mm which is kind of stunning.
90nm may seem a bit wild as that was the leading edge process ~20 years ago for CPU’s and largely in a pre smartphone world. The reality is that only the most profitable high volume and high performance chips live on leading edge nodes or one node back. Various semiconductor fabs will keep older processes running for years to provide stable design libraries and rules for designers and availability for older designs where spare availability is critical. The lithography equipment is also very expensive and the cost has grown tremendously for the latest several generations. Using it for as long as it can make chips profitably does help fully amortize utilize the equipment and recover as much return on investment as possible.
thank you for filling me in, than perhaps the same AF as before? Maybe improved algo's?
