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Archive 2014Heavy lenses on Sony A7(r)?
p.2 #1Heavy lenses on Sony A7(r)?
One datum:
My NEX-7, beat up pretty well before my purchase, then used by me with 700-800g lenses. My straps usually mount to the lens adapter, but sometimes directly to the camera itself. I usually handle the camera by the lens, if one is attached, since they're more valuable than the camera itself.
Looking at it carefully, the lenses do appear to slightly deflect under their own weight, maybe 1/20th of a mm. That becomes substantial if I twist the lens down while twisting the body up; I can get maybe a 1/2 mm gap between the lens and the body.
This is probably due to the deflection of the plastic flanges. Thinking about it, I think this is the behavior I'd like to see: a bit of give that protects against catastrophic failure. Yes, the flanges are a bit worn at the edges, which will contribute to sensor dust and likely fail at some point. But, I'd rather have plastic than metal dust on my sensor, and I'd rather my camera to be able to take knocks without failing altogether, so I don't disagree with the choice that Sony made to make their flanges out of plastic.
I always support the lens and the camera when taking pictures. There is no deflection when the lens or adapter is supported, in addition to or in lieu of the camera itself. Also, this is with a lens adapter; I can't say whether genuine Sony lenses would behave the same way. I have no reason to believe that my photos are affected, nor do I see how they could be within the foreseeable lifetime of this camera.
$0.02,
Jon
My NEX-7, beat up pretty well before my purchase, then used by me with 700-800g lenses. My straps usually mount to the lens adapter, but sometimes directly to the camera itself. I usually handle the camera by the lens, if one is attached, since they're more valuable than the camera itself.
Looking at it carefully, the lenses do appear to slightly deflect under their own weight, maybe 1/20th of a mm. That becomes substantial if I twist the lens down while twisting the body up; I can get maybe a 1/2 mm gap between the lens and the body.
This is probably due to the deflection of the plastic flanges. Thinking about it, I think this is the behavior I'd like to see: a bit of give that protects against catastrophic failure. Yes, the flanges are a bit worn at the edges, which will contribute to sensor dust and likely fail at some point. But, I'd rather have plastic than metal dust on my sensor, and I'd rather my camera to be able to take knocks without failing altogether, so I don't disagree with the choice that Sony made to make their flanges out of plastic.
I always support the lens and the camera when taking pictures. There is no deflection when the lens or adapter is supported, in addition to or in lieu of the camera itself. Also, this is with a lens adapter; I can't say whether genuine Sony lenses would behave the same way. I have no reason to believe that my photos are affected, nor do I see how they could be within the foreseeable lifetime of this camera.
$0.02,
Jon
Jun 12, 2014 at 02:07 PM
p.2 #2Heavy lenses on Sony A7(r)?
From the LensRentals teardown images the A7R lens mount is screwed direclty into the diecast metal frame that connects directly to the sensor assembly. Sure there might be a plastic gasket between the mount metal the the metal frame, but the screws appear to go into the metal and the plastic is in compression and likely very sturdy in this configuration.
I would be more worried about deforming the tripod mounting screw which appears to also be fastened directly to this internal metal frame with two screws.
Looks pretty solid to me, but still I wouldn't tempt fate.
That being said I did mount my 180/3.4 APO Telyt on my GX7 and put it on the tripod via the 1/4-20 thread in the GX7 body - but very gingerly. I've since gotten a Nikon F to m43 adapter with an integrated tripod mount so I don't have to worry about such things anymore (Metabones which is built very beefy). I have on the way a Metabones Nikon F to Sony E adapter also with the integrated tripod mount - I would never put my 135/2 APO on my A7R and use the body tripod socket . . . .
BTW - I shot my 135/2 APO Zeiss on my A7r wide open and at distance the lens is so sharp wide open that is will easily show up any sensor/flange non-parallelism and my A7R appeared to be excellently aligned. My D800 not nearly so and needs to go to Nikon for an adjustment . . .
I would be more worried about deforming the tripod mounting screw which appears to also be fastened directly to this internal metal frame with two screws.
Looks pretty solid to me, but still I wouldn't tempt fate.
That being said I did mount my 180/3.4 APO Telyt on my GX7 and put it on the tripod via the 1/4-20 thread in the GX7 body - but very gingerly. I've since gotten a Nikon F to m43 adapter with an integrated tripod mount so I don't have to worry about such things anymore (Metabones which is built very beefy). I have on the way a Metabones Nikon F to Sony E adapter also with the integrated tripod mount - I would never put my 135/2 APO on my A7R and use the body tripod socket . . . .
BTW - I shot my 135/2 APO Zeiss on my A7r wide open and at distance the lens is so sharp wide open that is will easily show up any sensor/flange non-parallelism and my A7R appeared to be excellently aligned. My D800 not nearly so and needs to go to Nikon for an adjustment . . .
