p.2 #1 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
Panasonic won't abandon the full frame market. The S1h is their future. If they abandon anything, it will be M43 in favour of Super 35, which could also shoot a M43 sort of crop.
The S1r is a very good stills camera, I am in the market for a low mileage one - if the price is right...
p.2 #2 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
Its a great camera, (S1 is my main camera) but the lack of phase detect is really hurting the system, also how slow they are releasing lenses.... yes the 24mm just came out, but after how long?
And yes we have sigma lenses, but they pulse like crazy.... so unless pana does some magic, only users who are focused entirely in video will be looking at their cameras.
p.2 #4 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
"If possible I'll take out my GFX 100S or X1D"
Which one do you prefer? Interested in your take as I had the GFX 100S and much prefer the X1DII for the colors despite its annoyances. Not to mention the XCD lenses which seem to be a cut above than most (and I have used, still own some of the SL primes).
flash wrote:
I'm a bit like you (although more than two systems). Basically, medium format when I can and 135 format otherwise. I've been through Sony, Canon and Nikon and I just don't need anything faster than the S1R (or SL2). I've kept a Sony and Nikon around because of the longer lenses but now I have a 150-600 for L mount, I really don't see the point, so I'm all in for L mount in smaller sensors, in a DSLR, style body. And I still maintain that used properly, very few people need anything more in AF speed. Missing a shot or having everything in perfect focus is an unhealthy obsession for some at the expense of better images. Fueled by Youtube bloggers who are usually more video than photography and not actually working in the stills or video industries, with some exceptions. I do still use my M's and occasionally CL. And I hold on to my Fuji X lenses in the hope of a higher resolution body (preferably XPro styled).
The high res modes (from Olympus, then others) do work, but not often enough for me. And I still like the admittedly small differences to the slightly larger sensor. I think the biggest difference in the GFX100 to the older sensor sensor is the colour, not the PDAF pixels, although I do agree that currently you can squeeze a tiny bit more out of a CDAF sensor, sometimes. If possible I'll take out my GFX 100S or X1D. The only real limitation is lens range, for me. Not only do I have 14-900mm (if I use the Sigma 1.4x) natively, I also can adapt T/S, macro and specialty lenses to the S1R/SL2 easily. Add in the spectacular Leica glass and it really is nearly perfect for my needs. Unfortunately my Z7 and Sony's haven't been used in months.
p.2 #5 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
woodstork wrote:
I think Leica is pretty committed to SL and hope Panasonic is too. Leica has a rather unique business model and plays within a high-end market of their own making, but Panny seems to be competing within a very crowded niche. I worry they will abandon it absent higher market share, which is a shame because I find the S1R to be such an enabling body. They haven't done a great job marketing how it differs. I think the L-mount will survive through Leica even if Panny and Sigma abandon the Alliance. And they may simply reel in their participation. For example we will probably still get Sigma lenses made with L-mounts (same as they do now making L and E versions). And Panny will continue to make some lower-priced Leica-branded lenses for Leica. So, the alliance depends on Leica I think.
I've often wondered about the dynamic that leads to a fairly reliable supply of SL glass and bodies on the used market. I assume its driven by wealthy hobbyists with buyer's remorse. But who knows? It certainly isn't because the lenses are a disappointment.
I believe Leica has the same issue as earlier with the old Leicaflex SL camera series in the early 1970s. Great cameras, great technology but unable to hold up against stronger competition. Same now with the digital SL series. I agree that the L lenses have great quality. But they are sitting mostly on the shelves - I suspect Sigma sells this kind of lenses in > 95% for the E-mount. I also agree that Leica management has committed itself to the L-mount - they had to do something to keep the ball rolling and not just depend on the M series. But I would have opened the path for an EVF-based small sized interchangeable lens mount camera instead, pretty much a Q-based FF camera with the option to mount all kind of existing M-series. 100% a potential winner just here - something many would love to see but Leica so far did not deliver. Instead they are stuck now with this L-mount (bigger cameras, much bigger and expensive lenses) which IMO is not flying well.
p.2 #6 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
Chip shortages are impacting all manufacturers. So delayed product launches are to be expected. Panasonic needs to add phase detect, or some other tech to match the offerings of Canon and Sony. I am not sure why they don't... Nikon seems to do it. That said, for most still photography, the current system is more than adequate.
