Danpbphoto wrote:
Congrats Daniel! A most excellent win and outstanding photographer!!!!
Unique, very creative and most professionally done!
Dan
Thank you Dan!
I disagree with the hair light comment. Sometimes...doing too much makes it too clinical that it becomes sterile. This was left the way it was for the more dramatic effect I hope. It's BEAUTIFUL.
Catherina wrote:
I disagree with the hair light comment. Sometimes...doing too much makes it too clinical that it becomes sterile. This was left the way it was for the more dramatic effect I hope. It's BEAUTIFUL.
Thank you so much Catherina.
I'm truly on the fence about it. I agree with you that doing too much could ruin the feeling of a portrait, but still I believe even a subtle hair light might have elevated this shot, both technically and evocatively. I'm planning several more shoots in the coming months though, so I'll have plenty of chances to use a hair light in my more artistic sessions like this one. We'll see how it turns out. Either way, I'm very happy with this photograph despite there being no hair light.
I'm truly on the fence about it. I agree with you that doing too much could ruin the feeling of a portrait, but still I believe even a subtle hair light might have elevated this shot, both technically and evocatively. I'm planning several more shoots in the coming months though, so I'll have plenty of chances to use a hair light in my more artistic sessions like this one. We'll see how it turns out. Either way, I'm very happy with this photograph despite there being no hair light.
The moment we add a hair light...it becomes "commercial". I guess my time working in Hollywood and the film industry has ruined me . It's just a lot of what I picked up from some top-level Cinematographers/DoP and these amazingly talented Artists. I would see them educating their teams and especially the camera operators too on why they should dirty down their shots and know why perfection equals sterile for the sake of a studio setting or advertisement space. I'd get teased about my opinions of adding a hair light or kicker as being "such a Photographer" (checklist habits) and how our culture pales in comparison because we don't understand the concept of "less is more" sometimes. I learned a lot about lighting, seeing the large sets being built and witnessing how many lights end up being turned off to narrate the scene truest to the DoP's intentions.
But it's your vision and shot ultimately so you go for what you think is best for you!
Catherina wrote:
The moment we add a hair light...it becomes "commercial". I guess my time working in Hollywood and the film industry has ruined me . It's just a lot of what I picked up from some top-level Cinematographers/DoP and these amazingly talented Artists. I would see them educating their teams and especially the camera operators too on why they should dirty down their shots and know why perfection equals sterile for the sake of a studio setting or advertisement space. I'd get teased about my opinions of adding a hair light or kicker as being "such a Photographer" (checklist habits) and how our culture pales in comparison because we don't understand the concept of "less is more" sometimes. I learned a lot about lighting, seeing the large sets being built and witnessing how many lights end up being turned off to narrate the scene truest to the DoP's intentions.
But it's your vision and shot ultimately so you go for what you think is best for you! ...Show more →
I see what you mean and agree that simple is often the best route. Technically my training and experience is in the realm of commercial fashion photography and celebrity portraits, but I like to find a balance between commercial and more artistic. I interned for a fashion photographer named Michael Thompson in 2013 and 2014, and picked up a lot of techniques for lighting and have since been very influenced by his work. Perhaps I'm biased, but I don't think every application of a hair light or a kicker light sterilizes a photo or makes it commercial. The way it's applied is what matters most, in my opinion.
Funnily enough I have a portrait of this model's partner where I did use kickers and a hair light. I don't believe that it gave the image a commercial look, but I do feel it enhanced the image in positive ways that didn't sterilize it:
DanielScott wrote:
I see what you mean and agree that simple is often the best route. Technically my training and experience is in the realm of commercial fashion photography and celebrity portraits, but I like to find a balance between commercial and more artistic. I interned for a fashion photographer named Michael Thompson in 2013 and 2014, and picked up a lot of techniques for lighting and have since been very influenced by his work. Perhaps I'm biased, but I don't think every application of a hair light or a kicker light sterilizes a photo or makes it commercial. The way it's applied is what matters most, in my opinion.
Funnily enough I have a portrait of this model's partner where I did use kickers and a hair light. I don't believe that it gave the image a commercial look, but I do feel it enhanced the image in positive ways that didn't sterilize it: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53956104611_15921427af_o.jpg...Show more →
This image definitely benefited from the kickers and hair light, but it really IS striking more as a commercial piece...just with some satire added. Like you, I had interned with Fashion Photographers too (Hollywood Reporter, Vogue) that broke me into the industry as well. We become obsessed with our lighting to "enhance" everything from eyes, to even the ears and all. Once I was introduced to the bigger world with bigger sets and learned how cinema is an entirely different visual language...I became to understand how not-so-great in lighting we are and our understanding of design and art itself is very limited in belief because our communities approach differently. My work now is less "technical" and more "intentional" to convey more character, mood, and emotions vs being too caught up in the technical details.
