My point is don't show it on your wedding / portrait site unless it meets the brand value you associate with yourself. I'd never hire a photographer who showed all types of unrelated photography on his website. Would you hire you?
Newborns, couples, babies, boudoir, anything portrait based can tie back into weddings somehow (or the couples you've worked with in the past). Photographing people in any form is a skill most people could tie back into being wedding related.
IF you claim to be a wedding and portrait photographer, show weddings and portraits.
IF you claim to be a commercial photographer, show commercial work.
IF you want to be a jack of all trades, separate it out from each individual brand and I firmly believe they will stand out better.
Tony is also correct about slowing into things and taking time. I'd love to shoot dogs, but if wanted to do so commercially I would establish a separate brand to better cater to the people I'd like to work with.
I'm unaware of anyone in the industry who shoots everything and does it well. If you need to do so to pay the bills, I'm not against it, but your time could be better spent honing one specific market or craft.
...and the shot at my income was good, but not very accurate.
PatFurey89 wrote:
My point is don't show it on your wedding / portrait site unless it meets the brand value you associate with yourself. I'd never hire a photographer who showed all types of unrelated photography on his website. Would you hire you?
Newborns, couples, babies, boudoir, anything portrait based can tie back into weddings somehow (or the couples you've worked with in the past).
IF you claim to be a wedding and portrait photographer, show weddings and portraits.
IF you claim to be a commercial photographer, show commercial work.
IF you want to be a jack of all trades, separate it out from each individual brand and I firmly believe they will stand out better.
Tony is also correct about slowing into things and taking time. I'd love to shoot dogs, but if wanted to do so commercially I would establish a separate brand to better cater to the people I'd like to work with.
I'm unaware of anyone in the industry who shoots everything and does it well. If you need to do so to pay the bills, I'm not against it, but your time could be better spent honing one specific market or craft.
...and the shot at my income was good, but not very accurate.
yeah, i figured you actually meant that in regard to websites and stuff, which is why I said I didn't FULLY agree. the original post made it kinda sound like you were referring to the quality of the actual photographer's work.
No - you can be a talented photographer and apply that skill to just about anything with success, but from a marketing perspective it can severely devalue a photographers brand. It's like watering down Scotch, why do it?
I shoot normal people for money, "weddings and portraits". Those people aren't interested in seeing work I shot for money for a different cause. They're interested in what I can do for them.
PatFurey89 wrote:
No - you can be a talented photographer and apply that skill to just about anything with success, but from a marketing perspective it can severely devalue a photographers brand. It's like watering down Scotch, why do it?
if you're referring to the op (baby pictures and stuff lol), most definitely, but there are a lot of different types of shoots that you can display to actually enhance your wedding brand, that isn't wedding photography.
PatFurey89 wrote:
No - you can be a talented photographer and apply that skill to just about anything with success, but from a marketing perspective it can severely devalue a photographers brand. It's like watering down Scotch, why do it?
I shoot normal people for money, "weddings and portraits". Those people aren't interested in seeing work I shot for money for a different cause. They're interested in what I can do for them.
i like vodka AND whiskey.. if i find a WP that shoots my wedding and i subsequently realize they shoot great maternity my previous connection with them might be a headway into another job as compared to the tog with only a specialized wedding site. tog's like hoffer have been around for years and can LEGITIMATELY cast off business.. but when you are in your first couple years you gotta make some $$ too.. real shit.
PatFurey89 wrote:
I shoot normal people for money, "weddings and portraits". Those people aren't interested in seeing work I shot for money for a different cause. They're interested in what I can do for them.
if a client likes you and your work, they'll generally enjoy seeing more and more of it. i get tons of inquiries from people telling me how they spent hours looking at all my stuff. i definitely agree that you have to have solid QC with what you show, but i don't think we have to be so strict as to withhold everything not 100% centered on our potential client. that would seem to weaken artistic integrity. ymmv
DingAnSich wrote:
i like vodka AND whiskey.. if i find a WP that shoots my wedding and i subsequently realize they shoot great maternity my previous connection with them might be a headway into another job as compared to the tog with only a specialized wedding site. tog's like hoffer have been around for years and can LEGITIMATELY cast off business.. but when you are in your first couple years you gotta make some $$ too.. real shit.
I feel the same way. You never know what other needs your clients may run into. I had one client who's wedding I shot, one of my first actually. To this day, I have shot the same clients real estate corporate shots, weekend-band-gig promo shots, his brothers wedding, and am shooting his bandmates wedding this Feb. How did this client initially find me? I had shot his band for free as he was an acquaintance of a friend of a etc... and he liked my
live action" style.
I had another client that liked my overall portrait style so much, I shot their maternity photos, engagement photos, baby photos, and wedding photos. They are already talking about how they "cant wait for [their child] to start playing hockey so they can pay me to shoot a few games."
