I don't post 80 percent of the games I shoot because I have been working hard at continuing to improve not only the technical aspects of my shooting, but also the compostion of shots -- especially trying to capture peak moments. These photos were taken last night. Thanks to all of you for all your critical observations -- and I'm ready for another dose of FM Sports Corner medicine. Rick
D7000; Nikon 50 f/1.8 or 70-200 f/2.8; manual mode. EXIF in tact.
Rick... White balance looks good even with the cycling lights and exposures are dead on. At this level, it's tough to get real drop dead stellar shots. All of these are technically solid with decent action that you have captured well... you got the best bang for your buck. On the ones you posted I like #7 and #8 the best.
Looking good Rick. While they are are all solid keepers, #3 is a little weak. Not bad , just not as strong as the rest which makes it a little out of place in this set. #8 is the strongest. The pattern of limbs and the overall action give it stopping power.
You have a good grip on action and composition. That's the hard part of photography, knowing what you're shooting at and when to pull the trigger. I especially like the clean back grounds.
Now that you are getting consistently good action you may want to start refining your post processing. Before the "get it right in the camera" zealots descend on us let me say, yes it is better to get it right in the camera but it is pretty impractical in poorly lit gyms due to cycling lights.
hey Rick, Marty said it very well. I like some of the peak action, and was also going to encourage you to remove the green/yellow casts from the sodiums.
Hmmm... with all due respect Marty, I like Rick's original better. I honestly felt that the color and exposure were accurate on my monitor. Maybe a slight slight pinch of the levels, but that's all. I'm finding the repost a little too cool and the colors aren't popping. Let's see if there are any other opinions on it though, I could be wrong.
You are doing pretty good. #7 and #8 are def. the strongest. This gym looks like one I shoot in. I really hate light cycles that go from white-yellow just as much as the red-green cycle. It's just so hard to keep a decent WB and catching the "peak" moment might or might not be where the colors gods are shining on you.
2, 4, 5, 7 and 8 for me Rick. You are continuing to improve each time out.
Are you shooting auto ISO? Just curious about the floating ISO values. Looks like it was the same when you were using the zoom, but floated with the prime.
Also, I don't understand the +1.0 EV if you were shooting in manual mode. (images 6,7, 8 and 10)
About the w/b. I am not a zealot for accurate colors, but rather colors that look pleasing to the eye. Some like cooler colors, some warmer. I definitely like warmer colors, even if not technically correct. Sometimes, the skin tones look a bit better to me when warm, even if the white uniforms are not dead on white. Sometimes you can't get around it because of the differing colors of the lights you are shooting under and it will never be perfect. All that being said, I say I prefer the original version vs. Marty's. But, the original does have a bit of room for processing improvement, as Paul and Aqualung state. However, it's pretty minor and nothing to fret about. Frankly, for the prices most of us are getting for these images, if they do sell, it's not something I've even try to fix. Sure, for post processing practice, you can try to "fix" them, but fixing funky colors in our images from lights that are whack can yield a very limited payoff in color accuracy. I think this is especially true as the quality of the lights in the gym get worse and they are all casting different colors. Now, if you were shooting a gym with good lights and they did not cycle in colors, then your post could be easier and yield better results with less work, making it worth the effort to get more accurate colors. For the record, I am using a calibrated monitor, but my eyes are old and not so calibrated any more.
All that to say I think you did a pretty bang up job. You action is all good and some is very good.
P Alesse wrote:
Rick... White balance looks good even with the cycling lights and exposures are dead on. At this level, it's tough to get real drop dead stellar shots. All of these are technically solid with decent action that you have captured well... you got the best bang for your buck. On the ones you posted I like #7 and #8 the best.
Thank you Paul. White balance in that gym is easier said than done. I just set a custom WB at each end of the gym and then tweak as necessary with LR. Nothing huge, but the sodium cycle is bad enough there that I always shoot RAW to be able to tweak as needed. Thank you for looking.
Aqualung wrote:
I like some of the peak action, and was also going to encourage you to remove the green/yellow casts from the sodiums.
Am liking #4, #5 (straighten a bit), #7, & #8
Thanks for catching the skewed angle on #5 -- easy to fix those problems.
The green/yellow tint is something I constantly battle. I have always liked your warmer tones -- and don't like the blue hues. May be time to calibrate the monitors because I know I can't trust my 40-something-year-old eyes.
Marty Bingham wrote:
Looking good Rick. While they are are all solid keepers, #3 is a little weak. Not bad , just not as strong as the rest which makes it a little out of place in this set. #8 is the strongest. The pattern of limbs and the overall action give it stopping power.
You have a good grip on action and composition. That's the hard part of photography, knowing what you're shooting at and when to pull the trigger. I especially like the clean back grounds.
