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Archive 2016 · Alien Road

  
 
Mark Metternich
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Alien Road


After 4 - 1/2 straight months in the SW and 10 Workshops, I am finally home in the Pacific Northwest and appreciating domesticity more than ever before in my life! 2017 will see me on the road less, not more. With a shift a little more toward the ongoing educational services. For the first time in 14 years since I got serious about Landscape photography as a career, I am not interested in everlasting wanderlust. Yes, adventures will continue as long as I am able (I'm leading a small group to Uganda, Africa in 2017 among many other things) but with much more balance and appreciation for the small things in life! I have learned that those who often tell me "you are really living the life man!" are actually often the ones who are really living the life! Sometimes simply not appreciating what they have as much as they should. As I have put in 200-300 days on the road for some years now, I have learned that friends, family, loved ones, people, community and service to others is really living "the life."

This image is from the road out to Alstrom Point (AZ). I was heading back as a mega thunderstorm was heading in and I did not want to get stuck. But I had to stop for this light.









Nov 26, 2016 at 11:56 PM
jord217
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Alien Road


I like the bottom half of the photo. In my opinion, the top half looks like you pulled the luminance back too far on some of the sliders. The butte looks a little cut out and the saturation is pushed a little too far. Also, I think the brightness on the hillside is a touch too high which makes it look a bit flat. I like the composition a lot though. Great lead in with the road there. I think you just need to rework the top portion. My 2 cents


Nov 27, 2016 at 12:30 AM
Mark Metternich
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Alien Road


jord217 wrote:
I like the bottom half of the photo. In my opinion, the top half looks like you pulled the luminance back too far on some of the sliders. The butte looks a little cut out and the saturation is pushed a little too far. Also, I think the brightness on the hillside is a touch too high which makes it look a bit flat. I like the composition a lot though. Great lead in with the road there. I think you just need to rework the top portion. My 2 cents



Although on my 27 inch Mac Thunderbolt (calibrated to 2.2 Gamma, 6500 white Point and 130CD - Luminance) the saturation looks close to how it looked to me, here is a version some may prefer (Saturation 12 pts down in PS Color Mode). I believe this to be a pretty authentic rendition. I do see and appreciate your points though. Thank you very much for feeling free to give me critical feedback.









Nov 27, 2016 at 12:43 AM
jforkner
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Alien Road


Sorry, not workin' for me. Overall too dark.

Jack



Nov 27, 2016 at 09:45 AM
Monika C
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Alien Road


The 2nd is too dark for me, too. When the clouds are like what you have, the grasses, etc often get luminous, which I think you have in the 1st image. somehow, I think that the sky in the 2nd would make you think you barely caught the light as it disappeared whereas the 1st is what made you stop & get out to shoot.


Nov 27, 2016 at 10:59 AM
Mark Metternich
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Alien Road


jforkner wrote:
Sorry, not workin' for me. Overall too dark.

Jack


Thank you Jack for your feedback. It does make me wonder, how bright or dark your monitor is though?



Nov 27, 2016 at 01:16 PM
gstrong
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Alien Road


Looks pretty good to me - wish I was there - I'm ok with either one


Nov 27, 2016 at 11:50 PM
gstrong
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Alien Road


Looks pretty good to me - wish I was there - I'm ok with either one


Nov 27, 2016 at 11:50 PM
savingspaces
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Alien Road


You are probably my favorite landscape photographer. Unfortunately, at least for me, it doesn't have your signature look and subject/composition. But hey, even Ansel was happy if he produced 12 good shots a year. You are way beyond that.


Nov 28, 2016 at 05:14 AM
psharvic
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Alien Road


I like it Mark. Definitely a sense of menace. I wouldn't want to me mired there.


Nov 28, 2016 at 08:21 AM
jforkner
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Alien Road


Mark Metternich wrote:
Thank you Jack for your feedback. It does make me wonder, how bright or dark your monitor is though?


Can't give you a number, but it's a calibrated 5K iMac.

Jack




Nov 28, 2016 at 09:39 AM
chez
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Alien Road


jforkner wrote:
Can't give you a number, but it's a calibrated 5K iMac.

