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Archive 2021 · Cobalt Profiles

  
 
genji
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p.13 #1 · Cobalt Profiles


Fred Miranda wrote:
I'm glad you added the M9 B&W jpeg to the CCD emulations. It's one of my favorite black and white rendition and now I can also use it on my M10 and Sony. Leica got that one right imo.

Here is an example from the Leica M10-R showing the original DNG file followed by the DNG + M9 B&W jpeg emulations (standard and high contrast profiles)


+1

Assigning the M9 B&W JPEG profile with a single click produced a slightly improved version of an M10-P image that I’d spent about ten minutes post processing last night.

What’s also gratifying is that Cobalt continues to add functionality to existing emulation packs.



Jun 08, 2021 at 09:47 PM
Hodie
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p.13 #2 · Cobalt Profiles


I just did a comparison of the Cobalt Standard vs. Adobe Standard vs. Camera Standard on an image of my kid. The difference between the Cobalt and Adobe is subtle, but there is a green tinge to the Adobe one. I prefer the Cobalt. The Camera Standard is pretty atrocious.

I actually posted an even worse version of this in the 50 GM thread. It's so bad that I had to re-upload my images.

Thankful that these profiles are giving me a much better starting point.





Cobalt Standard







Adobe Standard







Camera Standard




Jun 09, 2021 at 01:03 AM
Fred Miranda
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p.13 #3 · Cobalt Profiles


genji wrote:
+1

Assigning the M9 B&W JPEG profile with a single click produced a slightly improved version of an M10-P image that I’d spent about ten minutes post processing last night.

What’s also gratifying is that Cobalt continues to add functionality to existing emulation packs.


The beauty is that we can get the same b&w look in a RAW file with higher DR and no compression.



Jun 09, 2021 at 01:24 AM
Mitch Alland
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p.13 #4 · Cobalt Profiles


Ulysseita wrote:
If I put some scans and pictures you will be able to tell which one is scan and which is digital?...


Hard to tell but if I would guess, perhaps 1, 3 and 5 — but that can be completely wrong, as all of them look good.



Jun 09, 2021 at 04:35 AM
DaveFP
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p.13 #5 · Cobalt Profiles


So - for those of you that have invested in Cobalt - which packs offer the most fun?

(Taking into account "eye of the beholder" and all that)



Jun 09, 2021 at 04:56 AM
iso.light
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p.13 #6 · Cobalt Profiles


Can someone please describe the workflow to apply a "digital emulation" in Lightroom Classic ?

On the website it says "You must own Adobe DNG basic pack to get emulations working." But no further explanations are given.

You can only select one profile in Lightroom, so while I understand why the DNG package for a camera is required (to ensure the initial picture is "neutral"), I don't get yet how the emulation works afterwards? Do you need to first render your pictures as DNG files using one of the base profiles (if yes, which one?) and then apply again the emulation?

Thanks.




Jun 09, 2021 at 06:30 AM
genji
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p.13 #7 · Cobalt Profiles


DaveFP wrote:
So - for those of you that have invested in Cobalt - which packs offer the most fun?

(Taking into account "eye of the beholder" and all that)


CCD Fever and Monochrom CCD.



Jun 09, 2021 at 08:26 AM
Chuck Coyne
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p.13 #8 · Cobalt Profiles


genji wrote:
CCD Fever and Monochrom CCD.


I agree the CCD Fever and Monochrome CCD are very good but I also have some fun with the Fuji Film and Kodal Kodachrome as well



Jun 09, 2021 at 08:43 AM
Fred Miranda
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p.13 #9 · Cobalt Profiles


Chuck Coyne wrote:
I agree the CCD Fever and Monochrome CCD are very good but I also have some fun with the Fuji Film and Kodal Kodachrome as well


I used to be jealous of GFX and Fuji shooters using the built-in emulations. Not anymore. :-)

Lately, I actually prefer the 'analog' fuji emulations over the 'digital' ones. Although in a few cases, both emulation the same film, it's interesting how different the Cobalt Fuji Velvia "digital" emulation (GFX) is compared to Cobalt's analog one. I like both but the latter is special to my eyes. I can see there was a lot of trial and error to get to that final look which screams Velvia to me.



Jun 09, 2021 at 09:06 AM
Raamiel
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p.13 #10 · Cobalt Profiles


About the Adobe "Camera" profiles on ACR and lightroom, I would raise the explanation on architectural structure differences between Adobe and Cobalt.