If they ship a second gen camera with phase detect, they will sell a lot of camera's. I hope they do...
p.2 #7 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
60HzShuffle wrote:
I don't really see a lot of posts around here about either camera. I love my S1R, but the have the Leica SL2 and having a hard time talking myself into getting rid of the Panasonic gear so I can buy more SL lenses. The camera ergos are really nice and I love the colors too. I actually have 2 S1R's and will sell one for sure but may keep everything else. I have all the lenses except for the 50mm. Just curious how many other FM Panasonic S users are out there and their experience good, bad and indifferent.
You'll find a much larger Leica SL user base on the Leica User's Forum. Maybe there is another forum where Panasonic S1 system users congregate?
"The State of the L-Mount Alliance, One Year Later" - March 2020
Some interesting comments posted in this article over a year ago to include respective partner's talking up their products and the alliance as well as PetaPixel points out some strengths and weaknesses....but this info is more than a Pandemic year ago.
A tough video IMO to sit through ( English subtitles) L-Mount update March 2021, and also includes info on the effect of COVID.
p.2 #8 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
Jaree wrote:
"If possible I'll take out my GFX 100S or X1D"
Which one do you prefer? Interested in your take as I had the GFX 100S and much prefer the X1DII for the colors despite its annoyances. Not to mention the XCD lenses which seem to be a cut above than most (and I have used, still own some of the SL primes).
X1D, definitely. Having said that I use the GFX100S more.
The X1D(II) has the best ergonomics and usability of any camera I've owned. HB's colour science is unmatched (although Fuji's is good). The long exposure implementation including programable count down timer is a masterstroke. The lenses are epic, including a few HC lenses I have adapted. They're slightly ahead of the Fuji's, mostly in aberration control. The leaf shutters reduce the need for IBIS and there's zero shutter shock. Menus are the best in the business, trumping even Leica's menus. The 80mm might be the best single lens I've ever used. The speed never bothered me. I don't have expectations of S1R AF speeds. I wouldn't say no, though.
I tend to use the Fuji more because it's a more comprehensive and flexible *system*. IBIS really makes a difference. There's plenty of zooms to build a kit from, although there's always an annoying hole in the range. Flash works better. I love the three way tilt screen (same as the S1R). It's in between the SL2/S1R and X1D in terms of speed and flexibility so it suits a LOT of what I do. I have travelled extensively with the X1D, but it's easier with the Fuji.
If HB released a couple more zooms, like the 100-200 and upcoming Fuji 20-35, I'd probably move back to HB almost entirely. I would like a X2D 100 with IBIS and that 100MP sensor. I'd forgo the tilt screen to keep the body the same size and even video altogether for the same reason. But they're first world problems on a huge scale.. I'm lucky to have either one.
p.2 #9 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
Thanks for sharing the details, much appreciated! Agree with HB colors, there is "something" that seems very pleasing to my eyes and that's why I like it. A 100mp X1D version with IBIS would be a dream!
p.2 #10 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
retrofocus wrote:
Only real sales volume numbers for the SL system would clarify this which we all don't have. But I am not convinced that the SL is selling as well as the M system - by far not. There are indirect hints pointing towards this: the excessive hype Leica pushes the SL system only in recent advertisements online and by influencer YouTubers whereas you don't hear as much about the M system - because the latter is selling well and M's are on waiting lists - not the case for SL2 cameras which you can get easily. Used market is flooded with SLs for relatively low/moderate prices, too. The M system maintains its benefit of small size gear with high image quality plus the collector appeal - all this is missing with the SL which has lots of external MLC competition. Bulkier SL body, bulkier lenses, just AF, internal EVF, and better video doesn't justify the price tag for many users.
Even the article ends with an potentially optimistic note that the L-mount might still make it, I wouldn't place my bets on it. ...Show more →
2.8% is of course concerning particularly in what I would call a grossly over-supplied full frame market where expensive new bells and whistles seem to be required to keep the shrinking customer base spending on new gear on a much needed regular basis. Not sure how many new customers the advanced camera market creates in 2021--but it doesn't seem/feel significant. I think Nikon is a prime example of what can happen very quickly when a relatively giant even fiercely loyal customer base simply just stops spending on new gear.
