I'm not on the market for this camera, I'm happy with Z8, it's almost too good to me.
But, reading all this discussion, one question comes to my mind.
Do people, who most likely are not beginners, who spend so much money for it, and for system all together, really care about all these crazy videos and measurements?
Do you remember the blocked flare issue of the D750 when it first came out, and the outrage (even though few people actually shot in a way that they could see the phenomena)? These cameras are in a very important price class and so a lot of money is involved. I think this motivates agents of other brands (paid and unpaid) to attack rhese cameras when it seems Nikon might have a successful product, all hell breaks loose.
ArizonaImage wrote:
Boy, this whole Z6 III dynamic range thing is spiraling out of control. PetaPixel, YouTube, DPreview and others are going nuts about it with 2-3 articles about the same thing. I don't recall them making a big deal when Sony introduced stacked sensors that lagged in DR and low light vs their BSI CMOS sensors. According to Photons to Photos, the Z6 III is close to the performance of the A9 II and A7S III in DR. I watched others put the Z6 II and Z6 III side by side, over and under exposed 5 stops and had no difference in IQ. Idk what's going on here... smear campaign? If you search Z6 III on Google, the 3rd most searched comes up as Z6 III dynamic range. Searching Z6 III on YouTube, the first suggestion is Z6 III Dynamic Range. Crazy...Show more →
cvrle59 wrote:
I'm not on the market for this camera, I'm happy with Z8, it's almost too good to me.
But, reading all this discussion, one question comes to my mind.
Do people, who most likely are not beginners, who spend so much money for it, and for system all together, really care about all these crazy videos and measurements?
"crazy videos and measurements" I, for one, am thrilled to see how noisy my shadows will be, or how well a camera locks onto an eyeball in low light, or tracks animals, etc., in advance of making a purchasing decision! Glad there's folks who've already plunked down their cash and are happy to take the time to test, publish, share and inform! Everyone's mileage will vary!
jimmy462 wrote:
"crazy videos and measurements" I, for one, am thrilled to see how noisy my shadows will be, or how well a camera locks onto an eyeball in low light, or tracks animals, etc., in advance of making a purchasing decision! Glad there's folks who've already plunked down their cash and are happy to take the time to test, publish, share and inform! Everyone's mileage will vary!
I'm not trying to confront to you, we're all different, but I personally don't trust to the people who live by the number of views/clicks/subscribers.
Their agenda is to create the spark and controversy, more of it, better to them.
Anyway, good luck in your decision, I hope you get what you really want.
RoamingScott wrote:
Morton has some of the most unwatchable content on YT but that's probably just me. I don't have an hour for an un-timestamped video that is mostly ambient noises that make his quiet accent-heavy dialogue almost impossible to hear. People seem to love that style, though.
cvrle59 wrote:
I'm not trying to confront to you, we're all different, but I personally don't trust to the people who live by the number of views/clicks/subscribers.
Their agenda is to create the spark and controversy, more of it, better to them.
Anyway, good luck in your decision, I hope you get what you really want.
No confrontation implied here either! Just answering your question that, yes, I "really care" about all those tests! As for the folks just trying to earn a living being YT testers, well, "not my cup of tea", I worked in manholes and put telephone poles in the ground once upon a time!
ArizonaImage wrote:
Boy, this whole Z6 III dynamic range thing is spiraling out of control. PetaPixel, YouTube, DPreview and others are going nuts about it with 2-3 articles about the same thing. I don't recall them making a big deal when Sony introduced stacked sensors that lagged in DR and low light vs their BSI CMOS sensors. According to Photons to Photos, the Z6 III is close to the performance of the A9 II and A7S III in DR. I watched others put the Z6 II and Z6 III side by side, over and under exposed 5 stops and had no difference in IQ. Idk what's going on here... smear campaign? If you search Z6 III on Google, the 3rd most searched comes up as Z6 III dynamic range. Searching Z6 III on YouTube, the first suggestion is Z6 III Dynamic Range. Crazy...Show more →
I was the first to post a dynamic range comparison in the forums and on YouTube. I was careful to keep the comparison in context, especially for the YouTube video which has a wider, and perhaps less experienced audience. I made it a point to show how the DR differences between the Z6 and Z6 III only start to show up at exposure levels where the total noise levels start to make the images unusable for many situations.
