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Archive 2013 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?
  
 
Bark Imaging
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p.2 #1 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


I feel like pre-arranged has never worked. You have to kind of rely on all the parents to want to buy, and even commit to buy, but in the end they don't. And team photos are good, but if you're not really doing them up on wide panos and frames you're looking at $15 an 8x10. With 10 per team that is $150. 3 will actually buy.

On-site vs off:
One thing I can never really seem to find the time to do is stop shooting. Leaving is never really an option. As far as streaming to handheld devices. Just give them away instead. Making them available on devices takes time if you want to watermark and deter piracy. Also, you have to have some hotspot or other wireless network.
As far as deposits, after doing this for a while I realize that is not possible. You have to establish a rep and then rely on it. Otherwise, you will be giving refunds when you can't get the shot they want. However if you give them what you have they will buy it.

Trophies:
I used to shoot these. I haven't in a very long time. There are just too many easy shots the moms can get.

I get 25 folders in a weekend and gross around 2.5 to 3 grand.

I used to shoot the whole scene. the parents would ask us to crop the others. They just want their kid only. My best sales come from the warm-up because I can control the sun some and the angle I take. They say a photograph never lies, I think they never tell the truth and more of my images for collages come from warm-ups than games.
Jun 21, 2013 at 07:13 PM
P Alesse
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p.2 #2 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


gschlact wrote:
Some comments for further discussion. Let's assume we skip the individual portraits, and in general only consider Pre-arranged / requested team photos (I would not expect many takers since so many clubs have regular T&I). This now leave Action and trophy-T&I. Let's assume that even at my proficiency level that my shots are recognized as better by the parents when comparing to their M/DWAC.
Won't work. Or I should say... has never worked before around here. There are just too many parents with too many cameras over your shoulder grabbing the same exact shot. There is no exclusivity when it comes to team shots. Your only chance is to beat them with long reach glass.
-- Bark raises some interesting point that can potentially be neutralized? What do you think:
----- on site printing - I brought up Sams Club being only 1.5 mike away, but in a 3 mile radius as backup there is 3x Walgreens, Costco, Walmart, and Target each with quite capable Fuji printers, and this set double within 7 mile radius all as backup to alleviate the need for own printers.

Are you talking about printing shots from a game on spec or printing shots after a parent has ordered? Either way, this tournament is just too big to get your feet wet in on-site printing having not done it before. A small dance recital, yes. One stage, one place. A large spread out tourny like this is just too big. There would need to be so many logistics considered. How are you going to track down parents that purchased photos? Will you ship them if they don't get picked up? A lot of these teams want to get out quick after elimination. I can see a lot of headaches getting stuck with tons of prints.

----- Display stations - dispute that fact that Smart Phone only have 25% market penetration, I would estimate that in the parent demographics attending tournaments Smart Phone ownership is >90%+. So assuming this, could their own phones act as the viewing station for online viewing of the uploaded shots?

Again... time has to be built in for them to view the photos. When are they going to have time? If their kid is playing, they're watching. If they are waiting for a game, they are eating or relaxing. If they are done playing, they are driving home. How are you going to upload them while also shooting the games? From the field? Through what high speed connection? 3G or even 4G won't cut it. Huge bottleneck.

-- Decision of shooting on Spec
------- and printing for immediate sale vs on site only order/print/fulfill I would vote on the later using the fact that images will be taken down at the end of tournament for force short term decision. The risk being still that your shooting on spec. Success can be improved by Pre-arranged requests demonstrating interest or even deposit fees to reserve. Is this still to speculative assuming print will only be for purchases? What are thoughts now given above print / display, order only mitigation assumptions?

I kinda got lost in the higher level vocabulary in this question, but it seems like you are asking whether it would be better to view on-site and print and ship later? There is some debate to this question. Some of the vets will argue that POS is way more important than a physical order being delivered on-site. Some will argue that printing on-site is the ONLY way to have any chance at this. Both models are valid. We have done it both ways and although from our experience lately, there is a definite correlation between increased sales and printing on-site, I cannot prove cause-effect. So many other factors come into play that could attribute for steadily increasing sales for our on-site viewstationed tournaments. Our product line has become more streamlined, our marketing has been better targeted, our shots have been more efficient, our teams have been more affluent. These all play a role that could be causing the increased sales. Not the printing on-site necessarily. We elect to do it because, yeah, it works and two... when we leave the tournament, we want to be done. Hammy, luketrot, and BlueReptile will have their experienced take on this too.