I was asked by a known DoP..."ask yourself if you need to be an Artist or Technician for this one? Because we are both, and need to know when/where it goes". That really struck me in a way I never tried to question before. Because in truth...a natural Photographer is a Technician. However, some of us would like to imagine our work having deeper meaning and artistically move someone. A Technician would have someone viewing our body of work with comments such as "amazing, fancy, and cool" while an Artist has more the lines of "breathtaking, brilliant, and touching". One simply recaptures a moment with some spice, yet the other is about creating something with intentions to draw a cognitive effect.
Great work btw before I forget! I'm a fan for sure.
Catherina wrote:
This image definitely benefited from the kickers and hair light, but it really IS striking more as a commercial piece...just with some satire added. Like you, I had interned with Fashion Photographers too (Hollywood Reporter, Vogue) that broke me into the industry as well. We become obsessed with our lighting to "enhance" everything from eyes, to even the ears and all. Once I was introduced to the bigger world with bigger sets and learned how cinema is an entirely different visual language...I became to understand how not-so-great in lighting we are and our understanding of design and art itself is very limited in belief because our communities approach differently. My work now is less "technical" and more "intentional" to convey more character, mood, and emotions vs being too caught up in the technical details.
I was asked by a known DoP..."ask yourself if you need to be an Artist or Technician for this one? Because we are both, and need to know when/where it goes". That really struck me in a way I never tried to question before. Because in truth...a natural Photographer is a Technician. However, some of us would like to imagine our work having deeper meaning and artistically move someone. A Technician would have someone viewing our body of work with comments such as "amazing, fancy, and cool" while an Artist has more the lines of "breathtaking, brilliant, and touching". One simply recaptures a moment with some spice, yet the other is about creating something with intentions to draw a cognitive effect.
Great work btw before I forget! I'm a fan for sure. ...Show more →
Respectfully, I guess I just don't see the technical or commercial side and the artistic side as mutually exclusive, and I don't believe that a hair light or kicker lights intrinsically makes an image technical, sterilized, or only worthy of terms such as "cool" or "fancy" rather than artistic, or "breathtaking, brilliant, and touching". There are many technically well executed artistic pieces that move me as a viewer.
I don't try to enhance every detail and I don't consider myself obsessed with technical perfection, but there are certain enhancements that I personally like the look of, so often those specific enhancements are applied in my lighting because I like the way it looks and not because it's some sort of technical expectation, and I'm quite intentional with my work despite some technical applications. Regardless, I do not view myself as a technician, and have always approached my work as an artist, and I believe being technical as a photographer does not mean I am not an artist. You can be both, and I don't look down on being technical in addition to artistic.
DanielScott wrote:
Respectfully, I guess I just don't see the technical or commercial side and the artistic side as mutually exclusive, and I don't believe that a hair light or kicker lights intrinsically makes an image technical, sterilized, or only worthy of terms such as "cool" or "fancy" rather than artistic, or "breathtaking, brilliant, and touching". There are many technically well executed artistic pieces that move me as a viewer.
I don't try to enhance every detail and I don't consider myself obsessed with technical perfection, but there are certain enhancements that I personally like the look of, so often those specific enhancements are applied in my lighting, and I'm quite intentional with my work despite some technical applications. Regardless, I do not view myself as a technician, and have always approached my work as an artist, and I believe being technical as a photographer does not mean I am not an artist.
Just...ignore me. I'm a nobody and shouldn't have expressed any opinion. I apologize for that. I still stand by what I said and that you do great work.
. It's just a lot of what I picked up from some top-level Cinematographers/DoP and these amazingly talented Artists. I would see them educating their teams and especially the camera operators too on why they should dirty down their shots and know why perfection equals sterile for the sake of a studio setting or advertisement space. I'd get teased about my opinions of adding a hair light or kicker as being "such a Photographer" (checklist habits) and how our culture pales in comparison because we don't understand the concept of "less is more" sometimes. I learned a lot about lighting, seeing the large sets being built and witnessing how many lights end up being turned off to narrate the scene truest to the DoP's intentions.
