p.2 #1 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
I shoot with both the 5D Mark III and D800E. For my landscape work I really appreciate the ability to push the shadows on the D800E and I do have clients that are asking for prints larger than 24x36.
p.2 #3 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
Just a thought, which body (gripped if you need/use one) feels best in hand. If you're going to be shooting full time as a pro you sure don't want the body, buttons, etc. to either get in your way or more importantly hurt your hands. Ergonomics are of most import when you shoot handheld a lot!
So are your eyes, live view, perhaps an additional eyepiece for magnification might be in order, and I'd seriously look at the D800Es vs. 5D3s viewfinders and LCDs. It would suck if your portal to your image didn't work for your style of shooting.
If you are mainly using supports (mono or tripod) then it doesn't matter much, find the remote switch, interval timer that fits you needs best.
But before you consider a body, focus on the glass you absolutely need, must have. When you have your lens kit sorted; zooms, fast primes, etc. then choose your system. If you're serious, then you are buying into a system, think on it's capabilities, costs and resale-ability...then jump in...but I'd rent 1st, get a taste before you simply buy because of specs.
p.2 #4 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
Your timing for a reconsideration of systems seems to be very well thought out and logical. If you want to go full frame while almost every component of your current system is APS-C crop format I now is the time to decide what system you are going to build.
Full frame D-SLR systems are from Canon, Nikon and Sony. There is a full frame sensor based systems from Leica too but I guess you are oriented to SLR type full frame cameras.
If you make a decision for a system I believe the body is the least interesting component. Bodies come and go in a system and you'll probably more often replace bodies than lenses in your system if, and this is a big if, you do it right with choosing lenses. Chances are great that the body you would like to have most now will be surpassed by a next model from the competition next year. Would you change systems once again then? I guess not.
You are a landscape photographer you say. So let's start with some typical landscape lenses.
Do you see a future for your self with tilt and shift lenses? If yes, Canon has the better system.
Do you prefer to do manual focus? Zeiss glass for instance? Canon and Nikon both do adapt these lenses (ZE and ZF mount)
Do you want Zeiss glass, but AF? No choice, but Sony. They have a limited choice (Distagon 24/2.0) but that is a great fast wide lens for landscaping. The other Zeiss AF lenses for Sony are wonderful too, but it's only a few Planars and Distagons.
Is zoom important for your style of photography? The Nikkor 14-14 is a great landscape zoom.
Is Live View important for you because you do manual focus preferrably via your LCD. Canon and Sony have the better systems.
Is there a specific type of device in one of the systems that is very important for your photography?
Anyway, my message is the same like some others above already said. Don't just look at the bodies when you choose a system. The D800 and D800E are definitely great cameras, especially for the serious landscape photographer. But chances are great they will be surpassed by new models from the competition next year. You don't want to change systems again every other year. If you choose a system for lenses and other system components than the bodies you will appreciate the quality of your lenses and know when to wait for the next body upgrade instead of looking over the fence for a new body from an incompatible competitor.
The D800 is seductive, I have shot with the camera a few times now, I wished Canon had a high res model for me. But I decided to stay with my 1DsmkIII for a while because I love my TS/E glass and the setup of live view on Android devices too much to give up. I rent/borrow the D800 when I have to do work that I need to print big and where stitching is no option. For everything else I am still perfectly happy with my Canon system.
I hope all these consideration help in making a choice. Unless you switch, have EOSfun
p.2 #7 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
rk-d wrote:
The d800e has superior dynamic range and a higher megapixel count. Everything else is inferior. The AF is spotty and the module is simply outmatched for the demands of that sensor. The build is a step down from the d700 and the handling of the 5d3, including the grip shape and ergonomics are much better , in my opinion. Finally, the d800 has bad QC issues and Nikon USA is no longer selling parts to individuals. There have been some horror stories lately about their customer service.
This. The D800 has a fine sensor. Everything else, I'd give to Canon, if you can afford what they're charging these days. The samples I've seen from the 6D suggest they may have conquered the shadow banding issues with earlier FF iterations. It wouldn't surprise me at all to see a high-megapixel body in February or August.
p.2 #9 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
dwweiche wrote:
I think there's some confusion here. I believe in the OP's original post, he was referring to the D800's publicized issues regarding repeated dirt/oil on the sensor and the "left side" focus point issues. These have been discussed a lot on the Nikon board.
