I think the 200-600 image quality is good enough bare lens and with the 1.4x. I still use the 200-600 sometimes for the better mfd even though I have the 600GM.
If the rumor is true, being 1/3 stop faster at 800mm vs 840mm isn’t a meaningful enough difference for me.
To make this interesting to me, it would need to be smaller, or lighter, or cost less than the 200-600.
A new trick like a built in tc would be interesting, but it already goes to 800mm so not sure how useful that would be.
If this rumored lens comes to fruition, I will be keenly interested. Currently, the 200-600 is my most used lens.
Having an extra 200mm on the long end would be much more beneficial for my uses and losing the 200mm on the short end, as compared to the 200-600 would be less detrimental to my uses.
I will be most interested in image quality, AF speed and accuracy, weight, size and lastly, the cost.
TGPhotography wrote:
I think the 200-600 image quality is good enough bare lens and with the 1.4x. I still use the 200-600 sometimes for the better mfd even though I have the 600GM.
If the rumor is true, being 1/3 stop faster at 800mm vs 840mm isn’t a meaningful enough difference for me.
To make this interesting to me, it would need to be smaller, or lighter, or cost less than the 200-600.
A new trick like a built in tc would be interesting, but it already goes to 800mm so not sure how useful that would be.
I'll guarantee 400-800 @ 800mm will be noticeably sharper than the 200-600 + 1.4x especially as you move to the 50MP+ cameras.
90% of my shots are 600mm on the 200-600 so 400-800 will be much more useful for me in general. I also suspect AF will be faster as 200-600 is rocking ancient ssw (usm) motor and hopefully the 400-800 gets an XDL motor.
Andrea also stressed Sony is making this lens light and compact, which is no doubt why they did 400-800 rather than 300-800. I think this will be lighter than the 200-600G despite the larger front element and hopefully the lens is actually close to 800mm as 200-600G is notoriously well short of 600mm, more like 560mm at best unlike Nikon's 180-600 which is very close to 600mm.
For me hopefully Sony also release a much improved 100-400 GM II as that and 400-800G would be a very nice combo on A1.
Douglas L wrote:
I wonder what the MFD of the rumored 400-800 will be? The short MFD of the 200-600 is a huge plus for some, me included.
Canon's 200-800 does 0.2-0.25x with mfd of 0.8-3.2m.
Sony's 200-600G is 0.2x with mfd of 2.4m
200-600G is quite average in the super tele zoom offerings. Nikon's 180-600 is 0.25x @ 1.3m, Tamron 150-500 0.32x, Sigma 150-600 0.34x, Sony 100-400 GM 0.35x @ 0.98m. Hopefully 400-800 is at least 0.25x, preferably 0.3x.
Pixel Perfect wrote:
Canon's 200-800 does 0.2-0.25x with mfd of 0.8-3.2m.
Sony's 200-600G is 0.2x with mfd of 2.4m
200-600G is quite average in the super tele zoom offerings. Nikon's 180-600 is 0.25x @ 1.3m, Tamron 150-500 0.32x, Sigma 150-600 0.34x, Sony 100-400 GM 0.35x @ 0.98m. Hopefully 400-800 is at least 0.25x, preferably 0.3x.
Thanks for the info. The Nikon's 1.3 meter MFD is absolutely amazing. I thought the Sony 200-600's 2.4 meter was pretty good already. One thing about the Sony, at MFD it's nowhere near 600m. I have the 100-400 GM too, Will see how the 400-800 is.
ChrisMak wrote:
I do remember a véry useful 560mm f5.6 coming out of the Canon 400DOII f4. I loved that lens with the 1.4TC on, not with the 2xTC btw.
If Sony could make a next generation 400mm f4GM with 300GM dna, then I would be interested with the 1.4TC in the bag.
I guess I just love a special lens, that brings a bit extra.
The advantage of the 400DO was purely the weight. I had one and loved it for that reason too; if you do a lot of handheld shooting it was revolutionary at the time.
The question these days with fewer people actually buying large cameras vs. just using their phones is whether there really is the market to support a lens like that or not.
tester_V wrote:
For me F8 is too slow, and it is probably as heavy or even heavier than the 200-600mm one.