-- Non Spec options
------- in thinking about this, Trophy T&I would like have higher take rate? Maybe the Tournament Coordinator would even pay for the, as give-away and for a percent of other sales but guarantees some revenue proportionate to photog time.

I don't understand the latter part of the question. Trophy shots, unless you have an exclusive area where YOU are the ONLY one taking the shot, has just about a 0% take rate.

-------Pre-arranged and deposit received game scheduling for action. Goal $200 reservation per game.

Possibly.


-- New in discussed Question, what kind of shots will make Parents happier when we any action shots?
--------- I know that my focus at games are not journalistic action but more from eye of the parent. In other words, based on the crowd sourcing wisdom here, do you agree parents prefer action with their child isolated from other players vs what we usually rank higher on the forum action with contact or other player in the frame adding to the 'story' use better for journalism?

Tight, tight, tight. Loose, loose, loose. Candids, candids, candids. Action, action, action. Point is that variety is the key. If you shoot one way and get the same exact kind of shot by sitting on one kid and sitting on the shutter, you decrease your sales potential exponentially. Generally speaking, you want to get as many high quality shots of as many different kids, with as much variety as possible. That will mean... tight, tight verticals like this...
http://www.playballphotos.com/images/2011_LAX/PVA_1204.jpg

Or tight, tight horizontal hits like this...
http://www.playballphotos.com/images/2011_LAX/PVA_0223.jpg

Tight, tight isolate horizontals like this...
http://www.playballphotos.com/images/2011_LAX/PVA_8590.jpg

"Journalistic" full body shots like this...
http://www.playballphotos.com/images/2011_LAX/PVA_2189.jpg

Full body isolated action shots like this...
http://www.playballphotos.com/images/2011_LAX/PVA_3494.jpg

In game portraits like this...
http://www.playballphotos.com/images/2011_Future_Legends_LAX/PVA_2608.jpg

Variety is the key! And I still maintain, you need a lot of luck. Not taking away anything from high end planning, but things have to break your way once in awhile too.


Jun 21, 2013 at 07:34 PM
gschlact
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p.2 #3 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?





-- Decision of shooting on Spec
------- and printing for immediate sale vs on site only order/print/fulfill I would vote on the later using the fact that images will be taken down at the end of tournament for force short term decision. The risk being still that your shooting on spec. Success can be improved by Pre-arranged requests demonstrating interest or even deposit fees to reserve. Is this still to speculative assuming print will only be for purchases? What are thoughts now given above print / display, order only mitigation assumptions?

I kinda got lost in the higher level vocabulary in this question, but it seems like you are asking whether it would be better to view on-site and print and ship later? There is some debate to this question. Some of the vets will argue that POS is way more important than a physical order being delivered on-site. Some will argue that printing on-site is the ONLY way to have any chance at this. Both models are valid. We have done it both ways and although from our experience lately, there is a definite correlation between increased sales and printing on-site, I cannot prove cause-effect. So many other factors come into play that could attribute for steadily increasing sales for our on-site viewstationed tournaments. Our product line has become more streamlined, our marketing has been better targeted, our shots have been more efficient, our teams have been more affluent. These all play a role that could be causing the increased sales. Not the printing on-site necessarily. We elect to do it because, yeah, it works and two... when we leave the tournament, we want to be done. Hammy, luketrot, and BlueReptile will have their experienced take on this too.

>>> , that wasn't higher level vocabulary, that was me trying to finish typing on my iPad while getting interrupted nineteen times. I was trying to ask based on the previous comments about strongly recommending to have the print on site. I didn't know from your comment whether POS meant print-on-site or POint-of-Sale? But, I was trying to say would your print out hundreds of 4x6 (sams club runs for pickup after 4G upload) to facilitate purchase, , or do you simply collect orders and then have them come back in a couple of hours to pick them up, or even just ship after the fact?

Alternatively, I was proposing the idea of skipping the printing and simply promoting my website for online viewing and ordering via Smartphone with parents viewing during their down time /anywhere and not needing to be at som specific booth? (Knowing they only have a 48 hour window to view and order). My online site would be watermarked, and take the orders with auto fulfillment (Bay Photo via SmigMug). This way all I would need to do is promote the we site, take reservations /deposits and shoot. I believe SmugMug let's me provide coupon codes which would be generated toward purchase credit for those prepaying.






