Beni wrote:
Bit worried about the difference in thickness.
I can't be 100% sure about the actual thickness difference (the differences I observed with my crude methodology were in micrometers) and I suspect how much torque is used to screw the mounts down might also account for the difference once installed. It's very likely (I would think) Sony has a tiny amount of range in their tolerance specification to begin with. For the native AF lenses, the amounts in question would not matter.
Got mine installed today. There is a huge improvement in rigidity, and a noticeable improvement in rotational play. What I thought was flex in the camera lens mount + adapters ( I use a Canon adapter with manual focus lenses, with Canon adapters on the lenses) now proves to have been almost entirely from the camera lens mount. Lens rotation was never really an issue (it was about the same on any other camera I've had), but has improved a little as well. Probably just due to the lens contact points being more rigid.
I tried the plastic wrap and lens cap approaches, but finally just wore latex gloves. I kept the camera vertical so if a screw fell it wouldn't fall into the camera. I also kept a finger wrapped around the inside of the screwdriver so if it slipped off, the screwdriver head would not end up on top of the sensor. My screws had red loctite on them and required a good amount of force to get them loose. I had to push hard with both hands to keep the screwdriver in the slots while turning. The thin metal spring clip ring came out with the plastic ring. The video was helpful in verifying the correct position for re-install.
A quick test with a couple wide angles doesn't show any issue with flatness or infinity focus. All corners are sharp (or maybe equally unsharp on the A7r!) and infinity seems to be right where it was before. Count me as a fan of the new Tough E Mount as it improves my user experience and will surely improve my results with certain lenses and in some shooting situations.
One question I still have is how much one should tighten the mount screws. I got mine all tight, used a few lenses, then re-tightened. If anything I may have over-tightened. Also, one of the screws did not go into its countersink hole very well. In the end, all seems well though
pdmphoto wrote:
One question I still have is how much one should tighten the mount screws. I got mine all tight, used a few lenses, then re-tightened. If anything I may have over-tightened. Also, one of the screws did not go into its countersink hole very well. In the end, all seems well though
Interesting about the lock tight. I did notice a red stain on the end of the screws when I removed them but they were not difficult to remove. If anything, I also believe I may have over tightened the screws when I installed the mount.
Did you notice any unusual resistance the first time you mounted a lens into the new mount Or did the lens mount smoothly right away.
mcbroomf wrote:
Did you re-locktite them? It wasn't mentioned in the video but I wonder if they might loosen up over time.
Mike
PS, thanks for posting your experience (Tariq as well)
No, I did not re-apply loctite. I keep a E-mount to Canon adapter over the screws, so I am not too concerned. I will check them from time to time to see if they are getting loose.
Tariq Gibran wrote:
Interesting about the lock tight. I did notice a red stain on the end of the screws when I removed them but they were not difficult to remove. If anything, I also believe I may have over tightened the screws when I installed the mount.
Did you notice any unusual resistance the first time you mounted a lens into the new mount Or did the lens mount smoothly right away.
Three out of four of my screws had threads 50-75% covered with loctite. One had about 25% thread coverage.
The first lens (adapter) I mounted seemed to go on a just a little tight, and I didn't get a real positive "click" feedback the lens mounted. I checked though and it was nicely mounted the first time. I have since tested it many times and it seems to mount lenses better than the original now. Mounting a lens (adapter) feels more solid, and the confirming click seems better than before. My guess is that it may have something to do with the spring clips that sit behind the tough-e mount adapter. Perhaps they are set into place a little when mounting the first time? That, or maybe the push pin binds a little a first?
pdmphoto wrote:
Three out of four of my screws had threads 50-75% covered with loctite. One had about 25% thread coverage.
The first lens (adapter) I mounted seemed to go on a just a little tight, and I didn't get a real positive "click" feedback the lens mounted. I checked though and it was nicely mounted the first time. I have since tested it many times and it seems to mount lenses better than the original. Mounting a lens (adapter) feels more solid, and the confirming click seems better than before. My guess is that it may have something to do with the spring clips that sit behind the tough-e mount adapter. Perhaps they are set into place a little when mounting the first time? That, or maybe the push pin binds a little a first?...Show more →
I don't know. Adapters/ lenses are mounting smoothly now. Some of my adapters do seem to mount a little more securely/ tighter which does (probably just psychologically) make the camera feel a bit more solid overall.
RCicala wrote:
Still, it's not an awful idea. As long as you trust Fotodiox to make very flat, very accurately machined mounts. I don't, but YMMV.
Based on how sloppy the tolerances have been on all of the other Fotodiox products I've owned, I would be very hesitant to stick something like this on my camera.
molson wrote:
Based on how sloppy the tolerances have been on all of the other Fotodiox products I've owned, I would be very hesitant to stick something like this on my camera.