Since that video posted we've seen the usual parade of YT influencers post their own videos and use this as an opportunity to generate views. I'm conflicted about that, because while I know their intentions are to keep their channels profitable and relevant, I also think they're at least performing a service to bring the differences to the attention of potential buyers. When you consider how NIkon had a raw-image embargo up to the actual shipping date of the camera, which denied those buyers access to this information until after their pre-orders started getting filled, having those YT voices discuss the DR even to the attention-grabbing extremes is still useful to offset to the embargo to fill the void of information that Nikon created.
now in my situation being at a store that had a rep show we were all given access to put our own memory cards in and shoot away. nothing was held back. in my case its call patience. i'm never in a hurry to spend $2500 until i get to play first and to shoot in my environment. but then that's me.
sjms wrote:
now in my situation being at a store that had a rep show we were all given access to put our own memory cards in and shoot away. nothing was held back. in my case its call patience. i'm never in a hurry to spend $2500 until i get to play first and to shoot in my environment. but then that's me.
I advocate patience as well. Many people like to rely on reviewers to get their information about the performance of cameras before they purchase them. Unfortunately none of the early reviews could discuss DR due to Nikon's embargo. Ok, so just wait until at least release day, right? That way reviewers could post updated videos with the raw performance reviewed. But that day came and went yet nothing came out. The reason is Nikon has been slow-walking availability of their cameras to reviewers to do their full reviews even after the camera started shipping. And Nikon originally only gave most of those reviewers only half a day of access to the camera for their first-look reviews. That isn't by accident.
It's not an accident because Nikon and other camera manufacturers know how much weight buyers give the first-look reviews for cameras during the hype leading up to release date, and how relatively little they give to follow-up full reviews. This is why the reviewers were given only a half a day for their early look review, which leaves little time to characterize the full performance of the camera, and why Nikon continues to slow-walk availability of the camera to reviewers now.
The untrustworthiness of Youtubers is why I go out of my way to post detailed impression threads on new gear that I try. That way people that know me and know that I can make my way around basically any equipment get an honest assessment of the actual capabilities and pitfalls of this stuff. Sometimes people notice that I have more negative feedback than they've seen on Youtube and are taken aback, but appreciative that someone is actually shooting straight.
If companies were loaning me this gear instead of it coming out of my paycheck, how could anything I say be trusted? That's my stance on all these talking heads.
RoamingScott wrote:
The untrustworthiness of Youtubers is why I go out of my way to post detailed impression threads on new gear that I try. That way people that know me and know that I can make my way around basically any equipment get an honest assessment of the actual capabilities and pitfalls of this stuff. Sometimes people notice that I have more negative feedback than they've seen on Youtube and are taken aback, but appreciative that someone is actually shooting straight.
If companies were loaning me this gear instead of it coming out of my paycheck, how could anything I say be trusted? That's my stance on all these talking heads....Show more →
Agreed. Not everyone knows where to go to get trusted opinions on cameras. And even when they do know they have to contend with a fair amount of astroturfing.
jimmy462 wrote:
A few more Z6III DR test reviews/comparisons showing up online, the first from Josh Sattin..
Northrup - I am guessing a half stacked sensor means that they used half the pixel area for something else (6:10 mark), hence the reduction in DR... Mmmm - no
cvrle59 wrote:
I'm not on the market for this camera, I'm happy with Z8, it's almost too good to me.
But, reading all this discussion, one question comes to my mind.
Do people, who most likely are not beginners, who spend so much money for it, and for system all together, really care about all these crazy videos and measurements?
Amateur here who has most of my budget going to things other than a photography hobby. In 15 years I have bought bodies on 3 occasions and I am only willing to buy more frequently than every 8-10 years if there is a big feature leap that improves my shooting ability.
The nearest good photography store is 1.5 hours away and a large time commitment to visit. Hands on opportunities are limited. Renting systems/gear isn’t practical for deciding what to buy.
Solid data from trusted reviewers that has been verified/repeated and in depth reviews from folks here, preview, bcg, with bodies in hand for more than few days provide the info I need to make purchasing decisions. I think FM skews in a direction where I won’t see as much about a Z6iii as a Z8/Z9, but there will be enough info by late Q3 to know if it is worthwhile especially if I can get that hands on time.