Jun 21, 2013 at 11:13 PM
Ed Peters
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p.2 #4 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


As to parents. They want to see their kid and only their kid (and a team that includes the trophy, with their kid holding it). And by see their kid I mean their faces. So if you can get a "not-through-the-fence" batting you might have a chance (don't forget to not show one where the ball is in the catchers glove). YMMV
Jun 21, 2013 at 11:14 PM
sportsdadof3
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p.2 #5 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


From this morning at a softball tournament in Rural N.C. ... example what we are up against. Very informative post.







Jun 22, 2013 at 02:15 PM
Hammy
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p.2 #6 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


Mainly two parts to any selling experience:

- the first is what we as photographers are interested in: taking the photo.
If you don't have better gear AND better angles than the parents, then (in their minds) how are you getting better photos than them?
For soccer fields, access is the same - you'd better have great glass with reach and shooting with grass blades touching the front element.
Baseball may give you the benefit of getting field access, but if your shooting from the fence, you're not getting a different angle than parents. I shoot from the baseline...ON the baseline (inside from the umpire) with >300mm, or down low between the on deck batter and the plate - with >200mm.

So yes, a lot of us can do that - good gear, great angles... that's what makes us a worthy photographer. However, this has nothing to say about covering 20+ fields at time - that cost's money to hire additional photographers with the same skill set to replicate ourselves.

- The second, and WAY more important facet of any business venture: selling.
This is where most photographers fail - because it doesn't involve buying more camera gear!
First: how do you get people to want to come see your photos!?!? ATG (ass to grass) and a large telephoto will initially get you seen, but what about your booth? You have to market to ... 20 fields = 40 teams = 800 parents (plus kids) = 150+ people that you want to show off photos to. Scratch that, probably only half that want to see photos - those parents of the winning team.... IF their not running off to Dairy Queen to celebrate their victory!
So there is a potential of 500 people that want to see photos IMMEDIATELY after their game...after water and maybe snack. Are you ready for them? Can you handle the masses? How do they view photos...quickly enough that they are tying up the limited viewstations. How about ordering, checkout, receipt? This is all before thinking about printing/delivery.
Of course, this assumes that you did market to the parents with flags, fans, flyers, etc... which takes up more money that didn't go toward camera or computer gear.

Most people know my opinion about printing onsite. I used to do it - loved the concept of being a one-stop shop. And I'm all for it... as with anything else in business... as long as the cost:benefit analysis makes it work for you. If you're local and have friends/family helping that can keep up with the load - by all means: get it done!
For us, we're national - er, international. And my cost analysis is the difference of staff/gear onsite vs shipping. Some shows it's worth delivering onsite, whereas most is worth shipping. For us, delivering onsite is relegated to just burning discs, though. As the staff and gear to print 3000+ prints at our largest show doesn't outweigh the shipping cost of getting it done in the controlled environment of our office.
But from our days of printing/delivering onsite compared to NOT delivering onsite - we noticed NO difference in sales, yet a huge difference is the cost of running a show...again, on a (n inter)national scale, not local/regional.

Selling onsite is a MAJOR key - but your workflow has to exceed your customer flow. Know that before guessing at running any kind of numbers game of how many people will buy. Those variables are more rampant than the first 1000 digits of Pi.
Jun 24, 2013 at 09:03 AM
Bark Imaging
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p.2 #7 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


I really don't use the web much. I used to write to let go, though. And I'm kind of tipsy. This is my saturday.

Hammy obviously is where I plan on being a few years down the road. I always say that it is one thing to get the shot, it is another to deliver a product. 2 strokes and you can't slip on either.

I used to think that my photography came from my eye or gear or technique. It comes from my legs. I can shoot a batter from first by the coach with a 10 pound camera. If a lefty is on deck. As soon as the righty is done, I can sprint down the line behind blue and the players and up to third. And back. If teams are tricky and go lefty righty, I can do it all day, all weekend 2, 3, 4, days. Thats what sell to lefties parents. We print up 3 samples per team when we first shoot them. No water marks, nothing. Any lefty batter, we show them their face when they bat, they buy. I live in Texas. These folks love to see hard work. That makes it in action sports on a youth level IMHO. The folks I shoot will continue to help. We raise prices on collages as my technique improves. We go in 10 and 15 dollar increments. The same parents continue to buy 2,3, and 4 happens from time to time.