Jun 12, 2014 at 05:30 PM
p.2 #3Heavy lenses on Sony A7(r)?
jhinkey wrote:
From the LensRentals teardown images the A7R lens mount is screwed direclty into the diecast metal frame that connects directly to the sensor assembly. Sure there might be a plastic gasket between the mount metal the the metal frame, but the screws appear to go into the metal and the plastic is in compression and likely very sturdy in this configuration.
I think you may be missing the part being referred to which is not just the plastic gasket but what is on the inside of that plastic gasket. This is the part of the body mount (flange, teeth, wings or whatever you want to call them) that a lens locks onto when mounted and, as others have said, is what keeps the lens actually attached to the camera. This is the plastic in question. I don't think it's anything to be concerned about unless we start hearing about failures. I don't believe I own any other camera that uses plastic here though.
http://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5540407/Flange.jpg
Hmm, I wonder if this would be easily interchangeable with the part from the A7s?
http://store.sony.com/SNYNA_27/pimg/pSNYNA-ILCE7S~B_main_v500.png
From the LensRentals teardown images the A7R lens mount is screwed direclty into the diecast metal frame that connects directly to the sensor assembly. Sure there might be a plastic gasket between the mount metal the the metal frame, but the screws appear to go into the metal and the plastic is in compression and likely very sturdy in this configuration.
I think you may be missing the part being referred to which is not just the plastic gasket but what is on the inside of that plastic gasket. This is the part of the body mount (flange, teeth, wings or whatever you want to call them) that a lens locks onto when mounted and, as others have said, is what keeps the lens actually attached to the camera. This is the plastic in question. I don't think it's anything to be concerned about unless we start hearing about failures. I don't believe I own any other camera that uses plastic here though.
http://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/5540407/Flange.jpg
Hmm, I wonder if this would be easily interchangeable with the part from the A7s?
http://store.sony.com/SNYNA_27/pimg/pSNYNA-ILCE7S~B_main_v500.png
Jun 12, 2014 at 06:22 PM
p.2 #4Heavy lenses on Sony A7(r)?
Tariq Gibran wrote:
I think you may be missing the part being referred to which is not just the plastic gasket but what is on the inside of that plastic gasket. This is the part of the body mount (flange, teeth, wings or whatever you want to call them) that a lens locks onto when mounted and, as others have said, is what keeps the lens actually attached to the camera. This is the plastic in question. I don't think it's anything to be concerned about unless we start hearing about failures. I don't believe I own any other camera that uses...Show more →
Ah - I see now - thanks for pointing that out. I'm not concerned either. Actually I think it's a pretty good design - if you drop your camera + lens these plastic pieces will shear off first. Plus there is the steel spring underneath that is what the lens mostly rests on and pushes against. The plastic is likely quite strong on shear and not brittle - there is a lot of surface area for all three of them to shear off and the lens to come out.
It also appears on my A7R that although the mount ring is rigid and fixed, the plastic underneath is somewhat flexible. It also appears that the plastic is very slippery.
My guess is that they wanted to be careful not to generate any metal shavings, etc. with a metal piece in place of the plastic that you pointed out. I actually quite like the idea from an engineering point of view. Just don't hang any huge lenses off the mount . . . .. If the plastic does get damaged is looks quite simple to replace.
If the A7S does have a metal piece instead of plastic I would bet that they'd be interchangeable.
Some people are reporting that more recent serial numbers of the A7R have less noisy shutters - if true I bet Sony is rolling out improvements to the design as it goes along.
jhinkey wrote
From the LensRentals teardown images the A7R lens mount is screwed direclty into the diecast metal frame that connects directly to the sensor assembly. Sure there might be a plastic gasket between the mount metal the the metal frame, but the screws appear to go into the metal and the plastic is in compression and likely very sturdy in this configuration.Ah - I see now - thanks for pointing that out. I'm not concerned either. Actually I think it's a pretty good design - if you drop your camera + lens these plastic pieces will shear off first. Plus there is the steel spring underneath that is what the lens mostly rests on and pushes against. The plastic is likely quite strong on shear and not brittle - there is a lot of surface area for all three of them to shear off and the lens to come out.
It also appears on my A7R that although the mount ring is rigid and fixed, the plastic underneath is somewhat flexible. It also appears that the plastic is very slippery.
My guess is that they wanted to be careful not to generate any metal shavings, etc. with a metal piece in place of the plastic that you pointed out. I actually quite like the idea from an engineering point of view. Just don't hang any huge lenses off the mount . . . .. If the plastic does get damaged is looks quite simple to replace.
If the A7S does have a metal piece instead of plastic I would bet that they'd be interchangeable.
Some people are reporting that more recent serial numbers of the A7R have less noisy shutters - if true I bet Sony is rolling out improvements to the design as it goes along.
