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Archive 2020 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory

  
 
nehemiahphoto
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p.24 #1 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


Fred Miranda wrote:
The 85/1.4 GM wide open has quite noticeable axial CA. I'd say they are similar but have not compared side by side.


For something interesting (at least to me) regarding the LAEA5 and the ZA 135.

My first FF camera was a Sony a850. At that time, Sony was not a respected camera company by serious shooters--and with pretty good reason. From about 2006 to 2014 or so, they struggled to do the basics right, sold their sensors to Nikon who got better (or at least different) IQ out of them, had that stigma of an electronic company and were trying to embrace SLT technology, which always had hurdles and never took off competitively for many shooters. They were not only overshadowed by Nikon and Canon, but by Minolta as well. Their pro-support was very poor comparatively, and it was hard to find high end a-mount gear even at many substantial pro camera stores. Lens releases were erratic--Sony just seemed to lack direction or cohesion.

There were some premium lenses, like the ZA 16-35/2.8, 24/2, 24-70/2.8 and 135/1.8 and 85/1.4, but overall, the line-up lacked some serious decent standard pro lenses--there was no high performing 35/1.4, 24/1.4, 200/2, 50 1.4/1.2, (the ZA came a bit too late) and big teles weren't updated, no tilt-shift and such. The 70-200G 2.8 never got a ton or respect and many preferred the build, IQ, price and draw of the Minolta 80-200/2.8 (myself included). The prosumer prime f1.8 range was sparse/nonexistent, as well as capable f4 zooms. Sony (and many shooters) were leaning on out of production lenses from Minolta or 3rd party makers.

I say all this to contextualize how unrivaled the system was as a portrait shooter in it's time.

The catalog is still impressive, extremely so by 2006-2014 standards: Minolta 85 1.4, Minolta 85 1.4G limited, ZA 85 1.4, Minolta 100/2, ZA 135 1.8, Sony 135 2.8 STF and the 200/2.8.

Add this catalog to a most compelling body at the in the a850/a900 at the time for portraits (the D3x came later). It offered a superb, clear, massive OVF, highest resolution, fantastic and responsive ergonomics and build, the highest resolution sensor when it came out (D700 and 5dMk2 were the rivals), some of the best color I've seen out of a camera (still) and IBIS for all those primes--which no one else offered.

Now that you've shot the ZA 135, Mino 200/2.8 and 100/2, you probably have a better appreciation for how comically under appreciated these lenses were/are. Crazy to think these AF lenses at 15-25 years old--they were so far ahead of their time with balancing technical IQ and rendering. One might argue, its one of the most complete portrait systems ever. And given the LAEA5 seems to support all these lenses quite well, in addition to the Sony's new GM 85/FE 85/Batis 85, GM 135/Batis 135, 100 STF, I think it's more than reasonable to say the Sony system is the best portrait system ever in terms of glass. And you can adopt essentially any of that older and SLR glass-crazy!!! And that's not including wider ZA 50/1.4, 1.8, GM 24 types...

You used to see tons of people calling the 135L and ZA 135 a wash (ha!), the 85L the best portrait lens ever (I don't agree at all) Many had never shot, or heard of the 85 ltd. The Mino 100 was largely just respected in the Sony community. Canon had the 85 1.2L and 135L, and Nikon had their 85 1.4D and 135DC, but Sony was quite ahead of the pack and it's time.

It's nice to see these lenses get recognition. The ZA 85 still flies under the radar, though if you like a modern abstracted smooth draw, it's quite lovely, and one of Zeiss' better 85 attempts IMO. The 85ltd is still out of reach for many, and the Mino 85 1.4 is quite great for a lens of it's era and generally, but that too was largely overlooked.

Anyway, sorry for the long post, but I thought you and others might find it interesting (or enjoy the memory).



Dec 05, 2020 at 03:45 PM
philip_pj
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p.24 #2 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


Looking back, it would have been preferable had Canon failed the digital transition rather than Minolta. What got me into Sony (a900) was an article by Michael Reichmann. As a landscaper, he bought in due to the stronger DR of the Sony over its contemporaries. The colour of the a900/a850 was/is tremendous, thanks to the very heavy CFA. In those distant early days, we did not have Bill Claff to help us out and some in the RC developer community opined that the Sonys should be shot at ISO 320.

As the below graph shows, this was a disaster, as you lost a precious full stop. I lost many images from a once-in-a-lifetime trip due to scrupulously listening to these experts. The large-form camera that won me completely was the (SLT) a99 v1. The graph below shows why. Its peak DR closely matches the best of the small Sonys that followed, right up to the present day. I always respected the Minolta lenses, even as I used the CY range back then - all these film lenses really gained a new lease on life with the great colour and stronger DR. (several of mine are still in service and will remain that way if Cosina deserts Sony.)





