p.1 #1 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
Hello all.
I am looking to go to a fixed lens camera soon. My current kit is A7II, canon 50mm, 35mm, 19mm.
I use the 35mm ~ 90% of the time, 50mm ~9% and 19~1%. I have enjoyed the A7II very much but its time to try a fixed lens for a while (something I've wanted to try for a couple years now but never got the nerve to do).
I've been interested in the RX1/R since it came out but couldn't justify the price, figured the ergonomics wouldn't suit me (avoided A7i for this very reason), didn't like the lack of EVF and read that it had a few annoying quirks, but it has that amazing lens/ sensor combo that keeps me interested. After having my A7II and canon 35mm F2 LTM combo I thought I might try to overlook all the annoyances of the RX1 (keep in mind my annoyance is based off spec sheet and reviews, I've never used one) and give it a shot (RX1RII looks about perfect but thats not happening till prices come down to reasonable). I have been very happy with the full frame sony sensors dynamic range and overall image quality (not that I was unhappy with my XT1 setup before just wanted to try something different after my wife passed away and A7 line had finally got IBIS and shutter button relocation).
So I've put my A7II up for sale and committed to going fixed lens camera. I thought I had it pretty much nailed to the RX1/R since the Fuji X100 just didn't quite cut it from what I have read and seen of it, then I ran across news of the latest X100F. I like the specs, the Fuji controls have always been the best of any camera I've used and that new shutter/ISO switch looks perfect for me. I know they're pre production reviews but rom what I can see of JPEGS it looks to produce fine images with better resolution and finer detail not to mention all the reviewers say the AF is finally where it should have been all along. The optical view finder is not a selling point for me but it can also be used as an EVF which satisfies my love for viewfinders (can't seem to get used to holding a camera like my phone).
So I'm having trouble deciding between the two cameras. I know the X100F won't be out for a few days so its impossible for people to give experienced opinions but it should be similar output to the Pro 2 and XT2 at least JPEGS. By the way I do plan to try JPEGs a lot with whichever fixed lens camera I get because both RX1 and X100 series seem to be known to produce excellent JPEGs so that is a fine reference point for me for now.
Any opinions which way I should go? I'm not looking for the typical technical talk we photogs tend to get into or the fact that the X100F isn't even released yet so no-one can give me a knowledgable answer but surely some here have used the XPRO2, XT2 (same sensors as X100F) and the RX1 series and can give some advice.
I'm actually leaning toward the Fuji at the moment due to the (in my opinion) much better body controls (exterior knobs, love'em), faster more reliable autofocus (based off reviews saying it blows the X100T out of the water), improved sensor resolution, EVF, WiFi (yes I like transferring images directly to my phone when out shooting).
I have to wonder if the X100F is close enough in image quality to the RX1 to win the vote. If the images are close (again using pro 2 and xt2 for samples since its same sensor as well as x100f pre release photos as reference) surely the x100f beats the rx1 for overall user experience with af speed, body controls, etc.
Any opinions would be very welcome, sorry for the long rambling post.
p.1 #2 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
I am in the same boots.
I am looking forward to part with my RX1, but there is no easy way.
While the X100T and the X-T2 are great cameras, but they're simply different. If we go Fuji route, we will sacrifice the IQ quality, but will gain other benefits. At the current price point of the RX1, its really tough to beat.
p.1 #3 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
Ive had both... Actually both in a couple of different guises. The RX1 beats the Fuji hands down. Isnt the actual image quality the reason you get a better camera? You get used to usability but you can never get better image quality out of an average sensor. No brainer for me....
p.1 #4 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
I've owned the X100S, RX1R and my current camera is the RX1Rm2. The Mark 2 is by far the best camera I've used for my purposes. The RX1R was such an inconsistent camera for me because the sensor and lens were amazing, easily better than the X100S but the autofocus and general ergonomics were behind the Fuji. If you can put up with the quirks like dodgy AF and the Sony menu/ergonomics, the RX1will reward you with amazing images with a quality that the Fuji cant touch IMO.
To sum up, I think it will come down to what's important to you. If you want maximum image quality, go Sony but be prepared to put up with frustrating AF (and get the hot shoe view finder). If you want better AF and ergonomics as well as to save some money, go Fuji. And as we all know, at the end of the day, if you know where to find good light and composition, either camera will deliver the goods.
One last thing, if you end up going RX1R and it gets under your skin, you're very likely going to end up getting the Mark 2 (we all do eventually) so just a warning
p.1 #5 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
Before selling your current kit and leaping into the unknown, why not rent for a week or so? Sony now and the Fuji when it comes out (most rental places get new models fairly quickly after release).
p.1 #6 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
I have owned the x100, x100s, x100t, and now the RX1. The RX1 with the view finders kills the x100 series. AF is much better on the X100T and will be even better on the X100F but I'm not sure a fixed 35mm camera needs blazing AF. Also the controls on the RX1 are pretty comparable to the x100 series. It has an exposure comp dial, aperture control on the lens, and a wheel on the back for shutter speed. The Zeiss lens is miles ahead of the Fuji IMHO. The bokeh and sharpness at f2 are really astounding. Plus you can grab one in like new condition for around $1000. If you don't like it then sell it on the forums and you will recoup most of that.