FWIW I handled one of these (the tough mount) yesterday that a friend received and it doesn't look like any Fotodiox products I've seen before. Not that I ever had a functional problem with any of the Fotodiox adapters I've used, but this is very 'highly-finished-CNC' looking. In terms of tolerances I can't imagine it would be too difficult to meet or surpass Sony in this department, didn't the A7's have a light leak early on?
miguel_13 wrote:
In terms of tolerances I can't imagine it would be too difficult to meet or surpass Sony in this department, didn't the A7's have a light leak early on?
Based on the Fotodiox products I've owned, they have a very long ways to go to reach even Sony's level of manufacturing tolerances.
I'll use a Fotodiox lens hood etc in a heartbeat. Not sure I'd trust a brand I associate with low cost Chinese made knock-off parts with an important part of my camera like the lens mount....
Its like who I do trust more...the team of Sony engineers in Japan who designed and spec'd the parts, OR, a design team that makes $5 lens hoods out of pot metal with variable tolerances ?
I'd buy one, mic it and see. It is not too hard to imagine a single machined piece of metal being more accurate than the stamped metal and cast or stamped out plastic sammich on the Sony. It's also likely to be much easier to make accurately than the typical adapter which has maybe a cast body with machined ends and a machined piece screwed to each end.
The Sony parts are cheap by comparison really. How much can you spec a plastic ring to hold a lens in place The metal ring that Sony uses to hold the plastic piece in place is thin and feels like its made of aluminum (and there are still only the plastic tabs to hold the lens in place). It's not all that rigid in itself. I didn't like handholding my manual focus lenses on my A7r. They felt much more solid in use on my plastic (but very nice metal mount) Samsung NX30! On my A7r a little bit of flex up or down caused during manual focus or my shooting position (which isn't always standing up straight with arm relaxed), it's easy to move the lens out of position. I could see that in my pictures. With the Fotodiox mount that problem is gone and no new problems have surfaced. In fact, the camera feels a whole lot more robust when mounting/unmounting lenses, using the manual focus, and handholding the camera/lens when taking pictures. A+ to Fotodiox for the this product
wow..i thought i was rough with my equipment but i guess it is nothing compare to you guys that you actually have to replace the mounting. MF 100% with canon 17 TS-E and Otus or the damn heavy Dark Knight 50mm with my A7r and i don't feel any so call "flex up and down" as you 2 mentions. Oh well, maybe i'm just lucky with my A7r. tsk..tsk..
btw, nothing agains Bohus. I like the guy. He was very funny at NAB 2014 video.
Bubble wrote:
... i don't feel any so call "flex up and down" as you 2 mentions. Oh well, maybe i'm just lucky with my A7r. tsk..tsk..
btw, nothing agains Bohus. I like the guy. He was very funny at NAB 2014 video.
Not sure if you are referring to me but I did not experience up and down flex prior to my mount change. I just prefer the peace of mind of a full metal mount vs plastic.
Tariq Gibran wrote:
Not sure if you are referring to me but I did not experience up and down flex prior to my mount change. I just prefer the peace of mind of a full metal mount vs plastic.
Fair enough, but I will say this, having owned the A7, A7r and now A7s, basically since the cameras first came out, I have not lost one moment of sleep worrying about the mounts on the cameras.
This could very well be a well made product (though my $70 Fotodiox RX1 lens hood didn't fit that well, and that would seemingly be a higher end offering for them) but it just seems like a product that is going to solve a problem few if any of us actually will experience.
I've been following the Sony threads on this site since day one, something like 500 pages, I still just continue to see excellent images from talented photographers, using a wide range of glass, and not one issue brought up about a broken mount.
Does that mean it can't happen ? No, but it also doesn't mean it will happen, and it would appear the odds are on my side.
Again, if someone wants to change it, more power to them, seems cheap and easy enough, but still seems like a product designed to solve a problem few if any people (at least in my experience) are having.
The metal ring that Sony uses to hold the plastic piece in place is thin and feels like its made of aluminum (and there are still only the plastic tabs to hold the lens in place). It's not all that rigid in itself. I didn't like handholding my manual focus lenses on my A7r. They felt much more solid in use on my plastic (but very nice metal mount) Samsung NX30! On my A7r a little bit of flex up or down caused during manual focus or my shooting position (which isn't always standing up straight with arm relaxed), it's easy to move the lens out of position. I could see that in my pictures. With the Fotodiox mount that problem is gone and no new problems have surfaced. In fact, the camera feels a whole lot more robust when mounting/unmounting lenses, using the manual focus, and handholding the camera/lens when taking pictures. A+ to Fotodiox for the this product 