Archive 2015 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with de...
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p.3 #1 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
SteveDK wrote:
1:1 Detail, upper left corner, F/8. This sort of effect is also prominent in my 28mm/1.8g AFS Nikkor, probably a bit worse. From what I've read and seen on diglloyd.com lot of fast lenses that are not Apochromatic (by Zeiss' stringent definition) show this color bokeh effect due to SLOCA, even some Leica Apo ASPH designated f/2 lenses like the 75mm/2 Apo Summicron ASPH. Slower f/2.8 lenses have less of this aberration to begin with, and it virtually disappears when well stopped down with those lenses.
What I see there is a very small amount of lateral CA in the corners, which is unaffected as you stop down. To me it would be a totally non-issue, but YMMV. Many even excellent lenses have a small amount of lateral CA in the corners even stopped down. It is true for this lens as well. I doubt the 35 f/2.8 C-Biogon would have less, but it might. A side by side comparison would be needed to know for sure, however.
p.3 #2 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
But I do print large, and I am very finicky about color, so for me color fringing can be an issue, sometimes. It's still a very, very fine lens, the 35mm/1.4 Distagon ZM. I do love it, but it's just not always the best 35mm for Leica cameras, in my experience. It is the best fast one I have used though. I have come to consider it my low light and shallow depth of field 35mm lens, and my 35mm/2.8 C-Biogon is my general purpose/landscape 35mm lens. Both have their strengths and compromises. If I could only have one, I'd pick the Distagon, because it is better overall.
p.3 #3 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
Steve Spencer wrote:
Rich,
Have you considered a Leica M 35 Summarit? It would be small and light and you it should produce colours very similar to your other Leica lenses. It also has an MTF very much like your Leica R 28 f/2.8 v. II, so very good performance stopped down to f/5.6 or narrower. It should be a very good option on a modified camera.
have you seen the summarit's performance on a modded a7? I know it's quite bad on a stock one, but haven't seen any samples on a modded camera.
p.3 #4 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
I hope to go shooting on Friday, and maybe I can do a test of the two Zeiss 35mm's for color fringing in the OOF areas. The C-Biogon is so tiny as an extra lens, it wouldn't be a pain to carry on my hike on Cape Ann.
p.3 #5 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
TY so much Steve
JaKo wrote:
You’re also incorrect about the center focusing point. See, by now each of my M-mount lenses is using its own, dedicated, high quality M-->E adapter that was adjusted/shimmed for hard stop at infinity (WO adjustment for the best across the frame compromise, based on field curvature)
You might want to check that one. Center is way sharper than outer zones, no?
I just assumed this must be because of the focal point, if not the ZM 35/1.4 landscape situation on the stock Sonys is worse than I thought.
I did not critique your frame, which is OK to get an idea of performance, and why else would you post it here? Those remarks, if you read my post carefully were not directed at you. I plead guilty on the focus issue though
Always enjoy your photography.
Gary Clennan wrote:
Charlie - if you really want to see the ZM35/1.4 shine you need to try it out on an M digital body. It is simply amazing...
That's been my impression from the introduction and I've seen many great examples. But SteveDK's take I find very interesting, and I want to get a grip on that issue.
p.3 #7 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
naturephoto1 wrote:
I wish someone had one of the Leica M 35mm Summarit lenses to check on a Kolari Vision modified sensor A7r and also on a stock A7rII.
Rich
I was actually considering the Summarit 35 earlier, which is what led me to the thread I linked to a few pages back. The impression overall from that thread seemed to be that maybe the C-Biogon was better than then Summarit (in the corners and with regard to distortion). I would love to hear more opinions about that lens though. The MTF from it does seem to have a bit of classic Leica mid frame dip which would sort of lead me to suspect really nice rendering but not technically as good as the Zeiss (but then as Steve Spencer pointed out earlier, the Elmarit 28 R you own does show a similar looking MTF).
p.3 #8 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
SteveDK wrote:
But I do print large, and I am very finicky about color, so for me color fringing can be an issue, sometimes. It's still a very, very fine lens, the 35mm/1.4 Distagon ZM. I do love it, but it's just not always the best 35mm for Leica cameras, in my experience. It is the best fast one I have used though. I have come to consider it my low light and shallow depth of field 35mm lens, and my 35mm/2.8 C-Biogon is my general purpose/landscape 35mm lens. Both have their strengths and compromises. If I could only have one, I'd pick the Distagon, because it is better overall....Show more →
My understanding at least with M mount on M9/M240 the ZM 35/2.8 C-Biogon was a great choice for landscapes. It edged out the ZM 35/2, no slouch. The ZM 35/2.8 is very small and there have been many discussions that Zeiss should have kept the design as the ZM 35/2.8 C-Biogon, rather than opting for ZM 35/2.
