fredmiranda.com
Login

Moderated by: Fred Miranda
  New fredmiranda.com Mobile Site
  New Feature: SMS Notification alert
  New Feature: Buy & Sell Watchlist
  

FM Forums | Nikon Forum | Join Upload & Sell

1       2              end
  

Archive 2013 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?

  
 
snapsy
Online
• • • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #1 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


Mark_L wrote:
This. I think there are many casual photographers out there who buy 'pro' gear which is why you see so many complaints about dslr weight and file sizes.

After all the planning, scouting, a 4am start and hiking or concept development, model casting, location scouting and arranging a team waiting a few more seconds on my computer for that shot to be the best quality I can get really isn't a big deal. On another forum I read a statement from a guy who shot something on a NEX7 rather than get his phaseone IQ from the car - really, if
...Show more

That's a rather limited cross-section of pro photographers, those who take a relatively few number of photographs and can spend a week on processing. How about those who shoot thousands of photographs in one event and have to deliver 400 of them?



May 24, 2013 at 03:45 PM
Mark_L
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #2 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


snapsy wrote:
That's a rather limited cross-section of pro photographers, those who take a relatively few number of photographs and can spend a week on processing. How about those who shoot thousands of photographs in one event and have to deliver 400 of them?


I didn't mean pros I just meant people more serious about their results than casual photogs, the point is that if waiting for few extra seconds in PS or LR is such an issue how serious about your results are you? Those who shoot thousands of photographs in one event are a limited subset of photographers (usually pros and often needing fast framerates) for whom the D800 wasn't made.



May 24, 2013 at 03:57 PM
snapsy
Online
• • • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #3 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


Mark_L wrote:
I didn't mean pros I just meant people more serious about their results than casual photogs, the point is that if waiting for few extra seconds in PS or LR is such an issue how serious about your results are you? Those who shoot thousands of photographs in one event are a limited subset of photographers (usually pros and often needing fast framerates) for whom the D800 wasn't made.


It would include wedding photogs as well. I'm accustomed to spending a lot of time editing my photos, as others surely are. The issue is in the extra delays throughout the process with larger files. I don't see those delays as adding anything to the experience of being a photographer or worthy of any merit badge - to me it's just wasted time that interferes with the artistic process.



May 24, 2013 at 04:30 PM
CGrindahl
Offline
• • • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #4 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


The first time my friend took out his recently acquired D800 he spent a couple of weeks in the field, sleeping in his truck and hiking wilderness areas with camera, tripod and camera bag. He came back with fewer than a hundred images, of which he deemed 11 worth keeping. I consider him a serious photographer for whom the 36 megapixels makes perfect sense. His photos are published in the Sierra Club Wilderness calendar.

I chose not to buy a D800 after spending a week using a friend's new camera. Apart from some ergonomic problems for me there was the simple fact the D700 with its 12 megapixels gives me everything I want from a camera. I didn't want to upgrade my computer or buy more storage to accommodate the larger files. Yes, there is better dynamic range, but I'm getting the images I want without it. I don't print images. For online sharing I have plenty of megapixels, even when I'm cropping images. I may upgrade at some time, but Nikon is going to have to give me a camera better suited to my needs for that to happen. The D800 doesn't work and the D600, as sweet as the files are is not a replacement for a D700.

Bottom line, we each need to make the calculation for ourselves, a sort of cost/benefit analysis that is focused less on measurbating and more on real life usage. If you NEED what the D800 has to offer and are willing to make the investment I'd say, enjoy yourself. There are many ways to enjoy photography and kit building and re-building can be part of that. Of course, if your only "need" is to own the latest and greatest, go for it. That's not my approach but whatever floats your boat is fine by me.



May 24, 2013 at 06:48 PM
JimFox
Offline
• • • • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #5 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


jhinkey wrote:
I must respectfully disagree.

The D800 has many other great improvements over the D700 that would be very compelling even if it still had 12MP:
- Dual card slots
- 100% Viewfinder
- f/8 AF sensors
- Way better low light handling (lack of sensor streaking with blown out highlights in particular)
- Lighter
- Video
- Higher DR
- etc.

Personally I chose the D800 NOT because of the increased resolution, but because it improved upon the D700 in so many other ways that impacted my style of photography. Some people will in fact buy the D800 just for the
...Show more

Hey John,

For sure, the D800 has many more things going for it than the 36mp. But today, Nikon has the D7100, the D600 both of which are improved over the D700 (which I loved) and both have many of the cool features someone might look for in a camera. So that's why I said, if the person who is thinking that the 36mp of the D800 is a drawback, then they should just look at another camera (D7100, D600, etc).

So thanks for bringing up the issue of the other improvements, I was trying not to be too long in my first comment to this thread. So your adding this, rounds out what I was thinking.

Jim



May 24, 2013 at 08:33 PM
f.hayek
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #6 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


I'd also like to respectfully add to the discussion that if one is concerned about the 'disadvantage' of large files, it can be turned into an advantage in that a 36 MP image down-sampled to 16 or even 12 MP will be far cleaner than one from a native 12 or 16 MP sensor. You thereby derive the advantage of a higher DR and higher ISO sensor while consuming memory storage at a more modest pace.


May 24, 2013 at 09:21 PM
jhinkey
Offline
• • • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #7 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


f.hayek wrote:
I'd also like to respectfully add to the discussion that if one is concerned about the 'disadvantage' of large files, it can be turned into an advantage in that a 36 MP image down-sampled to 16 or even 12 MP will be far cleaner than one from a native 12 or 16 MP sensor. You thereby derive the advantage of a higher DR and higher ISO sensor while consuming memory storage at a more modest pace.