For me, this is all just a hobby and I don’t need to buy a body at release MSRP without full reviews anyway.
A74me wrote:
its lower than the olympus em1mk2, the sensor 4x smaller. to be fare even though the a93 also has lower DR the mages are spectacular, so will assume the z63 will prove to give great results once a few pros post some worthy images.
Go away Sony fanboy. According to Photons to Photos, the Z6 III is about as good as the A7S III and A9 II. It’s barely half a stop between the A7IV and Z6 III. So I’m not sure what you’re talking about…..
Nikon’s only weaker point has been mid-range camera AF. They now have the best AF on the market so the Z6III is litterally an existential threat for Canon in particular but Sony as well.
Some YT channels like the N… have been known for years for actively and purposedely spreading false information about Nikon to hurt the brand’s reputation at every opportunity. It’s not just about driving traffic to their channel. It’s either a personal hate project or a paid job.
So the slightly lower base ISO DR is something they couldn’t miss. Of course what they are not saying is that:
- Canon’s DR numbers are meaningless since they apply NR to their raw files… you can’t shoot real raw with Canon anymore,
- the Sony a9III flagship is even worse than the Z6III
All camera manufacturers impose an embargo on raw files until the official firmware is finalized. Nothing actual to see and talk about.
The compromise Nikon has come up with on the Z6III for stills and video is absolutely brilliant and this is the very reason why Canon and Sony are in panicking mode and why Nikon gets attacked this way.
Why would anyone looking at objects facts want to pick Canon over Nikon in the mid to high range? The answer is that there close to zero reason to. So you have to paint Nikon in a biased and way overblown way. Again, it’s now a matter of survival.
snapsy wrote:
I advocate patience as well. Many people like to rely on reviewers to get their information about the performance of cameras before they purchase them. Unfortunately none of the early reviews could discuss DR due to Nikon's embargo. Ok, so just wait until at least release day, right? That way reviewers could post updated videos with the raw performance reviewed. But that day came and went yet nothing came out. The reason is Nikon has been slow-walking availability of their cameras to reviewers to do their full reviews even after the camera started shipping. And Nikon originally only gave most of those reviewers only half a day of access to the camera for their first-look reviews. That isn't by accident.
It's not an accident because Nikon and other camera manufacturers know how much weight buyers give the first-look reviews for cameras during the hype leading up to release date, and how relatively little they give to follow-up full reviews. This is why the reviewers were given only a half a day for their early look review, which leaves little time to characterize the full performance of the camera, and why Nikon continues to slow-walk availability of the camera to reviewers now. ...Show more →
I feel you overstate the conspiracy from camera manufacturers to withhold information.
"Reviewers", with a few notable exceptions, have lost credibility and few purchasers now place reliance on the advice they pedal. Rather, they are a source of affirmation of purchase decisions already made.
I am of the view that, when releasing a technological exposé, you could reduce the uninformed noise (no pun intended) they generate by providing the real world context of your findings.
GroovyGeek wrote:
Northrup - I am guessing a half stacked sensor means that they used half the pixel area for something else (6:10 mark), hence the reduction in DR... Mmmm - no
The A9III's sensor uses half the pixel area for buffering. He may have been confused or extrapolating....
Due to unspecified "regulatory issues" they do not sell this bracket in the US. Their US website shows it as discountinued. It is available on eBay Canada but will not ship to US.
For whatever reason when I open this from a desktop browser it is showing the price as EU0.00 and does not give me the option to order. However, when opening on mobile I was able to order. Let's see if it actually ships. The price certainly is going to be 2x lower than Kirk and probably 3-4x lower than RRS.
I, for one, am thrilled to see how noisy my shadows will be, or how well a camera locks onto an eyeball in low light, or tracks animals, etc., in advance of making a purchasing decision! Glad there's folks who've already plunked down their cash and are happy to take the time to test, publish, share and inform! Everyone's mileage will vary! 
Just answering your question that, yes, I "really care" about all those tests! 
As for the folks just trying to earn a living being YT testers, well, "not my cup of tea", I worked in manholes and put telephone poles in the ground once upon a time! 