Now that you are getting consistently good action you may want to start refining your post processing. Before the "get it right in the camera" zealots descend on us let me say, yes it is better to get it right in the camera but it is pretty impractical in poorly lit gyms due to cycling lights.
Here's one of your shots with a little dose of CS3. Took a few seconds. (if you don't want me messin' with your photos I will remove it)
Morning Marty...I wondered about #3. Wish both eyes had been there. When I post here, I will often put up an image to see whether you pros like it or not. (We all know the general buying public doesn't look at the same things we do....)
Clean backgrounds are not always easy to find -- however, in this gym it's a bit easier because there is no seating behind the baskets. Nice for us shooter-types.
And as for "messin' with" my photos...are you kidding me? I have three or four games from Tuesday night that I'd be happy for you to come "mess with." I am wide open to see/hear how you post process. Mine were done in Lightroom 3.6
Matt OHarver wrote:
You are doing pretty good. #7 and #8 are def. the strongest. This gym looks like one I shoot in. I really hate light cycles that go from white-yellow just as much as the red-green cycle. It's just so hard to keep a decent WB and catching the "peak" moment might or might not be where the colors gods are shining on you.
Matt, you are right on the money about the white/yellow cycle being hard to deal with. Nothing makes me smile more than walking into a bright gym with dozens of fluorescent tubes shining down on the floor. I sometimes shoot "mini-bursts" of 2-3 in an effort beat the lights, but the best shot in the sequence is often the worst lit.
Tim is right on the money with everything he said. WB is more about personal aesthetics than about technical accuracy. That's why I think custom WB, gray cards, expodisks are all OVERATED... I find a kelvin that I like and go with it based on my eye and experience.
timgangloff wrote:
2, 4, 5, 7 and 8 for me Rick. You are continuing to improve each time out.
Are you shooting auto ISO? Just curious about the floating ISO values. Looks like it was the same when you were using the zoom, but floated with the prime.
Also, I don't understand the +1.0 EV if you were shooting in manual mode. (images 6,7, 8 and 10)
Happy you see improvement. You helped it happen.
Glad you mentioned number 2 because that was one of my favorites. The young man is only a sophomore and at 6-6 he is already generating a lot of D1 looks -- which you would expect when you average about 22 per game. His twin brother wears jersey #11 in photo 3.
Yep, Auto ISO set with a max of 3200 which on the 70-200 is a "given" in that gym. I have
played with ISO 6400 in the same gym and had decent results with some NR in Lightroom after the fact. However, the floating ISO's on the prime are a case of "operator error" because I should have locked them down for the faster glass. Good catch. Thanks.
Have to admit more operator error on the +1.0 EV settings. At ISO 3200, I tried to give the zoom a little push, but failed to reset when the 50 went on for a few grabs. Maybe will try using the camera's User 1 & User 2 banks to set the unique Auto ISO/Exposure compensation values for each lens in that gym.
Grantland wrote:
i would like the eyes to be sharper in#10 so it doesn't do much for me.
Grant, I appreciate you taking time to look and comment. I really went back and forth on #10. I looked at a bunch of times, but think you helped me decide it wasn't quite right....
Grantland wrote:
i might re-crop #4 to center the player more to the center of the frame and cut out the player on the right.
I really like your crop considerably more than mine. I tried to put it left of center to vary things a little bit, but centered is MUCH better. Thanks.
Grantland wrote:
i am interested to learn what your keeper rate was with the d7000.
I am very happy with the keeper rate with the D7000. I don't know what you call acceptable, but I came home with 142 shots from the varsity game (obvious deletes for referees/players blocking the action are done in-camera during time-outs.) After culling through the 142 on the card, I think I posted 94 to my website. Let me say this...the biggest reason for dumping shots was not because they were OOF, but more from the very obvious cycling of sodium vapor lights. I simply picked the best of what I call mini-bursts of 2-3 shots and adjust it according. As for focus/metering accuracy for basketball, it is easily 95%+. I use center point (with AF-C) on my 70-200, but often will go to 9-point on wider primes to give it a better chance on those shots. I sent you a PM with contact information. Feel free to call me to discuss further. I'm very impressed with the D7000 -- and am now trying to decide on D700 vs. D3 for my jump into the full frame water.
P Alesse wrote:
Hmmm... with all due respect Marty, I like Rick's original better. I honestly felt that the color and exposure were accurate on my monitor. Maybe a slight slight pinch of the levels, but that's all. I'm finding the repost a little too cool and the colors aren't popping. Let's see if there are any other opinions on it though, I could be wrong.
Yeah, I'm inclined to agree with you. I was kinda on the fence myself.
And like others have said, W/B is toward the bottom of the hierarchy after face-ball-action, composition, focus etc. which Rick is getting under control.
I am wide open to see/hear how you post process. Mine were done in Lightroom 3.6