Some of you have assumed he was talking about Canon oil spill and AF issues. (Unless I'm the confused one )
Regarding the OP's question, I think Chez has the right advice. Rent and try. You're out a bit of money but will know without a doubt what direction to take.
As Adam correctly pointed out, it is the D600 w/ the oil/dirt issue, and the D800 with the AF issues. My mistake.
p.2 #10 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
If I primarily shot landscapes and regularly printed very large, I'd be all over the D800E! I don't though. Whilst the D800 still interests me technically, dealing with 36MP files when shooting events (1000+ shots) doesn't interest me at all! I've still been tempted though, but some slight advantages in the Canon glass (I couldn't live with the 135mm focal length of the 70-200 at MFD for example) and much bigger second hand market (better online resources too) keep me with Canon. I've actually been having a look at the Sony A99 lately, the 24MP sensor size interests me more. I'll most likely keep saving up for a 5D3 though
p.2 #11 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
It would seem I am one of the few perfectly content with the 5dii and 24 tse v2. No experience with the d800 or 5diii. If you are shooting landscape mostly I say you start with a 5dii + 17tse and 24tse. They will change your life
No joke. I am in love with tilt/shift for landscape such a joy to use and so sharp
Unfortunately, the Internet sized images all have a tendency to look the same. In print is where the D800 will really shine. The images I printed from the D800 really do provide more details than my 5d2 at sizes greater than around 16x24. By 24x30 it is very noticeable. That is not even taking into account the D800 images being much more malleable in post processing.
p.2 #14 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
jerbear00 wrote:
If I needed 36mp+ I would buy phase 1.
If I required better AF I would buy a 5diii
You wouldn't want to take a phase 1 out on a trek with any amounts of elevation gains or inclement weather. The D800 image quality does approach that of medium format at a fraction the price.
p.2 #15 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
eosfun wrote:
If you make a decision for a system I believe the body is the least interesting component. Bodies come and go in a system and you'll probably more often replace bodies than lenses in your system if, and this is a big if, you do it right with choosing lenses. Chances are great that the body you would like to have most now will be surpassed by a next model from the competition next year. Would you change systems once again then? I guess not.
Unless you switch, have EOSfun
Bodies come and go, and for landscape photography this does not necessarily imply changing system even when the bodies alternate between Canon and Nikon. I will explain how.
At present, I use both Canon and Nikon. Canon for events and autofocus stuff, Nikon D800E for landscape, architecture and some other stuff. I decided to mostly get manual focus lenses for my Nikon D800E, lenses that I can also use with a Canon camera. This means buying Zeiss lenses in the ZF.2 variety now, and som old lenses like the C/Y Vario-Sonnar 35-70 f/3.4 that can either be Leitaxed to Nikon or adapted to Canon. So most of my new lenses are not wasted if I get a Canon camera as may main landscape camera later.
If the lenses you want to use are manual focus lenses that are available in the Nikon mount, this makes sense, otherwise not.
Regarding D800 vs D800E. I intended to use it mostly stopped down to f/11 or smaller apertures for maximum DoF or long exposures. At f/16 diffraction guarantees no aliasing with the D800E. At f/8 you get aliasing. However, you also get that with the D800 in some cases as the AA filter is not that strong. At f/11 you get very little aliasing with the D800E, and the images require less sharpening than the D800E. If I intended to use the camera most at maximum sharpness apertures f/4 - f/5.6, I would problay get the D800 and not the E. However, I rarely get into trouble with the E. If my images look so sharp that they are odd, it is because I sharpen too tight (to some people's taste)
p.2 #16 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
retrofocus wrote:
Here we go....another D800 vs 5D III post....but seeing so many of them shows that something is missing here currently in Canon's camera line (I think most will agree with this). ..
A. Yes, I agree that "something is missing" in every camera company's "line up."
B. Yes, I agree that the Nikon D800 (along with the D800e) is a very compelling product right now.
C. Yes, I agree that Canon does not (yet) have a body that competes with the high photo-site density of these Nikon bodies.