Dynamic range ISO 50 to ISO 1000







Legend of camera bodies




Dec 05, 2020 at 08:45 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.24 #3 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


philip_pj wrote:
Looking back, it would have been preferable had Canon failed the digital transition rather than Minolta. What got me into Sony (a900) was an article by Michael Reichmann. As a landscaper, he bought in due to the stronger DR of the Sony over its contemporaries. The colour of the a900/a850 was/is tremendous, thanks to the very heavy CFA. In those distant early days, we did not have Bill Claff to help us out and some in the RC developer community opined that the Sonys should be shot at ISO 320.

As the below graph shows, this was a disaster, as
...Show more


Lol--the ISO320. I remember that crap. Sad in hindsight though about your photos. Sorry to hear it.

I too owned the a99 and really enjoyed it. One confusing thing about that camera though, even now. If you look on dpreview, it says that ISO50 is an expansion for the a99, not native ISO, and that you'll clip highlights easier and loose DR. If you look at DXOmark (which I reference for DR, not lenses), it gives the a99 a respectable 14 stops, but that is still decently behind what Claff gives it.

If you look at ISO50 and 100 of the a7r, a7r3, a7r, a7, a7s on Bill's site, they are nearly all identical. The a99 though has much higher DPR at ISO50 than ISO100. At ISO50, the a99 is still impressively competitive with the a7r3.

So 2 questions: 1) why is ISO50 no native if the DR is as good at this ISO on most of the a7 range? Are we adding noise reduction? 2) Can anyone explain to me why the ISO50 and ISO100 DR disparity exists on only the a99, and why dpreview (seemingly) disagrees with Claff's ISO50 assessment?



Dec 05, 2020 at 09:46 PM
QuietOC
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p.24 #4 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


nehemiahphoto wrote:
2) Can anyone explain to me why the ISO50 and ISO100 DR disparity exists on only the a99...

FWIW: The A77 and A77II also show more DR at ISO 50 than ISO 100.



Dec 05, 2020 at 11:11 PM
ocean2059
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p.24 #5 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


philip_pj wrote:
Looking back, it would have been preferable had Canon failed the digital transition rather than Minolta. What got me into Sony (a900) was an article by Michael Reichmann. As a landscaper, he bought in due to the stronger DR of the Sony over its contemporaries. The colour of the a900/a850 was/is tremendous, thanks to the very heavy CFA. In those distant early days, we did not have Bill Claff to help us out and some in the RC developer community opined that the Sonys should be shot at ISO 320.

As the below graph shows, this was a disaster, as
...Show more

In addition to the ZA 135/1.8, the Minolta 100/2 and the Minolta APO 180/2.8, I felt that the ZA 85/1.4 is also under appreciated. I like them very much and have been keeping the A900/A99 so I can still use these lenses. Personally, other than MP, I prefer the A99 over A7r3.

Here are two older images (taken in Germany about five years ago) with an A900 and ZA 85/1.4.



© ocean2059 2020





© ocean2059 2020




Dec 05, 2020 at 11:35 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.24 #6 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


QuietOC wrote:
FWIW: The A77 and A77II also show more DR at ISO 50 than ISO 100.

Intersting. All SLT models.



Dec 05, 2020 at 11:57 PM
TheEmrys
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p.24 #7 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


To me that is more of a fault in DXO's methodology. Back when I had an SLT, Sony had even stated it resulted in a slight loss of DR.

QuietOC wrote:
FWIW: The A77 and A77II also show more DR at ISO 50 than ISO 100.




Dec 06, 2020 at 12:01 AM
freaklikeme
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p.24 #8 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


baltmin wrote:
Thanks for providing these details. Are axial CA and purple fringing the same or worse than the 85GM?


Worse wide open. The ZA 85 can be a real CA machine wide open. They even up at about f/4, but the ZA lacks the GM's overall resolution.



Dec 06, 2020 at 01:06 AM
freaklikeme
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p.24 #9 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


TheEmrys wrote:
To me that is more of a fault in DXO's methodology. Back when I had an SLT, Sony had even stated it resulted in a slight loss of DR.



Another good reason to remove it entirely and just manually focus.



Dec 06, 2020 at 01:20 AM
nehemiahphoto
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p.24 #10 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


TheEmrys wrote:
To me that is more of a fault in DXO's methodology. Back when I had an SLT, Sony had even stated it resulted in a slight loss of DR.

Oddly though, Bill Cliff’s stuff shows the PDR noticeably highest at ISO50 on the a99 as well



Dec 06, 2020 at 12:04 PM
freaklikeme
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p.24 #11 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


Has anyone here used the Mino APO Macro 200/4? I always wanted to try that lens but never found the right deal. From what I've seen, it's better than the Nikon AF-D 200/4 and maybe even a little better than the comparable Pentax A*.