Jack



I have the same experience on my calibrated monitor. Too dim with muted colours. Original sky was over cooked...2nd attempt better, but overall dark and muted.



Nov 28, 2016 at 10:25 AM
Mark Metternich
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Alien Road


jforkner wrote:
Can't give you a number, but it's a calibrated 5K iMac.

Jack



If it is helpful, for a somewhat softly diffused room (not really bright and not really dark) 130CD (Candelas or some software will call it Luminance or Brightness) is sort of an industry standard (for web - NOT print) today. I'd be curious to know what yours is at. To me one of the hardest things about these fine critique forums like FM is that more often than not we are not on the same page as to what we are even looking at. Of course the 130 target is quite dependant on room brightness.

Thank you (and everyone else) for the feedback. I take it all in and learn from it.


chez wrote:
Original sky was over cooked...2nd attempt better, but overall dark and muted.


So Chez... can I safely assume you are meaning that the first sky is oversaturated to your taste? I have never really resonated with that word "over cooked" which, to me, seems a sort of ambiguous, negative word implying over (or way over) done in various ways. Because I authentically and sincerely love to learn and grow from carefully given feedback here on FM, I just want to clarify. But taking that assumption into consideration (with the other constructive feedback above) below is a new version. Thank you.


Here is a new version I am pretty happy with. After very carefully considering everyone's feedback so far (thank you! ) on my 27 inch Thunderbolt (calibrated to the aforementioned specs) I still like the first version the best and feel that on my system it is pretty darn authentic. But having said that, I did feel that the plum color in it was a little strong there and was bugging me a little. So the plum saturation came down a bit and also the overall sky saturation came down an additional 3 pts, putting it here. The pinkish orange on the horizon was SW nuclear BTW.

Again, thanks to everyone for the constructive fine tuning feedback.







Nov 28, 2016 at 02:51 PM
jforkner
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Alien Road


Mark Metternich wrote:
If it is helpful, for a somewhat softly diffused room (not really bright and not really dark) 130CD (Candelas or some software will call it Luminance or Brightness) is sort of an industry standard (for web - NOT print) today. I'd be curious to know what yours is at. To me one of the hardest things about these fine critique forums like FM is that more often than not we are not on the same page as to what we are even looking at. Of course the 130 target is quite dependant on room brightness.

Thank you (and everyone
...Show more

Well, Mark, I’m embarrassed to say my monitor brightness was down to 17cd/m². I’d set it that low in order to match my printer’s output. I recalibrated to 100 (which is too high for my printer—Canon PIXMA Pro-100) and your image looked fine.

FWIW, your third version looks best to me now, and NOT TOO DARK. My apologies for creating a problem.

Jack






Nov 28, 2016 at 06:33 PM
Mark Metternich
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Alien Road


jforkner wrote:
Well, Mark, I’m embarrassed to say my monitor brightness was down to 17cd/m². I’d set it that low in order to match my printer’s output. I recalibrated to 100 (which is too high for my printer—Canon PIXMA Pro-100) and your image looked fine.

FWIW, your third version looks best to me now, and NOT TOO DARK. My apologies for creating a problem.

Jack




It is certainly no problem whatsoever Jack! Thank you.

This has always made laugh a bit on this particular forum. We seem to enjoy giving very careful, even critical feedback on images often with no real standards to ensure we are looking at the same thing. One person may say too dark, the other too bright, the other too saturated, the other too mute... Even arguments erupt over this stuff sometimes. But the real question for me has always been, how many of us are carefully calibrating to common industry standards that help us to be as close as possible to being on the same page?

Then a few years ago I experimented with posting a disclaimer that said to the effect:

"Best viewed, or most accurately viewed on a calibrated monitor to 2.2 Gamma, 6500 White Point and 130CD (luminance or candelas)."

Then when I did that, a couple people jumped on me saying I only said that so that people could not critique my images! Seriously...

So, in my minds eye (and I have been a full time teacher of color management for over 10 years) if we are really going to nitpick people's images, we better be on the same page or as close to the same page as possible! Or all that hair splitting can be meaningless and quite untrustworthy.

