p.1 #1 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
This recent video posted by Tony Northrup sort of goes hand in hand with why various people feel the degree of 4K in the Canon EOS R was basically a nothing-burger blown out of proportion. Also, over 90% of photographers I know shoot virtually no video at all, just landscapes, portraits and weddings photos. But the need to use, manage and implement 4K from a Canon body is a tiny sliver.
Anyway, once again, it's evident the EOS R is worth it's price tag, and a good step forward on the path to whatever comes next. I still almost regret not buying a 2nd EOS R during December sales.
People with specialized niches definitely have other options.
p.1 #2 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
People were disappointed with the eos R not just because of video. For me personally, tried the R in December during a Canon event where they provided the R, all RF lenses bar the 70-200 and I honestly did not like it. Compared to my previous Canon DSLRs, the mode dial was gone, the back dial was gone and the joystick was gone. The remaining buttons felt like they were in the wrong place. I used to think that my sony R3 felt laggy compared to DSLR, well the R felt even more unresponsive. Couldn't really test the AF in that environment, felt okay. The lenses are spectacular of course.
I have recently got the M6 II and I am thoroughly enjoying it so far. It just felt better than the R, has both the back dial and mode dial and the AF track better than my A7R3 (when where is no faces involved). Honestly if Canon just took the M6 II sensor gave it a 1D body, battery & storage I would buy one immediately.
Ultimately I believe the R is a beta test for the new mirrorless market, given the recent improvements I am optimistic for the next R series camera.
p.1 #3 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
LS_Ren wrote:
People were ... SNIP.
This post is mainly about the 4K issue specifically being blown out of proportion. Otherwise, I found that the EOS R w/ RF and EF glass ran circles around 5D mk iv, etc.. in a nutshell. I think it boils down to each person. At first, some like youtuber Polin didn't like the lack of joystick. Month later, he did a 180 and praised the removal of the joystick. As for the touchbar, I find it a brilliant addition, because it can be turned off, or be enabled.
But as for 4K, it's a feature blown out of proportion these days. It has it's place, but not everywhere and in every model. The past few years, it seems like most cameras regardless of price point, get caught in a whirlwind of all the high end features and specs.
As for this thread and the link to Northrup, hoping to more emphasize 4K being put in its place, than simply the EOS R.
p.1 #4 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
I have an R, and I think you are right. I couldn't care less about video. If it had no video capabilities at all, It is likely that I'd still purchase it. My wife wouldn't be pleased, because she wants to shoot video occasionally, but I know she'll be happier and more effective shooting with her iPhone. I know this is only pertinent to me, but I am part of the target audience, since I did buy an R.
If you want me to pick the EOS R apart, well, coming from an original 5D, I don't have many complaints. I don't care about the joystick that much. I can live without it. I do think that the addition of the 5D's wheel would have been a great thing. C'est la vie.
p.1 #5 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
So suddenly the R shooting in a 1.7x zoom in 4K is a “non issue” because its 4K output is nearly indiscernible from its 1080? That’s an even WORSE mark against the R than just the egregious crop issue.
Does the R generate some of the best 1080 out there? Yes. That doesn’t excuse its awful 4K unless you’re just a huge fanboy I guess. Just because YOU might not need 4K doesn’t mean others don’t.
p.1 #6 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
I use the R for travel. Yes, that's mainly people and landscapes (and a wedding in the distance if it happens to be taking place near where I am). Does that mean that I need to forego 4K video, which I also may want to record of my kids goofing off, or whales breaching near my ship? Why does my RX100 have better video controls (and output) than my R, and why is that ok?
My biggest reason why I want 4K is the same as I want 50+ MP: Future proofing. 11MP was absurd when I visited Antarctica some 17 years back, but while the 1DS files may struggle they do look fine on a 4K 32" display. The same can't be said for the SD MiniDV video.
p.1 #10 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
What is slightly amusing about Tonys video is how bad the focus pulsing is - I found it super distracting, and personally I think he overuses shooting videos at f1.2. It wasnt a good advert for Canons dual pixel AF IMO.
p.1 #11 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
Timothy OConn wrote:
What is slightly amusing about Tonys video is how bad the focus pulsing is - I found it super distracting, and personally I think he overuses shooting videos at f1.2. It wasnt a good advert for Canons dual pixel AF IMO.
Even the YouTube comments which are usually T&C fans gushing, are full of people criticizing the terribly shallow DoF and constant focus hunting. The video production was just bad unfortunately. -
p.1 #12 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
Timothy OConn wrote:
What is slightly amusing about Tonys video is how bad the focus pulsing is - I found it super distracting, and personally I think he overuses shooting videos at f1.2. It wasnt a good advert for Canons dual pixel AF IMO.
The subject wearing a cap that casts a shadow on the face on an overcast day while moving back and forth at f/1.2 would strain any AF system.
Wide apertures in video don't look right unless they have minimal focus transitions and not much subject movement along the front to back axis.
p.1 #13 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
mdvaden wrote:
Yes .. step it up a notch and omit video entirely out of a photography camera.
I'd certainly enjoy one RF body that was dedicated to photos only. Then it could purify the design for photographers.
It would be a huge commercial flop if Canon left out video. If you don't use video features, they are easy to ignore. Although I mainly shoot stills, I do shoot video here and there and wouldn't buy a camera lacking such ability.
I suppose Canon could charge extra for a special FW that disables the video menu and limits the video stop/start button for LV only...
p.1 #14 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
The suggestion was in relation to advancement for photography alone, if such a body could be possible, not commercial success.