I'd love to see 800MM f6.3 like Nikon lens.
I'd rather have a 400-800 f/6.3-8.0 in my hand soon than wait on the never never for a possible maybe release of an 800mm prime. They took 8 years to release 300 f/2.8 and still no 500 f/4 despite showing off the patents at the same time as the 600 f/4.
This is why I shoot Sony and Nikon, I got sick of waiting for Sony to offer something more affordable than 400 f/2.8 or 600 f/4 that wasn't a slow zoom.
An 800mm f6.3 is not within Sony's possibilities I assume, simply because they have no technology to make it a relatively compact and small lens, and it would not compare favorably to the Nikon 800mm/f6.3.
Theoretically, a 400-800mm lens with f8 aperture at the long end could be a very nice lens, but we all know that it is going to be an accessible consumer class lens, full of compromises simply for cost reasons.
The 300GM is very, very nice with the 1.4TC, I remain unconvinced by its signature with the 2xTC despite the abundant praise it gets, and I would welcome a lens in the 400-5000mm range that is fast enough to do well with the 1.4TC.
I agree it is mostly wasting time waiting for Sony to have a rush of innovative inspiration, and I do have the idea of adding a Nikon Z8 to the A1.
I guess you don't care what I said, and you are feeling free to twist my words as you wish. What kind of conversations you used to have, if you do not even listen anyone? It seems some of you have attention of a fruit fly. I have never said I'm waiting. Feel free to tell I'm off topic now because I'm talking about fruits, and start to calling me troll.
ChrisMak wrote:
An 800mm f6.3 is not within Sony's possibilities I assume, simply because they have no technology to make it a relatively compact and small lens, and it would not compare favorably to the Nikon 800mm/f6.3.
Theoretically, a 400-800mm lens with f8 aperture at the long end could be a very nice lens, but we all know that it is going to be an accessible consumer class lens, full of compromises simply for cost reasons.
The 300GM is very, very nice with the 1.4TC, I remain unconvinced by its signature with the 2xTC despite the abundant praise it gets, and I would welcome a lens in the 400-5000mm range that is fast enough to do well with the 1.4TC.
I agree it is mostly wasting time waiting for Sony to have a rush of innovative inspiration, and I do have the idea of adding a Nikon Z8 to the A1....Show more →
Why on earth would you think they "have no technology" to make it small and compact? The diffractive optics lenses used by Canon and Nikon are actually very old technology, just tweaked for modern use (look up a Fresnel lens for example). They have simply not decided that they *needed* to make one at this point.
I have owned them in the past and while I like them, they are susceptible to issues like busy/weird bokeh in certain situations, especially if they are stopped down at all from wide open. It's better than it used to be, but that issue still exists and is impossible to entirely eliminate.
It's impossible to guess why Nikon decided to go "all in" on this when Canon basically went with one lens and one consumer-grade zoom, but they have done a great job marketing it. The bigger question though is how financially successful it has been for them. If Sony or Canon feel it would work for them, I have no doubt either one would jump in with other offerings.
I have used the 300/2.8 with the 2x almost exclusively since I got it just under a year ago. It's ridiculously sharp, fast and super lightweight--in fact an A1 or A1II with the 300+2x still weighs less than Z8 with the 600/6.3 and its faster and sharper.
The one intriguing lens I would love to see with a diffractive element to make it lighter would be a 1200/5.6 or 1200/6.3. That could be a killer bird lens and manageable in terms of weight.
Regardless of whether Sony has the technology or not, they don't show any signs of using it to bridge the gap between consumer class lenses and exotic GM lenses. That is what I meant to say, only Nikon has made efforts in that direction.
jhapeman wrote:
Why on earth would you think they "have no technology" to make it small and compact? The diffractive optics lenses used by Canon and Nikon are actually very old technology, just tweaked for modern use (look up a Fresnel lens for example). They have simply not decided that they *needed* to make one at this point.