These anecdotes came to fruition not because of my wedding photography skills, but because of my other photography skills.
MattSepeta wrote:
I feel the same way. You never know what other needs your clients may run into. I had one client who's wedding I shot, one of my first actually. To this day, I have shot the same clients real estate corporate shots, weekend-band-gig promo shots, his brothers wedding, and am shooting his bandmates wedding this Feb. How did this client initially find me? I had shot his band for free as he was an acquaintance of a friend of a etc... and he liked my
live action" style.
I had another client that liked my overall portrait style so much, I shot their maternity photos, engagement photos, baby photos, and wedding photos. They are already talking about how they "cant wait for [their child] to start playing hockey so they can pay me to shoot a few games."
These anecdotes came to fruition not because of my wedding photography skills, but because of my other photography skills.
People tell me all the time they love seeing personal work. I hear that a lot. I don't discredit it.
But paid work isn't personal work.
Shoot more personal work if you want clients to see more of your photography, but I'm not sold on the other argument.
Ding - I can relate to you, what Tony does is great - but what he shares online still mostly involves people. He's also a talented photographer, designer, and has a good sense of his brand.
Hell - look at Baines. He shoots tons of commercial stuff on a totally separate website than his wedding work. I think he'd mainly agree with me here.
PatFurey89 wrote:
People tell me all the time they love seeing personal work. I hear that a lot. I don't discredit it.
But paid work isn't personal work.
Shoot more personal work if you want clients to see more of your photography, but I'm not sold on the other argument.
Ding - I can relate to you, what Tony does is great - but what he shares online still mostly involves people. He's also a talented photographer, designer, and has a good sense of his brand.
Hell - look at Baines. He shoots tons of commercial stuff on a totally separate website than his wedding work. I think he'd mainly agree with me here.
Agreed. It is important to keep your different "Categories" distinct.
Worst case scenario:
Potential client checking out your site for wedding photography sees cool photo of last nights dinner or whatever, gets distracted and looks up recipe, does not bother returning to finish original task: booking you as a wedding photographer.
sboerup wrote:
Well you can certainly photograph anything you want, but if you are trying to run a profitable business it will never work. Bold statement, no? It is just reality, and could take a whole novel worth of information to tell you why.
Say you own a BMW. You like your car and enjoy driving it. It breaks down and needs repair. Who would you rather call? 1. BMW specialist or dealership ($1800) 2. BMW, Mercedes, VW, Audi and Porsche specialist ($1600) 3. Joe Mechanic ($1100)
You need to know that there are two types of people in this world: 1 - has more time than money, 2 - has more money than time. Some people shop on price, others shop on value. What value does mechanic #1 bring to the table vs #3? As a consumer, I would assume (myself trying to justify my decision, basically fabricating why I made my choice) that mechanic #1 will give me the best repair, best warranty on their service, and will give me less troubles down the road. #2 will likely give me equally good service, might take a little longer, might not have as long of a warranty. #3 will give me the best price, but the question of quality will pop in my mind. Why would I think the quality would change? First thought would be "why is he charging less for the same repair?"
I could go on. Everyone decides to buy goods & services for thousands of different reasons. Just pick which kind of business you want to be, and then be the best at it. No reason #3 can't be making a lot of money if you advertise, brand and provide accordingly.
To help my mechanic story, I forgot to add a more "generic" type of car owner.
You own a Ford Fiesta. You don't necessarily enjoy it, but you NEED it because its your only mode of transportation. The attachment you have to your vehicle is no where near the same level of attachment as a BMW owner is to their car. Most likely a person with little to no emotional/personal connection to the service/good they need to purchase, they will pick mechanic #3, the cheaper option.
When you get consumers that have an emotional tie to a service/good, they have very specific reasons for purchasing. Thats when price becomes much less relavant, and making sure they get exactly what they are looking for is far more important than what it costs.
Great book to read by Seth Godin, "All marketers are liars"....Show more →
MattSepeta wrote:
It is important to keep your different "Categories" distinct.
Say someone has both a wedding photo and wedding DJ service. Could someone explain to me in simple terms what would be the problem with advertising those both on the same site as, for example, "Golden Memories Photo And DJ"?
MattSepeta wrote:
That is totally different. Instead of offering "product/commercial/wedding photography" you are offering "photo + Dj" services.
Yeah, I was just wondering if people thought it makes it harder to break into the high-end market if you're marketing DJ services on the same website as the photo service.
D. Diggler wrote:
Yeah, I was just wondering if people thought it makes it harder to break into the high-end market if you're marketing DJ services on the same website as the photo service.
I'm sure it's all in how you handle your presentation and how you're going after your target market. Honestly, if you do feel it's holding you back then it's trviial to break up the websites or turn them into sub-brands that work great together. However, I can't quite see the harm in the one stop wedding shop (unless someone is trying to do both jobs at once).