Many camera's advancements or reputations carry huge baggage of commentary and reviews about video, when more like 10% of users rely on the feature.Whether it's Nikon, Canon, Fuji or Sony, it seems like every body released gains a compost pile of comments about video recording, ports, bit rate, etc.. Whereas if comments were proportionate to the actual users and purchasers, video dialogue should probably be more like 10% of the commentary.
The subject wearing a cap that casts a shadow on the face on an overcast day while moving back and forth at f/1.2 would strain any AF system.
Wide apertures in video don't look right unless they have minimal focus transitions and not much subject movement along the front to back axis....Show more →
Maybe Northrup did that on purpose just to demo f/1.2 in less than ideal conditions.
What was odd ... I never even noticed much unusual until reading a couple comments under the video, then going back to review full screen.
Just watched the video again. The depth of field, with Tony moving back and forward, must be fluctuating between 1/10 inch to 1.5 inches, thereabout. Wouldn't be a surprise if he did it on purpose. His "arbitrarily change locations" denotes an intent for demonstrating the EOS R and RF lens in hazy outdoor conditions.
At 3:55 Tony makes a deliberate transition when he wants to point out a segment for aesthetics.
I'm guessing that many people watching his video, aren't really noticing how close he's taking his eyes to the edge of the frame. Assuming he's got the screen tilted forward to watch himself, likely he lifted his face that high to show tracking around more of the frame.
p.1 #15 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
I never shoot video on the R. I'm all about photography so the R works great for me and could care less about the video features. Even if it couldn't record video I be happy and still buy it. I buy cameras for photos and not video. The video is just a plus for me. I know many people enjoy both features or want the R to be a video camera. These cameras should be photo cameras first and video a second as a plus. In my opinion :-)
p.1 #16 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
You're giving Tony a strange amount of credit for what is just a poorly executed and shot video.
mdvaden wrote:
Just watched the video again. The depth of field, with Tony moving back and forward, must be fluctuating between 1/10 inch to 1.5 inches, thereabout. Wouldn't be a surprise if he did it on purpose. His "arbitrarily change locations" denotes an intent for demonstrating the EOS R and RF lens in hazy outdoor conditions.
At 3:55 Tony makes a deliberate transition when he wants to point out a segment for aesthetics.
I'm guessing that many people watching his video, aren't really noticing how close he's taking his eyes to the edge of the frame. Assuming he's got the screen tilted forward to watch himself, likely he lifted his face that high to show tracking around more of the frame....Show more →
p.1 #17 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
1080P is good enough for most mortals on a 65" screen - so from that perspective he is right. And certainly right when you consider his material - it will all be really stale in 2 years.
And for me personally, I don't shoot much video (mostly with Iphone) and if I do its more about the people (family) which does not require 4k or 8k.
But for landscape or timelaps - you need 4k for the reason you need 51 mpx (vs 22mpx 5DIII) because in 10 years you would still like to have it and you might be disappointed by the ability to play ( print) it large. 1080P is pretty good on a 65" 4k tv but its not as good as 4k on 4k.
p.1 #18 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
I don't shoot video much, either, but when I do it's mostly family and mostly in situations where iPhones (or my preferred cheaper Android phones) are poorly suited. I would think twice about buying a camera without video features, but if there was a price or performance impact, I might be tempted. That would maybe make me consider buying a second, cheaper, APS-C camera with photo and video capabilities to complement my FF body.
I also dont shoot in 4k since I don't have the storage to accommodate such files, nor do I even have a single 4k screen (tv, monitor, or phone) in my possession. But, future proofing is a valid concern. I wonder constantly whether I should be using 4k capabilities, and might start doing so at any point.
p.1 #19 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
amacal1 wrote:
I don't shoot video much, either, but when I do it's mostly family and mostly in situations where iPhones (or my preferred cheaper Android phones) are poorly suited. I would think twice about buying a camera without video features, but if there was a price or performance impact, I might be tempted. That would maybe make me consider buying a second, cheaper, APS-C camera with photo and video capabilities to complement my FF body.
I also dont shoot in 4k since I don't have the storage to accommodate such files, nor do I even have a single 4k screen (tv, monitor, or phone) in my possession. But, future proofing is a valid concern. I wonder constantly whether I should be using 4k capabilities, and might start doing so at any point. ...Show more →
Honestly phones are SO good for video now that if you're just wanting family memory type videos, your phone is more than sufficient. I shoot everything on my iphone in 4K60 just because i can.
p.1 #20 · Canon EOS R rises above the "4K nothing-burger" -- Northrup shares thoughts
RoamingScott wrote:
Honestly phones are SO good for video now that if you're just wanting family memory type videos, your phone is more than sufficient. I shoot everything on my iphone in 4K60 just because i can.
Agreed. Though, my phone is typically not anything near flagship status, so I'm not running with cutting edge. Even then, it still does a pretty great job on video.
There are times when a better system can have magical results. It's not worth investing in $1k of equipment for, but if you have such equipment then you can use it when the time comes. For example, 2 years ago we had a decent snowfall.
...in South Louisiana. Let's just say it doesn't happen often, and it's a pretty special event. It happened at night, and I quickly noticed my cell phone was not up to the task. So, I broke out the 6D with a 50mm f/1.4 and have beautiful video of my daughter catching snowflakes while illuminated by streetlights. The lighting, the bokeh, and the snowfall made for some gorgeous video that makes us smile whenever we watch it. It's a short video, and only a few minutes of it are really any good, but It's nothing short of magical for her to watch, as silly as it sounds.
Edit: The reason the video is short and the reason only a couple of minutes are worth watching is because I was focusing the prime manually, nearly wide open. I can only imagine what that video would be like with fantastic video AF and even moreso with AF + 4k.
