p.1 #1 · Funleader to Release Lens Inspired by Leica 35/1.4 Summilux
I wanted to share that Funleader is about to unveil a new Aritzlab 35mm f/1.4 Classic lens for Leica-M mount, crafted with street photographers in mind. This lens merges the timeless appeal of Leica-inspired optical design with contemporary optical advancements. Here’s what we know so far: (Thanks to Peter at Leicarumors)
• Iconic Design: Blending vintage aesthetics with modern craftsmanship. It looks like the Leica 35/1.4 Summilux with infinity lock.
• Enhanced Optics: Featuring advanced coatings for sharper images and improved flare resistance. It's also equipped with two High Refractive Index lens elements.
• Street-Ready: Compact and lightweight, ideal for capturing candid shots on the go
The official announcement is scheduled for January 2025, with a price tag of $500. Stay tuned for more details on the lens design and sample photos.
Pink color: High refractive index lens element. (Update: This seems to be the wrong optical design. See last image)
Updated diagram of the optical design: the initial version posted above was incorrect as provided by the manufacturer. This updated diagram is the one included in the lens manual.
p.1 #2 · Funleader to Release Lens Inspired by Leica 35/1.4 Summilux
Nice to see something that the market's been wanting for well over a decade, actually getting produced by a company bigger than some unknown no-name shop (thinking about those goofy v4 cron clones that didn't pan out over 2024).
If the lens performs as well as those low-res previews indicate, it's at least half as good as the steel rim (flamesuit on).
p.1 #5 · Funleader to Release Lens Inspired by Leica 35/1.4 Summilux
rscheffler wrote:
Nice to see someone take the LLL playbook and undercut their pricing.
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catacore wrote:
Exactly! LLL seems to get more and more confortable with asking 4 figures prices for their products these days (and that's before tax, for few of us). Obviously, they've seen the demand....
I really like what LLL is doing, but my experience with them and the 35 Cron 8 Element clone was not entirely positive. Nor did I appreciate how the price for that lens went from $500 during pre-release to around $1300 retail (though depending on the version and retailer, there are now lower price options).
Is this lens supposed to render any similar to the Nokton Classic pair (35mm/40mm) from Voigtlander? Really liked those low-res featured pictures.
Given the Noktons are supposed to be based on the original 35 Lux design, and based on tests Fred did against the 35 Lux Steel Rim re-release (IIRC), the two were very similar, though still had differences. If this Funleader intentionally is a close optical design to the original Lux, it should be another case of close, but still different. IMO for $500 it's an acceptable gamble to buy unseen/untested for a fast 'character' 35mm. That's exactly how I felt about the LLL 35 Cron 8E at $500 and why I bought it then. Another bonus about the Funleader is it looks very similar to the Lux's housing design, which I prefer over the VM (I have the 40/1.4).
p.1 #7 · Funleader to Release Lens Inspired by Leica 35/1.4 Summilux
rscheffler wrote:
I really like what LLL is doing, but my experience with them and the 35 Cron 8 Element clone was not entirely positive. Nor did I appreciate how the price for that lens went from $500 during pre-release to around $1300 retail (though depending on the version and retailer, there are now lower price options).
Given the Noktons are supposed to be based on the original 35 Lux design, and based on tests Fred did against the 35 Lux Steel Rim re-release (IIRC), the two were very similar, though still had differences. If this Funleader intentionally is a close optical design to the original Lux, it should be another case of close, but still different. IMO for $500 it's an acceptable gamble to buy unseen/untested for a fast 'character' 35mm. That's exactly how I felt about the LLL 35 Cron 8E at $500 and why I bought it then. Another bonus about the Funleader is it looks very similar to the Lux's housing design, which I prefer over the VM (I have the 40/1.4).
It's Voigtlander that sets the non-Leica M lens pricing expectations, and LLL seems to align on average. Voigtlander isn't using exotic lanthanide infused glass, nor do they have to meet goals such as perfectly reproducing the rendering of the 8-element Leica original. It's easier to just "do what you want" like Voigtlander does versus having to reproduce a classic and have every Leicaphile on Earth judging the results. Would I prefer their lenses were cheaper? Of course, but in Leica terms, they're still reasonably priced, IMO.
Also note that Popflash will put certain LLL lenses on sale when they're either not selling or they get too many copies of a given variant.
p.1 #8 · Funleader to Release Lens Inspired by Leica 35/1.4 Summilux
Thanks. Yes I thought of Popflash in my previous comment. They seem to have some of the better pricing around, and you're dealing with a reputable domestic vendor.