The RX1 af isn't that bad btw. It's definitely usable and in good light works pretty good. I have noticed that sometimes my af won't lock if in a semi dark situation.
p.1 #7 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
I can't go that way. I have a tricked out Fuji X100s. I "wanted" a RX1 r badly. Instead, I vowed to wear the Fuji first to see how I dealt with the 35mm (FF equivalent) fixed lens. It didn't work for me. I would rather have the Sony RX100, its tiny sensor and a zoom lens.
So, before you spend something like $4000 for the RX10 MKII, do some research. Rent or buy a X100s (really little difference compared to the F) and see how you like it. If you can cope with the 35mm FL-only then move up to the newer cameras.
p.1 #8 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
Ive had the x100s and the RX1r II and just pre-ordered the X100f.
In terms of image quality, the RX1r II is another class, but like some, I could just not get over the handling of the camera.
I picked up the Xpro2 with the 35f2 prime, and honestly, its the best handling camera Ive ever had. I love the rangefinder style and the AF joystick makes a huge difference. I eventually sold the Xpro2 however as it was still too big for my liking.
With the X100f, if you are ok sacrificing some IQ for what I would presume a better handling and a more enjoyable camera to use. Its also my vacation camera, meaning I would shoot jpegs 90% of the time. As much as I love the Rx1r II, Sony's jpegs are just not very good, especially for people's skin tone. I did not like the fact that I would have to edit the RAW files from the Sony all the time.
If you are all about absolutely having the best IQ, I dont think it can get any better than the RX1r! It is such a small package too!
Whichever camera you pick, I dont think you can go wrong. Just ask yourself what is more important.
p.1 #9 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
Well it isn't exactly what you're looking for since it isn't fixed lens, but I'd recommend considering the Canon M line with the EF-M 22mm. The M3/M5/M6/M10 should offer what you want somewhere in there. The 22 is very excellent. On the M2 the combo is a good bit smaller than the RX1 which I compared side by side, and I believe the X100 series, but it's been since I've handled one of them. Since you're not stuck on FF, it'd be worth a look since its great IQ and smaller or similar to fixed lens cameras.
p.1 #10 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
I am in the same boat as the OP (though RAW only). My concern with the RX1 is buying even a "like new" could be one that is was purchased in 2013 and has hundreds of thousands of shutters, but just taken very good care of otherwise. With used, you just never really know. If it was just a lens, used is no big deal, but when it has all of the electronic functions and physical functions of a whole camera, then that's my hold up.
Every time I start thinking the X100T (or now the F) looks like it would be fun, I end up back to wanting higher quality I'd get with the full frame Sonys. Maybe it's time to save for the RX1RII (still made Sony bumped the price considerably in the past year). If a III emerges this year, then the II might come down in price enough to justify, for me.
p.1 #11 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
seanj wrote:
I am in the same boat as the OP (though RAW only). My concern with the RX1 is buying even a "like new" could be one that is was purchased in 2013 and has hundreds of thousands of shutters, but just taken very good care of otherwise. With used, you just never really know. If it was just a lens, used is no big deal, but when it has all of the electronic functions and physical functions of a whole camera, then that's my hold up.
Every time I start thinking the X100T (or now the F) looks like it would be fun, I end up back to wanting higher quality I'd get with the full frame Sonys. Maybe it's time to save for the RX1RII (still made Sony bumped the price considerably in the past year). If a III emerges this year, then the II might come down in price enough to justify, for me. ...Show more →
I've gone the used route for much of my gear and saved at least 40% off new. No issues with used cameras. Buy from good standing members and you can save a bunch.
p.1 #12 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
Yeah, I am sure there are trustworthy people.
I just did a quick size comparison and was surprised to see the RX1R smaller than the X100F from top to bottom and side to side (not front to back): http://camerasize.com/compare/#705,468
The X100F looks way bigger than it needs to be, I think.
p.1 #13 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
That's true but the RX is quite a bit heavier.
seanj wrote:
Yeah, I am sure there are trustworthy people.
I just did a quick size comparison and was surprised to see the RX1R smaller than the X100F from top to bottom and side to side (not front to back): http://camerasize.com/compare/#705,468
The X100F looks way bigger than it needs to be, I think.
p.1 #15 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
Not the X100F, but I felt the same when I handled an S. I didn't understand why it was so big when the lens was so compact.
seanj wrote:
Yeah, I am sure there are trustworthy people.
I just did a quick size comparison and was surprised to see the RX1R smaller than the X100F from top to bottom and side to side (not front to back): http://camerasize.com/compare/#705,468
The X100F looks way bigger than it needs to be, I think.
p.1 #16 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
You guys are making the same arguments I have been making. I've pretty much decided the rx1/r is out due to many reasons, fixed lcd, no evf (I refuse to run the external evf that just isn't gonna happen for me), handling and other issues. After all the reading I've done on the version 1 cameras it seems the only real positive is the image quality when you get the lighting right and the lens is amazing.