Jun 12, 2014 at 08:11 PM
p.2 #5Heavy lenses on Sony A7(r)?
jhinkey wrote:
If the A7S does have a metal piece instead of plastic I would bet that they'd be interchangeable.
This part is stainless steel on the A7s and is one of the touted features of that camera for using heavier lenses.
If the A7S does have a metal piece instead of plastic I would bet that they'd be interchangeable.
This part is stainless steel on the A7s and is one of the touted features of that camera for using heavier lenses.
Jun 12, 2014 at 08:21 PM
p.2 #6Heavy lenses on Sony A7(r)?
I use heavy stuff often on my a7.
What else is it for?
PS since the camera is design to adapt a-mount, I think a shooter will need to be pretty rough to hurt the mount.
Many other aspects of the camera seem more vulnerable to me, but mine is still fine.
What else is it for?
PS since the camera is design to adapt a-mount, I think a shooter will need to be pretty rough to hurt the mount.
Many other aspects of the camera seem more vulnerable to me, but mine is still fine.
Jun 12, 2014 at 08:36 PM
p.2 #7Heavy lenses on Sony A7(r)?
Tariq Gibran wrote:
This part is stainless steel on the A7s and is one of the touted features of that camera for using heavier lenses.
Touted by Sony or someone else?
jhinkey wrote
If the A7S does have a metal piece instead of plastic I would bet that they'd be interchangeable.Touted by Sony or someone else?
Jun 12, 2014 at 08:39 PM
p.2 #8Heavy lenses on Sony A7(r)?
jhinkey wrote:
This part is stainless steel on the A7s and is one of the touted features of that camera for using heavier lenses.Touted by Sony or someone else?
Sony
Around 8:20 mark Sony representative says the A7s uses Stainless Steel, a more durable material for heavier lenses.
Edited on Jun 13, 2014 at 06:32 AM · View previous versions
Tariq Gibran wrote
jhinkey wrote
If the A7S does have a metal piece instead of plastic I would bet that they'd be interchangeable.Sony
Around 8:20 mark Sony representative says the A7s uses Stainless Steel, a more durable material for heavier lenses.
Edited on Jun 13, 2014 at 06:32 AM · View previous versions
Jun 12, 2014 at 08:41 PM
p.2 #9Heavy lenses on Sony A7(r)?
Thanks for all the input. Maybe I shouldn't worry so much and go out shooting instead :-)
I have the ASTAT-NEX collar and check if it's possible to connect the straps to that one as suggested. Just need to make sure it's comfortable and doesn't affect usability.
... Or I will just continue as today without any changes.
I have the ASTAT-NEX collar and check if it's possible to connect the straps to that one as suggested. Just need to make sure it's comfortable and doesn't affect usability.
... Or I will just continue as today without any changes.
Jun 13, 2014 at 12:56 AM
p.2 #10Heavy lenses on Sony A7(r)?
taz_k wrote:
Hi,
I use several Zeiss ZF lenses on my Sony A7 with a Novoflex F-mount adapter. Recently I've been thinking that some of the lenses (Zeiss 35/1.4, Zeiss 100/2) are quite heavy and started to worry a bit about the stress on the lens mount.
What is the view on this forum? Should I be worried about the stress on the mount generated by a 35/1.4 attached to the camera hanging on my shoulder? When lifting the camera to take pictures I usually support the lens with my right hand.
Hej taz.
I currently use more or less the same lenses but Contax versions (35/1.4 + 100/2). In usage I am not bothered at all, you rather hold the lens than the camera so no interesting stress on the mount whatsover.
I've been carrying the 35/1.4 + camera dangling on shoulder quite a lot but not without thinking about it. I'd never run with the A7 + say the 100/2 without any control. I'd definitely grab the lens barrel to catch a bus or similar.
With that said, I would never had run with my former Canon 5D2 + a 70-200/4 either. It's much the same. Normal caution and no unnecessary stress.
Hi,
I use several Zeiss ZF lenses on my Sony A7 with a Novoflex F-mount adapter. Recently I've been thinking that some of the lenses (Zeiss 35/1.4, Zeiss 100/2) are quite heavy and started to worry a bit about the stress on the lens mount.
What is the view on this forum? Should I be worried about the stress on the mount generated by a 35/1.4 attached to the camera hanging on my shoulder? When lifting the camera to take pictures I usually support the lens with my right hand.
Hej taz.
I currently use more or less the same lenses but Contax versions (35/1.4 + 100/2). In usage I am not bothered at all, you rather hold the lens than the camera so no interesting stress on the mount whatsover.
I've been carrying the 35/1.4 + camera dangling on shoulder quite a lot but not without thinking about it. I'd never run with the A7 + say the 100/2 without any control. I'd definitely grab the lens barrel to catch a bus or similar.
With that said, I would never had run with my former Canon 5D2 + a 70-200/4 either. It's much the same. Normal caution and no unnecessary stress.
Jun 13, 2014 at 06:39 AM