I love pixel binning that means it is done in software domain so that 18M file will behave like 60M in term of Moire performance.
As mentioned, I will default use 18M full time for this camera unless seeing there is a 60M worth of image chance show up For lens like 35mm Summilux pre ASPH, or many modern M glass shooting WO using RF, it has no point to use anything above 18M anyway.
rscheffler wrote:
Thanks. I use Canon 1DX series cameras to shoot sports. But I use Leica along with the Canons for events and there are times when I like to do two quick shots because I think someone blinked or their expression improved. And sometimes things can happen quickly at events too, so it's nice to be able to immediately expose another frame or two, without waiting on the camera.
But yeah, in >95% regular use, waiting a fraction of a second longer is fine.
It'll be something that I'll have to experience for myself to determine if it'll be a factor.
Hi Ron, you can use mechanical shutter for those cases, right? I care about this EVF based shooting delay because I hope M finally can give me similar experience as other MILCs. From infos received so far from owners, it is improved but not there yet.
zhangyue wrote:
Hi Ron, you can use mechanical shutter for those cases, right? I care about this EVF based shooting delay because I hope M finally can give me similar experience as other MILCs. From infos received so far from owners, it is improved but not there yet.
Not quite. But it's pretty damn close. If you set the burst rate to high it's not there at all.
rscheffler wrote:
Thanks. I use Canon 1DX series cameras to shoot sports. But I use Leica along with the Canons for events and there are times when I like to do two quick shots because I think someone blinked or their expression improved. And sometimes things can happen quickly at events too, so it's nice to be able to immediately expose another frame or two, without waiting on the camera.
But yeah, in >95% regular use, waiting a fraction of a second longer is fine.
It'll be something that I'll have to experience for myself to determine if it'll be a factor.
zhangyue wrote:
Hi Ron, you can use mechanical shutter for those cases, right? I care about this EVF based shooting delay because I hope M finally can give me similar experience as other MILCs. From infos received so far from owners, it is improved but not there yet.
Yes, I can with the M240 and it works fine for me. I can fire off a couple shots in single frame advance quite quickly in the classic metering mode. But this isn't the case with the M11 because of its new metering system forcing it to always be in 'live view' even with the display off and shooting with the OVF. Hopefully as Gordon says, it's no big deal. But I'll be interested in your opinion once you receive the camera.
I came across some comments over at LUF where others are hoping Leica will update the firmware for a no-metering option with the sensor covered by the shutter for mechanical shutter use. But I'm skeptical it'll happen.
rscheffler wrote:
I came across some comments over at LUF where others are hoping Leica will give the option of a no-metering option with the sensor covered by the shutter for mechanical shutter use.
This seems to be the main complaint. Perhaps Leica will repaint the blades gray + add the metering sensor back on a future M11-P. I think this is unlikely because it would seem like a step backyards for the marketing dept.
However, this would offer the exact same M10 functionality with the option in the menu to meter from the sensor in rangefinder mode if desired.
I agree from a marketing perspective it would be an admission that the always-on sensor was a step too far, for some users.
I'd be fine with a no metering option given I nearly always shoot in manual and if possible do a test shot or two to establish the correct exposure whenever the light changes. But they'd have to figure out how to lock-out aperture priority on the shutter speed dial.
I could see this being part of a new stripped down special edition for which you pay more. No metering. No aperture priority.
rscheffler wrote:
Yes, I can with the M240 and it works fine for me. I can fire off a couple shots in single frame advance quite quickly in the classic metering mode. But this isn't the case with the M11 because of its new metering system forcing it to always be in 'live view' even with the display off and shooting with the OVF. Hopefully as Gordon says, it's no big deal. But I'll be interested in your opinion once you receive the camera.
I came across some comments over at LUF where others are hoping Leica will update the firmware for a no-metering option with the sensor covered by the shutter for mechanical shutter use. But I'm skeptical it'll happen....Show more →
The M240 is not faster than the M11 when mashing out a few frames. They're about the same. So if you're happy with the 240 you'll be happy with the M11.
Just to be clear. The M11 is just as fast as any previous M. The live view system has NOT slowed the camera down in any way. It is not an issue.
When I get a lag that stops the shooting process it's either card or writting delay, like any other M.
rscheffler wrote:
I'll be interested in your opinion once you receive the camera.