Sales are sales. Not the first time I've wondered if the L-Mount Alliance will make it long term as is and now that Nikon seems to be trying to get back in the game with Z version II improvements + the Z9 there will be even more competition in the ever shrinking market. I am not concerned for Leica SL system, clearly Leica customers are still spending but again I do wonder if the L-Mount Alliance will continue as is. There was some mention of more partners particularly in the cine sector, but probably lots of second thoughts as the Pandemic "mind set" continues to linger.
FWIW, as a long time Sony Shooter, I am finding Panasonic's CDAF/DFD AF technology in the Leica SL2 very capable. I am not however suggesting it matches PDAF or Dual Pixel AF in all areas. But for most I think more than sufficient and apparently the SL2 has not been updated yet with the latest Panasonic CDAF/DFD AF technology e.g., found in the S1H and the SL2-S.
On another note, Panasonic seems committed to CDAF/DFD AF technology but who knows if they are also investigating PDAF/DFD. I do wonder however if current L mount lenses designed for DFD AF would AF on a PDAF system camera ?
p.2 #11 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
LBJ2 wrote:
2.8% is of course concerning particularly in what I would call a grossly over-supplied full frame market where expensive new bells and whistles seem to be required to keep the shrinking customer base spending on new gear on a much needed regular basis. Not sure how many new customers the advanced camera market creates in 2021--but it doesn't seem/feel significant. I think Nikon is a prime example of what can happen very quickly when a relatively giant even fiercely loyal customer base simply just stops spending on new gear.
Sales are sales. Not the first time I've wondered if the L-Mount Alliance will make it long term as is and now that Nikon seems to be trying to get back in the game with Z version II improvements + the Z9 there will be even more competition in the ever shrinking market. I am not concerned for Leica SL system, clearly Leica customers are still spending but again I do wonder if the L-Mount Alliance will continue as is. There was some mention of more partners particularly in the cine sector, but probably lots of second thoughts as the Pandemic "mind set" continues to linger.
FWIW, as a long time Sony Shooter, I am finding Panasonic's CDAF/DFD AF technology in the Leica SL2 very capable. I am not however suggesting it matches PDAF or Dual Pixel AF in all areas. But for most I think more than sufficient and apparently the SL2 has not been updated yet with the latest Panasonic CDAF/DFD AF technology e.g., found in the S1H and the SL2-S.
On another note, Panasonic seems committed to CDAF/DFD AF technology but who knows if they are also investigating PDAF/DFD. I do wonder however if current L mount lenses designed for DFD AF would AF on a PDAF system camera ?...Show more →
I have no personal experience with either CDAF/DFD AF or PDAF or Dual Pixel AF even I also shoot Sony - but only with adapted manual focus or with older EF-based Canon lenses. My photography rarely requires AF - and then still my old Canon 5D MkII is sufficient here. So I can't answer the question which latest AF standard is better/more suitable in which kind of situations since both technologies are not a current focus area for me.
It is always hard to predict how long a camera mount system will be around. Sony never sold a huge amount of their DSLRs with A-mount either, but the mount stayed around for quite some time. Since Leica only has M- and L-mount cameras, they are likely not giving up on the L-mount which has the option of using AF-based technology as pointed out. The alliance likely also will continue for a while since especially Panasonic and Leica both profit from each other.
Biggest success for Leica was and still is the M-system. I expect Leica releasing a new camera line which merges M-mount cameras with the Q-series - something like an interchangeable lens Q-sized FF camera with EVF instead of rangefinder (I doubt Leica will offer both rangefinder and EVF in the same camera) and maybe also with L-mount. I suspect that many will use existing M-lenses on such hybrid camera system - not sure how Leica will solve the in-house competition issue here. Because if such camera is equipped with L-mount, it will surely negatively affect further SL-sales. If they equip such camera with the traditional M-mount, it will not push the L-mount further but will leave the SL/CL systems separate and can allow for optimized sensor to be used with rangefinder lenses. Not sure how this might play out, but it might give a direction where the L mount will be going.
p.2 #12 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
60HzShuffle wrote:
I don't really see a lot of posts around here about either camera. I love my S1R, but the have the Leica SL2 and having a hard time talking myself into getting rid of the Panasonic gear so I can buy more SL lenses. The camera ergos are really nice and I love the colors too. I actually have 2 S1R's and will sell one for sure but may keep everything else. I have all the lenses except for the 50mm. Just curious how many other FM Panasonic S users are out there and their experience good, bad and indifferent.