Not if you keep your NEF files . . . .



May 25, 2013 at 12:09 AM
JTMeuret
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #8 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


I don't have a D800, but this seems like a funny conversation really. This question of the D800 won't be around when a D9900 comes out with 120 MP in about 5 years. Anyway, not trying to offend anyone, but just buy the D800 and shoot! I'm still having fun with my 10.2 MP D80.


May 25, 2013 at 02:11 AM
CGrindahl
Offline
• • • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #9 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


^ But then we wouldn't have anything to talk about...


May 25, 2013 at 06:13 PM
emiller90
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #10 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


I agree that LR is a little slow with the D800. Aperture on my Macbook Pro processes the files like hot knife cutting through butter. I have been surprised.


May 25, 2013 at 06:27 PM
lxdesign
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #11 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


I don't find it a drawback at all..... Drives are much cheaper than they used to be. And my mac mini works just great.


May 25, 2013 at 06:36 PM
splathrop
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #12 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


Note: I'm a Canon shooter (pro) who has only shot the D800 a couple of times.

I have a friend (hobbyist) who has always used Nikon, and moved up from the D300. He has been struggling to get the best out of the camera. Found himself buying a tripod for the first time, and upgrading lenses. Looking at many of the images on Nikon picture threads, I suspect many of the posters would profit by following that course, but haven't yet realized how much potential capability they aren't using. But they're happy, and sing the camera's praises.

I can't imagine that the D800 would be an easy camera to use optimally for, say, birds in flight. Not that you couldn't get good pictures. But handholding it on a moving target in natural light probably isn't going to turn out as well as putting it on a tripod and using studio lighting.

As for resolution, I doubt you need the D800 for that (except severe cropping), unless you plan to print wider than 30 inches. If you are an event shooter, a wedding shooter, or a sports shooter, you probably ought to be looking at Canon anyway, because you aren't generally making extremely large prints in those applications, and the 5D 3 is faster and more versatile. That probably applies as well to the typical all-around family photographer.

That said, I suspect that for many users the high dynamic range is actually more of a drawback than the high resolution. It's not that I wouldn't like to have that dynamic range myself. But unless you are skilled at post processing, and ruthless about evaluating the graphic qualities of your images, lifting shadows offers all kinds of opportunities to mess up your files. The details from nominally opaque shadows can be brought to life, but where do you put them? When they are lifted into the dynamic range of your printer or display device, they can end up with tonal values identical to other details that are already visible, which your software will then try to push to yet other points along the dynamic scale. Something has to give, and in many instances the result has been dismayingly flat looking files. You can see hundreds of such images on various Nikon threads. The trick is to learn what is advantageous, what is harmful, and how often (the large majority of the time for me, and I shoot a camera with notably less dynamic capability than the D800) your great dynamic range isn't actually even a factor, because your available light is too flat to challenge the camera's limits.

Personally, as a person who shoots a lot off a tripod, prints up to 45-inches wide, and sells landscape images, I would have bought a D800 if it had better live view capability, and if Nikon made better tilt and shift lenses.

Instead, I bought a 5D 3, and I am so happy with its images and versatility that I wonder if considering the D800 was a mistake. I don't think the lower dynamic range is holding me back much. And while I would like to have the resolution for the big prints, gallery owners and buyers say they find my images plenty sharp. (I think I'm pushing the enlargement more than I would prefer, and also wonder whether more resolution might give me more keepers; to get that sharp appearance in large prints from my smaller files I need nearly perfect light conditions and natural contrast, together with costly lenses that make the most of it).

And of course for portraits, questions about resolution and dynamic range become less salient. You can shoot great head-and-shoulders portraits with 8 megapixels—for that 36 MP is portrait overkill. But high resolution can be great for group portraits or environmental portraits. And formal portraiture really ought to be done in studio lighting, where you control the dynamic range at the source.

So there's a lot to think about. Hope this somewhat unfocused comment helps a bit.



May 25, 2013 at 10:12 PM
CAlbertson
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #13 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


mfrank999 wrote:
Are the window pcs more powerful than the Mac's?


Only if you count CPU cycles per dollar. It is hard to find a computer more powerful than a fully spec's out Mac Pro. The high end Mac has 12 CPU cores and 64GB of RAM. That is way-over kill for photo editing. I mid range Mac is certainly enough for editing still photos.

If you run Aperture the workflow can be VERY fast because it allows you to start on the first photo while the next one is still downloading from the camera. My camera is a little slow to download but even so I can't edit as fast so I have in effect zero down time.

You can build a cheaper mid range system using a PC. But at the highest end it is hard to match Apple's price on a dual Xeon 12-core box

If you can "power by" how much work you get done. Then the PC has a problem because you are messing with security issues and ten clicks to get anything done. A quad core 27" iMac and a Wacom tablet running Aperture runs faster than I can. So the computer is not the limiting factor.

I'm left handed so I work with the Wacom pen in my left hand and the right hand on the "magic track pad". The track pad is about 5" square glass surfaced and accepts multi-finger musters, the pen is better for brushes. Together, it's me not the computer who is the limit.



May 25, 2013 at 11:29 PM
CAlbertson
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #14 · D800 megapixels: is it really a drawback?


emiller90 wrote:
I agree that LR is a little slow with the D800. Aperture on my Macbook Pro processes the files like hot knife cutting through butter. I have been surprised.


Aperture knows how to use all four CPU cores and the graphic card. LR is not able to use nearly as much of your hardware.



May 25, 2013 at 11:32 PM
1       2              end




FM Forums | Nikon Forum | Join Upload & Sell

1       2              end
    
 

Welcome back
Log in to your account