I have owned them in the past and while I like them, they are susceptible to issues like busy/weird bokeh in certain situations, especially if they are stopped down at all from wide open. It's better than it used to be, but that issue still exists and is impossible to entirely eliminate.
It's impossible to guess why Nikon decided to go "all in" on this when Canon basically went with one lens and one consumer-grade zoom, but they have done a great job marketing it. The bigger question though is how financially successful it has been for them. If Sony or Canon feel it would work for them, I have no doubt either one would jump in with other offerings.
I have used the 300/2.8 with the 2x almost exclusively since I got it just under a year ago. It's ridiculously sharp, fast and super lightweight--in fact an A1 or A1II with the 300+2x still weighs less than Z8 with the 600/6.3 and its faster and sharper.
The one intriguing lens I would love to see with a diffractive element to make it lighter would be a 1200/5.6 or 1200/6.3. That could be a killer bird lens and manageable in terms of weight. ...Show more →
The Nikon 400 4.5 shows Nikon can do it without PF.
The Sigma 500 5.6 shows Sigma can do it. (similar weight to Nikon 500 5.6 PF)
I believe the Sony 300 2.8 shows they can do it.
I don't think 'if they can do it' applies to anyone.
Nobody posting on any forum knows the reasons why any manufacturer makes what they do or what they don't.
ChrisMak wrote:
An 800mm f6.3 is not within Sony's possibilities I assume, simply because they have no technology to make it a relatively compact and small lens, and it would not compare favorably to the Nikon 800mm/f6.3.
Theoretically, a 400-800mm lens with f8 aperture at the long end could be a very nice lens, but we all know that it is going to be an accessible consumer class lens, full of compromises simply for cost reasons.
The 300GM is very, very nice with the 1.4TC, I remain unconvinced by its signature with the 2xTC despite the abundant praise it gets, and I would welcome a lens in the 400-5000mm range that is fast enough to do well with the 1.4TC.
I agree it is mostly wasting time waiting for Sony to have a rush of innovative inspiration, and I do have the idea of adding a Nikon Z8 to the A1....Show more →
Regarding the Sony 300 2.8, I think it has bridged a gap.
Compared to the last Canon, the EF 300 II, it's 1 kg lighter.
At least in Australia, it's cheaper too and that's comparing to the Canon's price 8 years ago.
Jan 28, 2025 at 04:59 AM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: On
I think the 400-800 is coming (if indeed it is--this is a rumor after all) at least partly so that Sony has a lens that is 800mm. Canon has the 200-800 and Nikon has the 800 PF, so I doubt Sony wanted to be left out without a lens that had 800mm as its longest focal length. It ought to be an interesting lens. People seem to like the Canon and M4/3rds shooters like the Olympus 150-400 and this lens ought to be a similar lens and keeping it to 400mm on the wide end ought to let them keep it relatively small. I would expect the price to compete well with the Canon. Not my cup of tea with such a narrow widest aperture, but Canon has gone all in with these very long but narrow aperture lenses. I would imagine that Sony wanted something in that space and this lens ought to do that.
ChrisMak wrote:
An 800mm f6.3 is not within Sony's possibilities I assume, simply because they have no technology to make it a relatively compact and small lens, and it would not compare favorably to the Nikon 800mm/f6.3.
Theoretically, a 400-800mm lens with f8 aperture at the long end could be a very nice lens, but we all know that it is going to be an accessible consumer class lens, full of compromises simply for cost reasons.
The 300GM is very, very nice with the 1.4TC, I remain unconvinced by its signature with the 2xTC despite the abundant praise it gets, and I would welcome a lens in the 400-5000mm range that is fast enough to do well with the 1.4TC.
I agree it is mostly wasting time waiting for Sony to have a rush of innovative inspiration, and I do have the idea of adding a Nikon Z8 to the A1....Show more →
I am not an engineer by any means so what I am saying may not be logical. Given how good the 300 GM is with 2X TC, shouldn't it be relatively easy for Sony to make a light/compact 600mm F5.6? And If they could make a light/compact 600 f5.6, how difficult is it to make a relatively light/compact 800 f6.3? I will buy an 800 f6.3 in a heart beat.