We have basically no web presence. We do everything on site and by mail for the cooler things. But I adore it. I love the work. As we build up these same folks will be there to pay more as we need it. I can personally shoot a 30 team softball tournament. And make a collage for anyone who wants it. We do 40 and more tourneys but we have to kind of not shoot some teams, but we usually do that to teams we know well. They tell others they like us. Its just me and my wife. And shes so cool. People adore her.

We had our car stolen one time. We went to the tourney that weekend in my dad's car. I told a couple coaches we could use a good weekend. We set sales records all three days.

When we started this was not the case at all! There are a ton of fly by nights that think hiring kids at 10 bucks an hour and never delivering orders is ok because the market is so big. That's bogus. (Can I cuss here). And then there are other places where they are used to a guy who sells differently than you do. That throws them for a loop and if you don't adjust you spend money to work.

Its hard and the only way to really do action, is spend some money to work for a while. It is not an easy hobby to have.


Jun 24, 2013 at 05:20 PM
gschlact
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p.2 #8 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


Hammy,
Many of the points and experiences in your post are exactly the considerations I tried to evaluate.
Much of your theme is about scalable capabilities to shoot, show, sell, and fulfill the orders. Hence my ideas I ran by the thread participants: shoot know games of known interest, upload via 4G to ecommerce website (smugmug etc) for easy and widespread viewing on smart phone while at the DQ, lets the viewer place orders and Smugmug printer fulfills the order. (Alternatively, for this tourney, I contend I could fulfill via Sams Club etc which are very close but is seems like unnecessary per your comments of mailing). So, I would say I achieve the scalable operation you say is necessary via the smartphone viewing and e commerce order and fulfillment management.

This then leave the big question for you to opine on... If you agree that one could utilize utilize the method mention, and you had the rights to the tournament mentioned, and had access to hire photogs locally,what approach would you take to shooting/selling? Do you shoot on spec and shoot as many games possible by the crew of photogs you hire and poster/handout everywhere, , or do you lower risk and shoot by reservation only? Other?

Guy
Jun 24, 2013 at 07:56 PM
Hammy
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p.2 #9 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


Guy,

Be careful with 4G. When you go to the park on an empty day, you get massive bandwidth. But when a few thousand people occupy the same space and share the same towers, your bandwidth goes to crap.
I thought the same thing a couple years ago for some shows. Tested bandwidth on an off day at like 20-30Mbps up - and all I wanted to upload was web images. But for another event in the same building before the main show, I tested ... showing full bars for service... but absolutely NO data.

Not only will you not be able to upload full res photos, your customers won't be able to browse them with any efficiency.

This is of course if they know how and where to look. The one thing you lose by allowing any wireless device to be a viewstation... is control. Not control of the photos, but of the process. Yes, the left over teenagers in the stand with their phones can get there fine, but the parents with 'smart'phones not used to browsing web sites and grandparents with their tablets (given to them by children just last week) may have no idea what they are doing: how to get to smugmug, much less how to navigate it. That leaves you with either disgruntled customers that give up, or them looking for you to give them support while you're shooting.

Web sales are so passive. There is no immediacy or emotion to buy. In my experience, on site sales will result in >500% more sales than online (based on having viewstations onsite, then posting online) On the very few events I've done online only (uploaded after the event), I've barely covered my costs.

I don't think that in an open environment, that you're going to get the word out enough about your photos online. You have to market that fact massively...as much, if not more than if you had a booth.

We've shot the Dizzy Dean World Series in Southaven for the past several years. Sales have declined every year. Last year we spent a massive amount on new marketing...to seemingly no avail. That same marketing effort at ALL of our cheer shows increased sales 25-45%
In the past, we've tried to cover all teams (25 fields across 2 parks) but expenses have risen every year. We are doing the series again this year - but very thin, covering teams that pay up front, otherwise occupying our time shooting only the youngest teams once. Those will be available, but additional coverage is after the first game covered is purchased as well as the next.
We should do ok, because 75% of the teams have seen us over the years there.
At the same time, we'll be upsetting plenty of parents who expect to see photos of every child like we've done in the past. We'll be pushing the fact of pre-purchase coverage only, but most won't (bother to) see it. I'll let you know next month how it goes.