In truth how does it compare on the A7x modded, and is the FE 35/2.8 better choice on the A7x?
p.3 #9 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
charles.K wrote:
My understanding at least with M mount on M9/M240 the ZM 35/2.8 C-Biogon was a great choice for landscapes. It edged out the ZM 35/2, no slouch.
I started from the other direction, inclining to the Biogon-C, but came away with the impression it was a fantastic street lens but the 35/2 was superior for landscape and also exceptional stopped down, i.e. F/11.
But it would not be the first time I acted upon a mistaken impression
If anyone has cause to feel the Biogon C is the better lens for landscape, I would love to hear and see the reason.
p.3 #11 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
The king of stopped down sharpness remain the 35/2 biogon in my opinion. Even better than the 35/1.4 distagon. The c biogon is excellent, same level of sharpness as the distagon, minus the sparkle, but the biogon is incredible.
p.3 #12 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
edwardkaraa wrote:
The king of stopped down sharpness remain the 35/2 biogon in my opinion. Even better than the 35/1.4 distagon. The c biogon is excellent, same level of sharpness as the distagon, minus the sparkle, but the biogon is incredible.
That's interesting. The tests I have seen show the C Biogon better than the F2 Biogon into the corners on Leica M (reflective of the MTF's) but perhaps that advantage is before F11 at each lenses peak sharpness. As I recall, Sean Reid's tests show this to be the case, with the C Biogon really exceptional. From this I would have thought the C Biogon to be the one to go for unless you just need F2.
p.3 #13 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
Tariq Gibran wrote:
That's interesting. The tests I have seen show the C Biogon better than the F2 Biogon into the corners on Leica M (reflective of the MTF's) but perhaps that advantage is before F11 at each lenses peak sharpness. As I recall, Sean Reid's tests show this to be the case, with the C Biogon really exceptional. From this I would have thought the C Biogon to be the one to go for unless you just need F2.
Hi Tariq,
I wonder if some of the differences being suggested may be due to sample variation. But, I have no idea.
p.3 #15 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
Tariq Gibran wrote:
More and more, I tend to believe this is what really matters the most between lenses with the performance of any of the ones being considered.
I did have the ZM 35/2 and it was a very good lens with the M9. I know Martin ( Makten on FM), had both lenses and he much preferred the ZM 35/2.8 for landscapes.
p.3 #16 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
I've owned all three ZM 35s and ended up with the distagon. If one considers only the corner performance, then the distagon comes easily first, the biogon and c biogon being quite similar (maybe is the c biogon is a tad better, I'm not sure). Stopped down to f/8, the biogon wins easily, even though the other two are excellent as well, but the biogon is just that good, and the reason I think is its strength in zone B. The c biogon really shines at wider apertures though, especially until f/4. The biogon is weak at f/2 due to spherical aberrations. None of them has the sparkle of the distagon. All things considered it is the best overall performer.
p.3 #17 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
charles.K wrote:
I did have the ZM 35/2 and it was a very good lens with the M9. I know Martin ( Makten on FM), had both lenses and he much preferred the ZM 35/2.8 for landscapes.
Thanks for that data point Charles. I know in the other thread I linked on the first page, Maketn also liked the Summarit 35 a lot (saying it was similar to the C Biogon but with unique color rendering). It's easy to see how there is not a clear choice given all the great options.
p.3 #20 · Zeiss 35mm f1.4 ZM or Voigtlander 35mm f1.7 Ultron for Landscape with deep DOF for A7rM and A7rII
Hahaha, I don't know about Zeissness, but it is definitely the most "perfect" one. I used to love the C/Y and part of its charm was its aberrations and field curvature that produced unbelievable 3D effects. In this respect, I would say the C/Y wins the Zeissness contest
PS: To continue with the ZM distagon, I think the wide aperture performance is phenomenal. Nothing I have ever used comes close. At f/2.8 it is better than most lenses at f/8. The level of corrections gives it an unmistakable modern sparkly look. I just find the biogon to have a very tiny advantage at f/8 in zone B, focused at infinity. The difference is only noticeable with pixel peeping and direct comparisons. On the other hand, the corners are clearly sharper with the distagon, even at normal magnifications.