Certainly Cosina/Voigtlander are the benchmark for pricing when it comes to third party M lenses, given they are the most prominent/prolific. In respect to their competition, I think it's more the other Chinese offerings such as 7A, TTA, Venus, etc, rather than LLL. Those three tend to undercut Cosina by a fair amount. LLL on the other hand seems to want to be in a premium niche given that they're offering clones of otherwise rare and expensive predominantly Leica vintage lenses. IMO their pricing reference isn't Voigtlander but the going market rate for the original collectibles (or Leica reissues of those lenses). It's not that they're trying to tempt collectors, rather it's more people like me who want to try/use one of those rare lenses but would never buy an original because of the collector's premium that has excessively inflated street prices.
p.1 #10 · Funleader to Release Lens Inspired by Leica 35/1.4 Summilux
IMO, the Funleader lens takes optical design a step further than the Voigtlander 35/1.4 Nokton when it comes to correcting optical aberrations. The Nokton already outperforms the original or reissued Leica with higher contrast and less SA (that dreamy glow), due to its special element and extra element in the design. The Funleader goes even further by matching Cosina’s number of elements and adding a second special element in different locations..
So, while you can expect similar rendering structures from all these lenses, the Nokton and especially the new Funleader will likely offer much better correction for contrast, coma, and glow. Personally, I think this modern approach loses some of the charm because I find the Leica’s aberrations interesting. But I know many will appreciate the cleaner, more modern look of these 'inspired' versions.
Dec 20, 2024 at 12:48 PM
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p.1 #11 · Funleader to Release Lens Inspired by Leica 35/1.4 Summilux
catacore wrote:
I'm not so sure it is easier to just "do what you want" when it's about designing lenses and coming out with new products. While LLL does not HAVE to reproduce anything, they just CHOOSE to reverse enginner and copy the most sought after (or unobtanium) lenses without permision from the original owner, and make (big) money on that. This is theft, in my book. But it is exactly what these companies coming from a specific country they are all doing, for years: copying everything under the sun, then selling it at a lower price. Because the price of labour is low and because they invested nothing in R&D.
Disclaimer: I do have a LLL lens. Still think what they do is unethical big time....Show more →
Interesting. That is not how I understand patents. As I understand it patents expire and then explicitly by law the original designer no longer has claim to the design. I think in most cases that is good as it helps prevent original designers from having a monopoly and controlling the market.
I think either extreme of allowing original designer to have control over their design in perpetuity or allowing anyone to copy designs quickly and wantonly are clearly problematic. Patent law, I think, is an attempt to strike a balance between these two clearly unworkable extremes.
p.1 #12 · Funleader to Release Lens Inspired by Leica 35/1.4 Summilux
I use my 35 Nokton Classic SC VII more than any other lens. I still use film and a SR would be great to have but I can't justify the cost. A Funleader 35 1.4 in the $500 dollar range would be worth a try.
p.1 #15 · Funleader to Release Lens Inspired by Leica 35/1.4 Summilux
Fred Miranda wrote:
IMO, the Funleader lens takes optical design a step further than the Voigtlander 35/1.4 Nokton when it comes to correcting optical aberrations. The Nokton already outperforms the original or reissued Leica with higher contrast and less SA (that dreamy glow), due to its special element and extra element in the design. The Funleader goes even further by matching Cosina’s number of elements and adding a second special element in different locations..
So, while you can expect similar rendering structures from all these lenses, the Nokton and especially the new Funleader will likely offer much better correction for contrast, coma, and glow. Personally, I think this modern approach loses some of the charm because I find the Leica’s aberrations interesting. But I know many will appreciate the cleaner, more modern look of these 'inspired' versions....Show more →
There might be hope for some more character and glow, the Funleader is 7 elements like the Steel Rim I believe and the Voigtlander is 8. The CV 40mm is 7 elements, but does it have more glow than the 35mm?
Now if the special glass prevents glow whatever the optical formula, it’s no hope for a SR clone.
I want my glow.
p.1 #16 · Funleader to Release Lens Inspired by Leica 35/1.4 Summilux
Sonnar-7 wrote:
There might be hope for some more character and glow, the Funleader is 7 elements like the Steel Rim I believe and the Voigtlander is 8. The CV 40mm is 7 elements, but does it have more glow than the 35mm?
Now if the special glass prevents glow whatever the optical formula, it’s no hope for a SR clone.
I want my glow.
Once special elements are used, this corrects for SA and minimizes the glow. I believe the Voigtlander 35/1.4 Nokton has a low-dispersion element, making it a better-corrected lens. This could also be the case for the new Funleader.
p.1 #18 · Funleader to Release Lens Inspired by Leica 35/1.4 Summilux
I like the idea of minimizing glow. Some glow like the LLL 8E is fine but the SR glow does nothing for me. However I do like the flare vintage lenses produce so this might be a fun lens to own.