Before I had the SL2, I bought the S1R along with a Sigma 70mm macro to do negative scanning. With multi shot mode, the scans were in a whole other league compared to scanning on a flatbed. And I did not want to invest in a dedicated s film scanner because I wanted to do MF negs from years gone by and also being made with my 903 SWC and Mamiya 7. All reviews of currently available scanners were lackluster and took forever to do the scans.
The upside with the S1R is that I already had an M->L adapter sitting around that I had used a bit with my Leica CL and a couple M lenses that I’ve had for 35+ years.
Well, when I put the 35 Summicron on the S1R, it was spectacular—except near the edges. I knew the SL2 would handle the M lenses better near the edges and I embarked on my SL2 odyssey. I sold the S1R (which I had bought pre-owned) and bought into the SL2. I understand that the S1R has a different cover glass thickness which affects the M lenses negatively. I’m not sure what the benefit of thicker cover glass is, so have no idea why cameras with similar sensors use different thickness glass.
Ultimately, I sold off the tech cam gear and the Hasselblad 907x and lenses preferring to “limit” myself (ha!) to Leica gear with a lot of lens interoperability. I now have M cameras, SL2 and a CL and the lenses from the M go on all of them. I also have a few AF lenses for SL2 and CL to satisfy the desire for some autofocus options.
p.2 #13 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
I have an S1R for landscapes paired with the Panasonic G9 for travel and telephoto. I think both the S1R and G9 are under appreciated.
I switched to Panasonic from Canon (7D, 7Dii, 5Dsr, R) and the Panasonic ergonomics, haptics, and feature set are far beyond Canon. Earlier this year, I test drove the Canon R5 and Nikon Z7 cameras and in the end returned both to B&H in favor of keeping my S1R based on the ergonomics and features.
Features in particular that I find very useful and which are missing on both the Canon and Nikon cameras are Zebras in stills mode and focus peaking available even while in AF mode.
The build quality and smart design of the S1R goes more than skin deep to the core of the machine. The engineers emphasized a certain balance of robust function and user experience for the entire build and use cycle including assembly, wild-proofing, photographer haptics, and reparability.
Some things that jumped out here to me are the lack of heat sink paste plastered all over the motherboard, with a well-organized layout on the board. They dealt with heat in a more sophisticated way. I use this in blistering tropical sun and very high humidity without problem.
Also, I believe the larger than average Sensor/IBIS unit is an interesting design call that cost them wins on the 'smaller and lighter body' battle, but probably enabled the class-leading pixel shift which to me is a major differentiator for this system. Fuji GFX went with a smaller approach and their pixel shift is rather abysmal. Firmware undoubtedly plays a key role, but it has to be integrated with a threshold foundation of mechanics and electronics to excel. Panasonic's larger array clearly delivers the goods on IBIS and high resolution shift.
The other choices I value are no PDAF, no AA filter, and relatively thin sensor cover glass on this 47mp beauty - resulting in a very clean handoff from lens to sensor. This is why I originally was attracted to try this body and pair it with the SL APO lens's killer micro-contrast. And it certainly fulfilled expectations.
So, it seems like they designed a camera starting with the idea to offer a sweetspot of resolution without crushing pixel pitch - a landscape shooters dream. Then they hit a home run for using pixel shift to get even more from that sensor. And they managed construction QA/QC by making all the goodies inside their robust sealed and tough exterior comparatively easier to build.
p.2 #15 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
It definitely is, but it is Panasonic's fault. Firstly, they priced the cameras, especially S1R, too high. Secondly, they released the cameras before finishing the work on AF. Hence the initial reviews of camera were highly critical.