For an unknown to walk into a massive tournament, with your work and tenure unknown, it will be quite a hard sell to convince people to buy upfront and commit their money.
Especially if it's a local/regional tourney. We've seen over the years in all aspects of events: the farther a family travels to be at a competition, the more likely they are to spend. We call it "Vacation Mode" - where they have the money to spend and expect it to be spent.
At our baseball tourney, probably the most affluent team is local, and I can remember them buying once in about 7 years. They are not in vacation mode. They are spending money on hotels or meals or anything. This is a local tournament to them.
As long as you can get to them before they spend it all - which is hard to do as photographers - because we don't have a product until after they compete - whereas all other vendors will sell them a trinket and t-shirt before they get to the field/stage/floor/etc.

So if you don't really have a plan for covering this event, don't plan on making money. Either relax that weekend, or go try to see what you can do. If you can make enough money to buy a couple new CF cards, then it beats watching TV all weekend! You may learn what you're dealing with, you may get more 'exposure' with future clients.
Jun 25, 2013 at 09:47 AM
P Alesse
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p.2 #10 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


Hammy wrote:
I don't think that in an open environment, that you're going to get the word out enough about your photos online. You have to market that fact massively...as much, if not more than if you had a booth.

We've shot the Dizzy Dean World Series in Southaven for the past several years. Sales have declined every year. Last year we spent a massive amount on new marketing...to seemingly no avail. That same marketing effort at ALL of our cheer shows increased sales 25-45%
In the past, we've tried to cover all teams (25 fields across 2 parks) but expenses have risen...Show more →

This pretty much sums up the fate of outdoor youth sports. If Hammy's marketing doesn't bring em in then nothing will and you need to look at other variables.

There is no halfway with this. Either you invest a ton of money on this and give it a go all in or you cover it the way outlined it in an early post. Employ just yourself. Hire a card person or just do it yourself and shoot as many games as possible. No expenses. No financial risk. I had suggested this second option based on your level of experience with big tourneys.
Jun 25, 2013 at 10:39 AM
kiwifamily
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p.2 #11 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


Gentlemen, you've nailed it I think.

I for one no longer shoot junior football for business.
Jun 26, 2013 at 06:33 AM
CW100
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p.2 #12 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


gschlact wrote:
I am not one to rely on luck. Risk is not the same as luck.
As far as this tournament some extra info / corrections to make:
-- it is Lacrosse
-- it is mid July and I somewhat had a personal commitment so not likely for this year

Some comments for further discussion. Let's assume we skip the individual portraits, and in general only consider Pre-arranged / requested team photos (I would not expect many takers since so many clubs have regular T&I). This now leave Action and trophy-T&I. Let's assume that even at my proficiency level that my shots are recognized as...Show more →

I agree with the other comments, you're going to encounter parents with cameras who shoot lacrosse games and post free for everyone to share. I'm one of those !
So be prepared to (not) encounter a gold mine of photo opportunity

e.g.

pic with a cheap $150 Rebel DSLR and "consumer" lens distributed free

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8245/8572213160_4d7b1f4cbe_b.jpg


http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8239/8597805374_0d59bd7297_b.jpg











Edited on Jul 02, 2013 at 05:36 AM · View previous versions
Jun 28, 2013 at 06:53 AM
gschlact
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p.2 #13 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


CW100 - I honestly don't understand what you are trying to say or show with your photo. Earlier, I acknowledged there will be moms with cameras and that we need to differentiate over them and their free postings. Most here would agree at the photo example is case in point.
Jun 28, 2013 at 08:56 PM
jspytek
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p.2 #14 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


First, thank you so much to the very helpful commentary from those of you with many years / experiences in the world of sports photography. I really appreciate the time you guys are willing to take to keep me (us) from making time and money mistakes. I try hard not to be stubborn and be open to listening to others. Again, sincerely, thank you you have accelerated my knowledge on this field far greater and faster than any class, book, or trial by error.

During the day I came across a local MLB teams calendar with all the sponsorship and special game day promotions. It got me to thinking about this fall. Has anyone tried sponsoring a "tonight only" type promotion AT THE GATE, so when the parents walk in they are handed a flier with your website / gallery information on it?

My best activity so far has been near the end of the season when the senior's moms realize they don't have any great shots of their kids. Amazing how after all these years it hits them and they are willing to pay for it.