D. Yes, I agree that there are those among Canon photographers (I'm one of them) who will be happy when Canon does offer a sensor with similar characteristics.
E. Yes, I am confident that Canon will do this before long. There is nothing to indicate that Canon cannot continue to improve its sensors, nor that they would not respond to market competition. This back and forth feature competition has been around for decades and will certainly continue. The sky is not falling. ;-)
So, with the fundamental factual stuff out of the way, we come back to the personal and individual and fundamental question of whether switching brands (in either direction!) makes a lot of sense and how it does or does not play out in terms of improvements to one's photography. That remains the key question, doesn't it?
In our OP's case, the situation is a bit unusual, and more conducive to a brand switch should he be convinced of the long term benefits of the switch. (Keep in mind the fundamental assumption, clear to essentially all of us, that brand choices (as differentiated from decisions about cameras within brands we already own) must be considered in the long term, as buying into a brand typically means investing in a ton of stuff beyond the camera itself, and these decisions are decisions one tends to live with. There are several important truths to remember. First, bodies are a much smaller investment than lenses. Second, bodies come and go and the current one can be sold and replacements purchased. Third, not so much with lenses. Fourth, any advantage that one brand has today is likely to be short-lived... and that applies to both brands.
So the question is in the long term what are the real costs and benefits of switching for me and my photographs? (With the emphasis on real, as opposed to forum hype, marketing copy, and fear...)
And again, I would raise essentially the same point with a Nikon shooter who was considering switching the other direction to the 5D3 (and there have been such posts) on the basis of its better AF system, more capable live view ability, the lenses in the Canon system, and so forth.
p.2 #18 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
BigBadWolfie wrote:
Sorry for another 5DIII vs 800e thread, but I currently have a 60D with all EF-S lenses so moving to FF will pretty much mean starting over except I get to keep my flash.
I've been contemplating a move to FF and I am having trouble deciding between sticking with Canon and going with Nikon. There's a big part of me that wants to stick with Canon since I am familiar with the system, don't need to buy a flash, already have an extra battery, and I'll be able to buy some EF lenses first and then upgrade the body as budget would allow (it would also be easier for me to keep my 60D as a backup body). Switching to Nikon will really be for the 800e. I do believe that it is a better body with a better sensor and higher megapixels (I mainly shoot landscape and use my camera on trips and do like the 800e's superior ability to push the shadows and crop). If Canon had a camera comparable to the 800e without the oil spill and focus problems it would be a no brainer for me. But as it stands, if I want to upgrade in the near future it will likely be the 5DIII and with I'll just live with the fact that it is a good camera albeit with an inferior sensor to what is available at the same price.
If you are worried about budget, there is only one good choice out there right now for a landscape camera. Forget about the 5DIII or D800e, get yourself a 5DII. They are so cheap right now, you could get a 5DII plus some very nice glass, or a very nice tripod and pano head rig. Or a nice filter setup to help with dynamic range. These other things will make a much bigger difference to your landscape photos than having the latest expensive camera body.
If you are worried about the resolution of the 5DII compared to the D800e, buy a good pano setup and learn to shoot panos. You would be amazed at the quality and resolution you get when stitching multiple photos, vs taking just one with a wide lens.
You can get great shots with either system. If budget weren't a concern, I would say Nikon might be a better choice due to more dynamic range of its sensor. But their cameras and lenses aren't cheap. If you don't have all the proper tools (filters,tripod,head, glass) to capture landscape photos, and know how to use them. The D800e is just going to help you capture larger blurry photos.
These new cameras aren't magic. People get great landscape photos with Rebels if they know what they are doing, and know how to work what they have.
p.2 #19 · Moving to FF: Stick with Canon or Switch to Nikon?
Chezīs advice is good for both. If you do not know a collegue/friend using owning a 5D III or a D800, renting both for a couple of days and shoot it is a great solution. In the US it is easy. Companies like Lensrentals.com, wich offers a 5 day rental for about $125-150. That is what I would have to pay for one single day here (germany) . Concerning an investment at $ 3000, I think it is a good way to find out, which body is the right one for your needs.
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. Concerning an investment at $ 3000, I think it is a good way to find out, which body is the right one for your needs.