That's the first time for me here, I am the creator of the Cobalt project and the tech engineer of the project.

To better understand how profile work in the DNG development pipeline, it's mandatory to start with logic fundamentals: "Camera" profiles are DCP profiles and as any other DCP can be split into different stages.

this is a typical sample of profile "Camera" anatomy:

{
"UniqueCameraModel": "Canon EOS 5DS R",
"ProfileName": "Camera Neutral",
"ProfileCopyright": "Copyright 2014 Adobe Systems, Inc.",
"ProfileEmbedPolicy": "Embed if used",
"ProfileCalibrationSignature": "com.adobe",
"CalibrationIlluminant1": "StdA",
"CalibrationIlluminant2": "D65",
"ColorMatrix1": [
[ 0.684800, -0.166100, -0.022100 ],
[ -0.390400, 1.093100, 0.343400 ],
[ -0.047000, 0.125100, 0.603900 ]
],
"ColorMatrix2": [
[ 0.625000, -0.071100, -0.080800 ],
[ -0.515300, 1.279400, 0.263600 ],
[ -0.124900, 0.219800, 0.561000 ]
],
"ForwardMatrix1": [
[ 0.797800, 0.135200, 0.031300 ],
[ 0.288000, 0.711900, 0.000100 ],
[ 0.000000, 0.000000, 0.825100 ]
],
"ForwardMatrix2": [
[ 0.797800, 0.135200, 0.031300 ],
[ 0.288000, 0.711900, 0.000100 ],
[ 0.000000, 0.000000, 0.825100 ]
],
"DefaultBlackRender": "None",
"BaselineExposureOffset": -0.170000,
"ProfileLookTableDims": [ 90, 16, 16 ],
"ProfileLookTableEncoding": "sRGB",
"ProfileLookTable": [
{ "HueDiv": 0, "SatDiv": 0, "ValDiv": 0, "HueShift": 0.000000, "SatScale": 1.000000, "ValScale": 1.000000 },
{ "HueDiv": 0, "SatDiv": 0, "ValDiv": 1, "HueShift": 2.050087, "SatScale".........

In the first stage, there is the model ref and luma type.
Colormatrix give the approximation of WB , Hue and color temp. to the software.
Fowardmatrix are the colorimetry reference and are used as information and data by the raw decoding process.
That is followed by the Looktable , working for the color grading and the latest is the contrast curve.

If we inspect the data we find the first issue; Forward Matrix are weird, are the same so the profile IS NOT dual illuminant.
And the multiplier is connected to the transformation of ProPhoto, specifically from RGB to XYZ.
So the characterization is missing and this job is done by the LookTable where characterization and color correction get melted.

The sad thing is the characterization is before every user control (shadow recover, exp) and Looktable is after them.

So on this structure, there are two problems, first is the profile is not a dual illuminant profile.
The second even worse, characterization process is done at the wrong point of the processing pipeline.
The result is the "camera" profiles, no matter what camera profiles, are "broken" just after any user control changes (again recovering highlights, opening shadows..exp..etc) .

Cobalt emulations are based on DCP base so dual illuminant.
The colorimetry stage consists of specific ForwardMatrix which incorporate an improved CAT compared to the Bradford; followed by HueSatMap charts specific for any different illuminant.
So on this structure the characterization stage and the color grading, are well separated and on the right part of the development pipeline.

So the funny thing is the Cobalt digital emulation are better than the original just because based on correct profiles.



Jun 09, 2021 at 10:04 AM
Fred Miranda
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p.13 #11 · Cobalt Profiles


Raamiel wrote:
About the Adobe "Camera" profiles on ACR and lightroom, I would raise the explanation on architectural structure differences between Adobe and Cobalt.

That's the first time for me here, I am the creator of the Cobalt project and the tech engineer of the project.

To better understand how profile work in the DNG development pipeline, it's mandatory to start with logic fundamentals: "Camera" profiles are DCP profiles and as any other DCP can be split into different stages.

this is a typical sample of profile "Camera" anatomy:

{
"UniqueCameraModel": "Canon EOS 5DS R",
"ProfileName": "Camera Neutral",
"ProfileCopyright": "Copyright 2014 Adobe Systems, Inc.",
"ProfileEmbedPolicy":
...Show more

I'm glad the Cobalt team does not work for Adobe, otherwise we would not be having this discussion.



Jun 09, 2021 at 10:16 AM
Ulysseita
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p.13 #12 · Cobalt Profiles


In the meantime, we are still working on the Kodak pack.