Charging
I don't blame all the complains as long as those make senses. Somehow, EFCS is not straightforward implementation for Leica. I am fine with SL2 E shutter 90% of time. I have my auto ISO setting at 1/30S. (mainly deal with artificial light)
For M, it is really depend on how its E shutter implemented. I am not a fan of MILC mechanical shutter for any camera from early A7/R to Z7 or FUJI GFX, SL2..... IT is double movement for any of them, luckily most have EFCS but not Leica The problem is not really the delay but sound and feel.
Wish it wouldn't be so long till we learn about it ... but, maybe the M10-R will be sufficient step up from my M-P (240). Too bad we can't fast forward the crystal ball.
Did I think they decided not to offer black-painted brass anymore because of environmental considerations?
rscheffler wrote:
I'll be interested in your opinion once you receive the camera.
In single shot mode, there is very small difference between M11 and M10P in term of shutter sound or delay. You will not complain if you come from M240. In mechanical shutter mode, with or without LV enabled, there is no difference in term of shutter sound or delay. You obviously can fire as soon as you want like any M before if you dont ENABLE LV in single shot mode. However, if you are in LV with single shot mode, even though shutter sound is the same (so is the delay), you can't fire shots as soon as you can during LV black out and refreshing. A limitation it is, but if you think about it, there is hardly a case need fire fast in LV mode.
In Continues Low/high speed Mechanical shutter shooting, shutter sound change significantly that it feel more drag. however, enable LV won't slow you down in this case. LCD black out seems much shorter compare to single mode so you can shoot at 4.5fps. I don't know what kind of process at background Leica did for this mode. It reduced black out (may not processing the JPEG LV feed in this mode) but the shutter sound feel "slower" "longer". So you can shoot faster in this mode with LV. Luckily, I never used Continues mode on any M camera though so I don't need suffer that shutter SOUND
In E shutter mode, there is no continues mode even camera let you select it. Continue push down shutter will not trigger another shot until you release the shutter. The delay is fine about or less than 1/2S if you want hit it again to take another shot as Gordon mentioned.
General speaking, M11 is a lot like M10 with modern SL2 feature, ergo and control. I can list tons of useful feature or I preferred already. However, more features could means a distraction even Leica is several level aboooove any manufactures out there. For example, for M10 a single function button is enough for me but M11 have three and I still want more I will settle this done in following weeks and hopefully, I will never need visit it again.
For traditional street shooting or event shooting, I see zero reason to upgrade to M11 even in theory this sensor is better. Buy the M10 or M10P or M10R.
However, if you want a camera has the ultimate FF IQ to take images from landscape, product (64M) to street and snap shots at 18M, Having the modern MILC shooting feeling (well, close to) This is a great machine.
rscheffler wrote:
I'll be interested in your opinion once you receive the camera.
zhangyue wrote:
In single shot mode, there is very small difference between M11 and M10P in term of shutter sound or delay. You will not complain if you come from M240. In mechanical shutter mode, with or without LV enabled, there is no difference in term of shutter sound or delay. You obviously can fire as soon as you want like any M before if you dont ENABLE LV in single shot mode. However, if you are in LV with single shot mode, even though shutter sound is the same (so is the delay), you can't fire shots as soon as you can during LV black out and refreshing. A limitation it is, but if you think about it, there is hardly a case need fire fast in LV mode. ...Show more →
Thanks for exploring this! My guess is Chris at DPR TV noticed the lag while shooting with the live view display on. Good to know that if the display is off in single frame advance, that there is no post-exposure lag.
zhangyue wrote:
For traditional street shooting or event shooting, I see zero reason to upgrade to M11 even in theory this sensor is better. Buy the M10 or M10P or M10R.
However, if you want a camera has the ultimate FF IQ to take images from landscape, product (64M) to street and snap shots at 18M, Having the modern MILC shooting feeling (well, close to) This is a great machine.
As a traditional street photographer, the last thing on earth that I want is a Leica M with the “modern MILC shooting feeling”. Definitely the M10R (and perhaps an M10M) for me.
If it doesn't compromise the core M experience, then I'm not opposed to a more modern live view/MILC experience for that aspect of the camera. In fact, I welcome it.
genji wrote:
As a traditional street photographer, the last thing on earth that I want is a Leica M with the “modern MILC shooting feeling”. Definitely the M10R (and perhaps an M10M) for me.
Until you put on the EVF you won't notice any real world differences. But get the Mono anyway, just because......
that means it is done in software domain so that 18M file will behave like 60M in term of Moire performance. 
For lens like 35mm Summilux pre ASPH, or many modern M glass shooting WO using RF, it has no point to use anything above 18M anyway. 