When I first test drove S1R I was immediately turned off by the huge size and weight. I used it around for a week, took some handheld high-res shots and returned the camera. I only reviewed the pictures a few months ago, and was blown away by the sharpness and details present. A little bit of processing and the contrast and colors just popped. So I went ahead and bought a kit from B&S again and it has now become my main camera, replacing A7R IV.
My experience is that without even trying, I am able to consistently get sharp pictures from S1R. I attribute it to 1) best in class stabilization 2) AI based subject detection, and 3) Exceptional lenses.
I have compared 24-105 f/4 with Canon RF and Sony FE equivalent. It is weakest at 105mm, but still comparable. At every other focal length it beats both Sony & Canon, especially in edge/corners, sometimes by a significant margin. The 70-300mm, which I recently received, reminds me of 300mm f/2.8 prime I used to have. The Sigma lenses that I have are also stellar. Obviously the Sony equivalents have the same optics, but I get better results on S1R due to above mentioned factors. Additionally the level of customization on Panasonic is off the charts and makes using the camera a pleasure.
Panasonic S1R has mostly been a marketing failure due to its high price, size, and initial AF performance. S1 has done moderately well, but S1H and S5 have been a hit. I suspect that S5 is Panasonic's best selling camera now, even over the venerable GH5 (m43). I sincerely hope that Panasonic will not discontinue the S1R line, but learn from its mistake and introduce a more refined camera for the next generation.
p.2 #16 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
indusphoto wrote:
It definitely is, but it is Panasonic's fault. Firstly, they priced the cameras, especially S1R, too high. Secondly, they released the cameras before finishing the work on AF. Hence the initial reviews of camera were highly critical.
When I first test drove S1R I was immediately turned off by the huge size and weight. I used it around for a week, took some handheld high-res shots and returned the camera. I only reviewed the pictures a few months ago, and was blown away by the sharpness and details present. A little bit of processing and the contrast and colors just popped. So I went ahead and bought a kit from B&S again and it has now become my main camera, replacing A7R IV.
My experience is that without even trying, I am able to consistently get sharp pictures from S1R. I attribute it to 1) best in class stabilization 2) AI based subject detection, and 3) Exceptional lenses.
I have compared 24-105 f/4 with Canon RF and Sony FE equivalent. It is weakest at 105mm, but still comparable. At every other focal length it beats both Sony & Canon, especially in edge/corners, sometimes by a significant margin. The 70-300mm, which I recently received, reminds me of 300mm f/2.8 prime I used to have. The Sigma lenses that I have are also stellar. Obviously the Sony equivalents have the same optics, but I get better results on S1R due to above mentioned factors. Additionally the level of customization on Panasonic is off the charts and makes using the camera a pleasure.
Panasonic S1R has mostly been a marketing failure due to its high price, size, and initial AF performance. S1 has done moderately well, but S1H and S5 have been a hit. I suspect that S5 is Panasonic's best selling camera now, even over the venerable GH5 (m43). I sincerely hope that Panasonic will not discontinue the S1R line, but learn from its mistake and introduce a more refined camera for the next generation.
Couldn't have said it better myself. I dismissed this as an overpriced late-entry MILC system based on early reviews. I later saw on an online forum that master printer and photographer Robert Park sold his medium format system after extensively testing and printing from the S1R. Thought, well if its inspired that guy to do that, then maybe there's something to it. Tried it and sold my GFX kit.
Panasonic could certainly benefit by stealing Sony's marketing manager. This system offers IQ I find to sit squarely between full-scale medium format and full-frame competitors - leaning more toward equaling crop-senor medium format IQ. And its portability and versality are also intermediate - leaning hard toward full-frame systems in that gradient. I think this system does what Fuji GFX seeks to accomplish by offering incredible IQ in a robust, highly-usable field camera. I ended up choosing the Panasonic because I find it competes very well on the first variable, and definitely wins the second.
Thanks for discussing the Panasonic zooms BTW. I may need to look into those - seem like great value with strong IQ!
p.2 #17 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
woodstork wrote:
Couldn't have said it better myself. I dismissed this as an overpriced late-entry MILC system based on early reviews. I later saw on an online forum that master printer and photographer Robert Park sold his medium format system after extensively testing and printing from the S1R. Thought, well if its inspired that guy to do that, then maybe there's something to it. Tried it and sold my GFX kit.