Anyway, what about the at the gate promos?
Jun 28, 2013 at 10:27 PM
jspytek
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p.2 #15 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


gschlact - I think he's trying to say he gives the photos away for free and that people who get something for free have a difficult time seeing the value you are providing. I agree with you that the photo makes the point. So you need to figure out a way to differentiate yourself enough that people will pay for it. That is something I'm struggling with, yet learning. Find the niche that works and create a gameplan. There has been some solid advice in this thread. I am personally working on a strategy to get clients at the 5-10 year old range, and turn them into customers for the next 10 years. I'm figuring providing the people who will pay for quality photos early and becoming "their photographer" will turn into a repeat customer business model.

To disclose everything, I do give photos to my kids soccer team as the unofficial team photographer. However, I do that because I hate sitting next to parents that don't know the rules of the game and are ignorant about how the coach's strategy is being put into play. So, my leaving them and shooting allows me to enjoy the game and have a nice day watching my kids.

I've been scouting various sports who do not have big lenses in the crowds. I've found some teams have 3-5 shooters on the field. I have no interested in covering those game other that as assignment for my local paper. I'm even reluctant to cover for the paper as they are selling photos for in my opinion below market value. I have discovered there are plenty of schools in my area that do not have a single big lens on the field. Those are my low hanging fruit whom I'm going after this fall. Might have to drive a little bit, but the fruit is out there.
Jun 28, 2013 at 10:46 PM
CW100
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p.2 #16 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


jspytek wrote:
gschlact - I think he's trying to say he gives the photos away for free and that people who get something for free have a difficult time seeing the value you are providing. I agree with you that the photo makes the point. So you need to figure out a way to differentiate yourself enough that people will pay for it.

selling photos for in my opinion below market value. I have discovered there are plenty of schools in my area that do not have a single big lens on the field. Those are my low hanging fruit whom I'm...Show more →


gschlact wrote:
CW100 - I honestly don't understand what you are trying to say or show with your photo. Earlier, I acknowledged there will be moms with cameras and that we need to differentiate over them and their free postings. Most here would agree at the photo example is case in point.

the point is If parents can get photos free and post them on flickr, facebook, etc. why would they buy your pics ? The reason you never see professional photogs at these lacrosse games is the parents are right there on the sidelines unlike a HS football game.
If that pic from a $150 camera convinced you ..... good - post your results (P&L or pics!)

ok, here's another LAX pic from a $150 camera -- for "your case" !


http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7059/6931965899_32d6bbd77c.jpg


http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5493/9184572002_2e85e39482_b.jpg

















Edited on Jul 01, 2013 at 09:09 AM · View previous versions
Jun 30, 2013 at 07:12 AM
Matt OHarver
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p.2 #17 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


I'm not sure that photo is telling me what you think it is....if that was my kid, even if it was free I'd toss it in the recycle bin. I'd at least like to see all of her head....
Jun 30, 2013 at 08:30 PM
gschlact
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p.2 #18 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


Matt, thanks for confirming I am not crazy. I was feeling so confused but had the same thought as what you just posted.


Jun 30, 2013 at 10:06 PM
CW100
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p.2 #19 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


Matt OHarver wrote:
if that was my kid, even if it was free I'd toss it in the recycle bin. I'd at least like to see all of her head....


done!


gschlact wrote:
Matt, thanks for confirming I am not crazy. I was feeling so confused but had the same thought as what you just posted.

here's something to help with your confusion - check out the "business of photography" section in this forum

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/forumdisplay.php?s=27b0acc13b98717d11fd5a54cbe45889&f=23

and do a search on photographing lacrosse tournaments
hint: it's not about the quality of the pics
Jul 01, 2013 at 05:22 PM
gschlact
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p.2 #20 · sizing up tournament photo vendo opportunity?


CW100,

We are not dissagreeing that the MWAC and freebies have nearly removed all sales opportunities. This thread was about what is left for professionals to potentially do to differnentiate and create sales worthwhile of their time. The largest common denominator across all answers to this question is that Quality must be better, the product must be different than what the MWAC is giving away. Realize too, the photographer makes a great difference. Take your post from above as the example. You can have the best new $6k lens, but if you create images like the several you posted, there is plenty of room for the Pro's to differentiate with their product. This leaves the original question of the best way of maximize any potential ROI.
Jul 01, 2013 at 10:07 PM
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