Ektar
https://i.imgur.com/DDYcIem.jpg

Gold
https://i.imgur.com/yMM7IRB.jpg




Jun 09, 2021 at 10:32 AM
Derek Weston
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p.13 #13 · Cobalt Profiles


Haven't slogged through all their options, but a few questions:

Any good black and white emulations people enjoy?

Any infrared emulations?

Red filter emulations?



Jun 09, 2021 at 11:12 AM
NJPhotographer
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p.13 #14 · Cobalt Profiles


What is the difference between the Cobalt Basic Pack and Cobalt Smart?


Jun 09, 2021 at 11:36 AM
genji
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p.13 #15 · Cobalt Profiles


iso.light wrote:
Can someone please describe the workflow to apply a "digital emulation" in Lightroom Classic ?

On the website it says "You must own Adobe DNG basic pack to get emulations working." But no further explanations are given.

You can only select one profile in Lightroom, so while I understand why the DNG package for a camera is required (to ensure the initial picture is "neutral"), I don't get yet how the emulation works afterwards? Do you need to first render your pictures as DNG files using one of the base profiles (if yes, which one?) and then apply again the emulation?

Thanks.


It’s easier than you are imagining. Installation of a base pack profile makes it then possible to use the emulation profile(s) with that camera. So you simply select the emulation profile you wish to use. In other words it’s a single choice to make.



Jun 09, 2021 at 12:00 PM
iso.light
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p.13 #16 · Cobalt Profiles


Ahhh.... for once, it's easier than what I thought!

So selecting the emulation automatically applies the correct base pack profile (with some voodoo magic I guess).

Excellent, thanks a lot Genji !

genji wrote:
It’s easier than you are imagining. Installation of a base pack profile makes it then possible to use the emulation profile(s) with that camera. So you simply select the emulation profile you wish to use. In other words it’s a single choice to make.





Jun 09, 2021 at 12:43 PM
johnahill
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p.13 #17 · Cobalt Profiles


Just got the basic for my A7r3, even though I'm on R4 now I have more back catalogue of R3 files.
Fuji film profiles look good.

My Sony journey encompasses A7r, A6000, A7r3 and A7r4 which is quite a hit to buy the base profile for all. Still fancy the fuji digital and koda chrome



Jun 09, 2021 at 01:49 PM
Ulysseita
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p.13 #18 · Cobalt Profiles


NJPhotographer wrote:
What is the difference between the Cobalt Basic Pack and Cobalt Smart?


The basic pack is the STARTING point to have all the perks for Cobalt profiles.
You need the basic for your camera to start using our profiles.


Smart is an addon and gives you more basic options for "more focused in color perfection" jobs.
So the output for AdobeRGB and Srgb, landscape and portrait dedicated profiles (including the linear), the PURE so a REPRO with contrast curve with all Repro Perks but instantly usable with a click, and Monochrome with the "scientific", basically a conversion in b&w following our eyes sensibility around the spectrum... a HUMAN natural black and white and his linear profile.



Jun 09, 2021 at 03:51 PM
Ulysseita
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p.13 #19 · Cobalt Profiles


Some Monochrome settings (all excluding the last one with standard without any setting applied other than the profile or red, green, and colored filters for FUJI ACROS and Leica MONO CCD).

The last is the scientific linear with a single custom curve applied to keep all the data in the histogram and respecting my taste and the zone system.





Cobalt Standard






Cobalt Fuji GFX100 ACROS






Cobalt Leica Monochrome CCD






Cobalt Leica CCD Fever M9 jpg bw standard






Cobalt Smart Mono Scientific






Cobalt Smart Mono Scientific Linear






Cobalt Smart Mono Scientific Linear EDITED




Jun 09, 2021 at 04:06 PM
joychris
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p.13 #20 · Cobalt Profiles


johnahill wrote:
Just got the basic for my A7r3, even though I'm on R4 now I have more back catalogue of R3 files.
Fuji film profiles look good.

My Sony journey encompasses A7r, A6000, A7r3 and A7r4 which is quite a hit to buy the base profile for all. Still fancy the fuji digital and koda chrome


I'm in the same boat with a7r2, a7r3 and a73 making up the bulk of my catalog, all split pretty evenly over the last 5 years with a bunch of Fuji XT2 mixed in ! Where to start...

Cheers

Chris



Jun 09, 2021 at 04:17 PM
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