BTW 100CD is low unless you work in, or nearly in the dark. Industry standard for a softly diffused room is 120-130CD. I choose the higher end (130CD) due to monitors constantly getting brighter.




Nov 28, 2016 at 07:49 PM
Ben Horne
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Alien Road


I really like the composition, but the foreground and background seem disjointed. The lighting of the foreground looks more like what i would expect from a moon-lit night, versus the background that has wonderful dramatic sunset light. It is where the two meet that it feels a bit awkward, the mountain. I would expect that mountain to be almost silhouetted against the sky, but it looks like there is a big neutral colored light source from behind your position or even high in the sky.


Nov 28, 2016 at 10:07 PM
Tim_Raschko
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Alien Road


The photograph aside, I wish you well in the re-ordering of your priorities. "Friends, family, loved ones, people, community and service to others" are indeed important aspects of life that will always exceed the value of "the shot". Good luck.

Tim



Nov 28, 2016 at 10:13 PM
dbehrens
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Alien Road


Mark,

I'll give you my best shot at being critical, working my way from background to foreground. (I'm not viewing this at your recommended 2.2/6500K/120CD as I'm currently working on a POD project that's notorious for delivering dark prints - so my office is currently in low indirect light and I'm working on a Apple Cinema LED monitor with a Spyder 5 recommended calibration of G 2.2, WP 5800K and 120 brightness.)

The pic does not look too dark to me. It looks like one of those evenings when the sun finally goes below the horizon, its getting dark and you have already started to pack up, then all of the sudden there is a post sunset orange glow. I witnessed some amazing sky colors in that brief moment.

If that's the case (post sunset glow) then I would expect the muted colors I see, especially on the dark side of the mountain and the gulley that's below the horizon and shadowed from any orange glow light. I would expect to see this even more muted because of the dark clouds overhead. All that to say this looks natural to my eye. The only thing that does not look completely natural is that the dark cloud on very top edge seems void of any color - like a B/W. For some reason that small cloud band keeps drawing my attention. Anyway that's my 2 cents worth. BTW I like #3 best!

On a more personal note - I had over 20 years of 120-220 days each year of international travel. So I fully understand that your wanderlust itch has been fully scratched and it's time to reevaluate your priorities in life. I hope you find the balance you are seeking and still be that professional landscape photographer that we all enjoy!

Dave



Nov 29, 2016 at 12:10 AM
jforkner
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Alien Road


Mark Metternich wrote:
This has always made laugh a bit on this particular forum. We seem to enjoy giving very careful, even critical feedback on images often with no real standards to ensure we are looking at the same thing. One person may say too dark, the other too bright, the other too saturated, the other too mute... Even arguments erupt over this stuff sometimes. But the real question for me has always been, how many of us are carefully calibrating to common industry standards that help us to be as close as possible to being on the same page?

Then a
...Show more

Mark,

Seems to me that suggesting that an image is “best viewed” under certain conditions is a bit naive & arrogant.

First…when one puts anything on the Internet, control of that item is pretty-much lost. There is no way to ensure or control how that thing is viewed and/or used. To assume there’s some standard that all viewers will adhere-to seems naive to me.

Second…posting an image on the Internet & suggesting how I should view it for my best experience seems somewhat arrogant to me—as though I don’t know how to view an image unless you tell me. While stating the conditions under which you produced the image may lend some awareness as to why it looks as it does; telling me how to view it is too much, IMO.

Finally…I believe the primary reason people post their images on forums like this is to either solicit criticism or state, “Look what I’ve done.” Regardless of the reason, when you do post an image, you are inviting comment. To want or assume that all who view the image will do so under the exact same conditions as you created it seems highly unlikely to me.

BTW, would you please point me to the accepted industry standard for room lighting—I do work in a fairly dark room & the sites I visited for calibration tutorials suggested starting out at 100 cd/m². And as I stated previously, my settings are intended to ensure my printed output matches what I see on the screen.

Jack



Edited on Nov 29, 2016 at 06:55 PM · View previous versions



Nov 29, 2016 at 09:12 AM
Gary Clennan
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Alien Road


Good grief.


Nov 29, 2016 at 05:34 PM
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