The rx1 is nothing magic it just has a really good sensor and an amazing lens but it still takes effort to make a good image. Over the years I've come to realize I need a nice functioning camera along with excellent image quality, after all we spend a lot of money on these things they should be a pleasure to use.
After coming to the previous conclusion that left me to the RX1RII or the fuji X100F (now that it is finally responsive, fast AF and 24mp which is a good fit for me). So I looked at all the specs and of course the rx1rii beats the fuji in my opinion it appears to have good AF now, flip screen, EVF, that awesome lens, wonderful sensor (42mp so I can crop to my hearts content). The only problem with the rx1rii is the price. Can I afford $2500- $2700 for a nice used unit, sure, do I want to spend that much for a fixed lens camera... not without a ton of consideration. Also I'm not opposed to purchasing used (cars, electronics, etc) if I buy from a respected seller I should be ok but if I'm being honest it irks me a bit to spend almost $3K on a used fixed lens camera (yet it doesn't bother me a bit to drop $6k on a new canon 1D series body, figure that one out, lol).
That brings me to the Fuji X100F. According to all the reviews I can find most all the reviewers (sponsored by Fuji apparently so take that for what its worth) claim this is the biggest upgrade to the X100 series ever and from the specs I have to believe that. The X100 series has always been an interesting camera to me but I've never come close to buying it for all its limitations. With the F model I want to give it a shot now that its finally responsive in all tasks, fast AF, heck I even like that the pain has apparently changed and the new ISO dial that most seem to dislike. I feel like I can purchase the F online for $1300 and give it a shot, if I don't like it oh well no big loss, after all its the hot ticket right now in Fuji land. I'm sure I could resell the F pretty quick and recoup the majority of my cash and move on to a nice used RX1RII.
What I'm saying is at this point I'm willing to sacrifice a bit of image quality (your know that X100f puts out pretty good images even if they aren't RX1 series quality) for the overall fun experience and of course the huge price difference. Plus lets keep in mind for my needs this is an experiment. I've always owned an ILC, I've only decided to try a fixed camera because I do use 35mm primes most of the time anyway so why drop big money on something that I may truly dislike.
p.1 #17 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
Good luck, hope it's everything you're looking for! I'm an A7 user who recently got a used X100S - I've really missed having a smaller camera that I can fit in a pocket if needed.
I've never used or even handled an RX1, but the X100S has me considering trying it.
I was expecting the X100S to be a fun camera to use, but ergonomically I'm finding it less fun to use, more in my way than the A7. This was a surprise.
The EVF is disappointing. Way behind my A7 or even my NEX's accessory EVF despite using the same 2.36 Mdot Epson part (IIRC). Between the quality of the EVF and the manual focus ring, the MF experience is pretty disappointing.
One issue you won't have to deal with is the shutter speed limitations - the T and F have electronic shutter. The ND filter makes the veiling flare even worse and visibly reduces contrast.
p.1 #18 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
Thats a shame but no different that what I've heard about the x100s it's good info, thanks. Comments like yours arduluth are why I never could take a chance on the previous x100 models they just seem to have so much potential with a lackluster overall experience.
I have to confess I really enjoyed my A7II and canon 35mm f2 LTM, by far the best mirrorless/manual lens setup I ever had. The x100f has some tall shoes to fill, luckily B&H has a good return policy if it doesnt measure up.
p.1 #19 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
Totally, not trying to rain on your parade! I'm undecided at this point. It's growing on me, if only because I can fit it in my back pocket. It's a nice size, especially with the lens being so small. I've been using it extensively since getting it, leaving the A7 at home when previously I would have brought it. I'll give it another few weeks and decide if I want to try the RX1/R.
The OVF is gorgeous, though it's usefulness is somewhat limited by the spotty AF. So much bigger, brighter, and better than my Contax G1. With the improved AF of the T and F it could be pretty nice.
p.1 #20 · Need help choosing used RX1/R or Fuji X100F
arduluth wrote:
Totally, not trying to rain on your parade! I'm undecided at this point. It's growing on me, if only because I can fit it in my back pocket. It's a nice size, especially with the lens being so small. I've been using it extensively since getting it, leaving the A7 at home when previously I would have brought it. I'll give it another few weeks and decide if I want to try the RX1/R.
The OVF is gorgeous, though it's usefulness is somewhat limited by the spotty AF. So much bigger, brighter, and better than my Contax G1. With the improved AF of the T and F it could be pretty nice.
Yes, if you want something that is pocket-able, the X100 line is not unless you have a big jacket pocket. I have the original X100 and I use it for biking and x-country skiing...but it definitely is not pocket-able. And as far as it being a joy to shoot...it's not.
With the improved AF of the T and F it could be pretty nice.