Panasonic could certainly benefit by stealing Sony's marketing manager. This system offers IQ I find to sit squarely between full-scale medium format and full-frame competitors - leaning more toward equaling crop-senor medium format IQ. And its portability and versality are also intermediate - leaning hard toward full-frame systems in that gradient. I think this system does what Fuji GFX seeks to accomplish by offering incredible IQ in a robust, highly-usable field camera. I ended up choosing the Panasonic because I find it competes very well on the first variable, and definitely wins the second.
Thanks for discussing the Panasonic zooms BTW. I may need to look into those - seem like great value with strong IQ!
Chiming in here, the 24-105/4 is pretty fantastic, and the 70-200/4 is outstanding. I have since swapped the 70-200 for a Sigma 100-400 as I needed reach, and it too is a great lens. (especially at the price point) But yes, had I not gotten a great deal on a used S1R from a friend, I don't think I would have considered it, as the new price is pretty unrealistic.
Also, I believe a lot of the poor reviews on the AF system are largely based on the pulsing in AF-C. I too found it unsettling, but most of the time quite accurate. While shooting it left me feeling like it was missed, but time and time again I open the file to find it is in focus & tack sharp. I also prefer the colours over Sony by a large margin. I am hopeful a S1R II or S2R will come out with improved AF, and at a competitive price point
p.2 #18 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
helimat wrote:
Also, I believe a lot of the poor reviews on the AF system are largely based on the pulsing in AF-C. I too found it unsettling, but most of the time quite accurate. While shooting it left me feeling like it was missed, but time and time again I open the file to find it is in focus & tack sharp. I also prefer the colours over Sony by a large margin. I am hopeful a S1R II or S2R will come out with improved AF, and at a competitive price point
Right about pulsing, one needs to get used to it. Sony also does that in AF-S mode in some lenses (where it is using CDAF). However there is another issue. Panasonic's implementation of 100% image review is very poor. If you are shooting Raw only, zooming in shows very soft image, Even when shooting Raw+jpg, the zoomed in image is only marginally better. So reviewing the image in camera does not inspire confidence at all.
p.2 #19 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
indusphoto wrote:
Right about pulsing, one needs to get used to it. Sony also does that in AF-S mode in some lenses (where it is using CDAF). However there is another issue. Panasonic's implementation of 100% image review is very poor. If you are shooting Raw only, zooming in shows very soft image, Even when shooting Raw+jpg, the zoomed in image is only marginally better. So reviewing the image in camera does not inspire confidence at all.
That's right, that's also a big reason I am often surprised when I open the files on a computer. It did help a bit by shooting RAW + jpg, and cranking the sharpness IIRC
p.2 #20 · Is the Panasonic S1 or S1R under appreciated?
indusphoto wrote:
It definitely is, but it is Panasonic's fault. Firstly, they priced the cameras, especially S1R, too high. Secondly, they released the cameras before finishing the work on AF. Hence the initial reviews of camera were highly critical.
It's also because most of the reviews are by vloggers who only seem to base reviews on the narrow capabilities of size/weight, continuous AF and a flip out screen. They'll go on about how many lenses there are, instead of how good the lens options are. Or they'll harp on about PDAF points without looking at the effect on IQ. Basically it's like selling a car on how fast it goes, when no one in the real world can drive it that way.
Usability, balance, handling and customisation which make a huge difference give way to pages of drivel about imperfect noise tests, which really make bugger all difference to shooting in the real world. Big cameras are bad without discussing how that might affect handling, cooling or the size of the IBIS unit.
Small with flippy screen and lots of video features, good. Everything else, bad. It's been the same forever. Even in magazines. They read from a spec sheet like that's all that matters.....
Manufacturers pander to these reviews, except on rare occasions like the S1/S1R which were the first new Panasonic cameras. Also they have the cameras for hours or days. Hardly time to really get a good idea of how a system is in the real world. It'll be interesting to see if Panasonic fall into the trap of trying to shrink all the new models and add a flip out screen.
Instead of trying to tell us how good DFD is, it would help Panasonic to go the other way. Start emphasising where they excel and looking at the areas where PDAF is either unnecessary or a hindrance.