Dec 06, 2020 at 06:07 PM
pwpub
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p.24 #12 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


I used this marvel of a lens for about 3 years and regrettably sold it last year.

The Minolta AF 200mm F4 Macro APO G was one of the last G lenses Minolta produced (think the 70-200/2.8 SSM G was the last one) and in limited quantity, which explains its rarity in the marketplace.

It's a high-quality build, in black color, offering 1:1 macro, and suffers almost no CA. Razor sharp at F4 - albeit less than the FE 135 GM, and optimal at F4.5 to F5. But its most special assets, besides offering 1:1 Macro at 200mm, are the gorgeous colors, and the very special rendering of subject and front-/background separation it can produce. The Bokeh - at the right distances - is superb.

The 200/4 G has only two downsides: fairly heavy with 1.4 kg and slow AF.



freaklikeme wrote:
Has anyone here used the Mino APO Macro 200/4? I always wanted to try that lens but never found the right deal. From what I've seen, it's better than the Nikon AF-D 200/4 and maybe even a little better than the comparable Pentax A*.




Edited on Dec 07, 2020 at 07:54 AM · View previous versions



Dec 06, 2020 at 07:58 PM
freaklikeme
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p.24 #13 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


Sounds very good. How was the focus breathing?

pwpub wrote:
I used this marvel of a lens for about 3 years and regrettably sold it last year.

The Minolta AF 200mm F4 Macro APO G was one of the last G lenses Minolta produced (think the 70-200/2.8 SSM G was the last one) and in limited quantity, which explains its rarity in the marketplace.

It's a high-quality build, in black color, offering 1:1 macro, and suffers almost no CA. Razor sharp at F4 - albeit less than the FE 135 GM, and optimal at F4.5 to F5. But its most special assets, besides offering 1:1 Macro at 200mm, are the gorgeous
...Show more




Dec 06, 2020 at 08:42 PM
pwpub
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p.24 #14 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


Can't say for sure since I never paid particular attention. I used the 200mm not only for macro but often as a general purpose tele.


Dec 07, 2020 at 08:44 AM
Michael Gordon
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p.24 #15 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


TheEmrys wrote:
Everything is transmitted properly. The 5 pin, older Minolta a transmit enough for 3 axis stabilization, while the newer 8 pin ones can do 5. Focal length (even on zooms) and aperture all get passed through.



Yikes, I just looked at the compatibility list from Sony. The 100/2.8 sf is not on the list. Does that mean the AF is totally non functional? Exif still works? If the latter is true a cheaper adapter is likely good enough. I wonder which is best?--probably the same tor the STF which is MF anyway.

http://support.d-imaging.sony.co.jp/www/cscs/accessories/compatibility.php?area=us&lang=en&mdl=LA-EA5&cat=7



Dec 07, 2020 at 07:00 PM
TheEmrys
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p.24 #16 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


No, Sony just didn't put any Minolta lenses on their list. They will all work on an a6600 and a7rIV.


Dec 07, 2020 at 08:06 PM
Michael Gordon
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p.24 #17 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


Thank you for clarifying. I trust it works on the A7RIII, Just don't want to spend a bunch of dosh and be disappointed.


Dec 08, 2020 at 05:39 PM
freaklikeme
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p.24 #18 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


Michael Gordon wrote:
Thank you for clarifying. I trust it works on the A7RIII, Just don't want to spend a bunch of dosh and be disappointed.


Unless you know of a firmware update to allow it to function with the rIII, it's limited to the rIV and 6600 for AF with screw-drive lenses.



Dec 08, 2020 at 07:20 PM
TheEmrys
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p.24 #19 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


It won't work on the a7rIII or anything else UNLESS they have SAM/SSM motors. The only ones that work with the original screw driven lenses are the two models I mentioned above.

Michael Gordon wrote:
Thank you for clarifying. I trust it works on the A7RIII, Just don't want to spend a bunch of dosh and be disappointed.




Dec 08, 2020 at 07:21 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.24 #20 · Introducing LA-EA5 | Mount Adaptor | Sony | Accessory


Update: Just received the 1.4x TELEPLUS MC4 DGX

The good news is that it works with the 135/1.8 ZA + LA-EA5 adapter! It even shows the aperture value and works with auto-IBIS. Focus speed seems just as fast as the lens bare but I have not checked IQ yet. -- that could potentially be the bad news

The camera (A7RIV) tells me the lens is f/2.5 with the adapter + 1.4x. (190/2.5 equiv.)



Dec 09, 2020 at 06:12 PM
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