kenyee wrote:
Thanks for the update on the Einstein issue. The RF interop issue is why I always push beta testing when doing product design work (even if I'm mostly software nowadays). Good to know you worked things out w/ the LPA folks. Now I'm just hoping Radiopopper releases and Einstein receiver as well
The problem with doing a beta release on a product like Einstein is that it's similar to beta releasing a new car design. Before you can release a beta version, you have to do all the tool and die work, circuit boards, molds, robotic programming and essentially build completely production units. All these steps have tremendous costs and lead times. So then you Beta it and the testers say Gee it should have a handle and this feature or that what do you do then? Go back to square one and start over . . . or ignore the Beta testers?
This is totally different than Beta software where all you have to do is rewrite some code. My method is to do the best possible job I can of development and prototype testing, then build it. If unforeseen bugs pop up (they always do) I track them down and protect early adopters regardless of cost or inconvenience to my company.
But I have learned that the more a product development is removed from my own hands, the greater likelihood of production version problems there is. White Lightning and AlienBees went from prototype to production essentially without a hitch. Einstein and Cyber Commander involved a whole lot of third party development and this is the source of each and every glitch.
Was the 580EXII Beta tested? If it were, it would not have the PW issues it does. Was the D Lite Beta tested? If it were, it would have had a fan from the first production unit. Had my Audi SA been beta tested it wouldn't have been an accident waiting to happen and I wouldn't have gotten stuck with a total lemon. This applies to many many products, particularly those that depart significantly for from tried and true designs. I like to think the one thing we do absolutely right is to make sure nobody ever gets stuck with one of my products with no recourse.
Was the 580EXII Beta tested? If it were, it would not have the PW issues it does.
In fairness to Canon, when the 580 EX II was produced the Pocketwizard controlTT system did not exist, and as I've said before not all 580 EX II units seem to have the high RF generation problems that is plaguing users.
Paul Buff wrote:
testers say Gee it should have a handle and this feature or that what do you do then? Go back to square one and start over . . . or ignore the Beta testers?
I'd ignore them. At that point in the process, that's a feature that has been designed in already so tough cookies for them
My view of beta testers is that they might catch interop/environmental issues that you can't always test for.
You're right about the D-Lite and Audi issues...there are a set of problems that you just can't account for during development (failure modes in different environments/usage than you tested in the lab) and in the Audi case, it sounds like just a lemon from a bad "they were too smashed the night before" assembly line day. The Einstein PW problem I can see falling into this category as well (tested in a lab, seems ok, but the lab is small). Ditto the Einstein flash slave sensor being confused by bright sun (sun might not have hit it directly in the lab).
Can't do much about them except add these test cases (they *may* have been caught by beta testing...I'd have given odds at around 20%) to the test matrix for the next product, and fix the ones that made it out (which you're doing nicely and I'm sure everyone appreciates this)...
kenyee wrote:
I'd ignore them. At that point in the process, that's a feature that has been designed in already so tough cookies for them
My view of beta testers is that they might catch interop/environmental issues that you can't always test for.
You're right about the D-Lite and Audi issues...there are a set of problems that you just can't account for during development (failure modes in different environments/usage than you tested in the lab) and in the Audi case, it sounds like just a lemon from a bad "they were too smashed the night before" assembly line day. The Einstein PW problem I can see falling into this category as well (tested in a lab, seems ok, but the lab is small). Ditto the Einstein flash slave sensor being confused by bright sun (sun might not have hit it directly in the lab).
Can't do much about them except add these test cases (they *may* have been caught by beta testing...I'd have given odds at around 20%) to the test matrix for the next product, and fix the ones that made it out (which you're doing nicely and I'm sure everyone appreciates this)... ...Show more →
Kenyee, thanks for the intelligent words. Part of the reason for delays in Einstein production has been identifying and correcting pesky bugs that we have identified, both in our own production testings and based on reports from customers. So, in a sense, earliest adopters are a form of beta testers. Because of design delays on the part of our consultant, we have been pushed very hard by prospective customers to ship Einstein ASAP, and still are. Prototypes and initial production units were well tested, but it's difficult to identify every possible bug until you get some number of units in the field.
My long standing policy is to assure customers that we will stand behind everything we make, regardless of profit or loss. So this is what we are doing and will continue to do. We don't expect to make any profit on Einstein in the first six months - in fact we will lose a good bit of money. But I have learned from a lot of experience that the ultimate profits and success of a product fully depend on building it initially the best way you possibly can, then following up with refinements and total customer support. Had we initially run say 10,000 Einsteins in a hurry we would have created a monster for our bottom line.
This is a very interesting development and to be honest, greatly increases my interest int he Einstein, always good to see people working together when they could just clash
I will agree also that my interest level is much increased for Einsteins now that they may be fully compatable with my PocketWizard Flex hardware, and my other flash units. I will be waiting a while for availability to occur and potential bugs to be squashed, but there are indeed a lot of features in Einsteins that are nice.
Paul Buff wrote:
Suggest a CST for $59.95 and CSXCV for each Einstein ($29.95) while you're waiting for better PWW compatibility and shoot your heart out. Both items are in stock.
See this link for effective workaround with current Einstein/PW
What Kurtis; are you serious? They have been incredibly reliable for me and I have been using since the mid to late 90s. That reliability is why Profoto, Sekonic, Calumet, Norman and others put them in their units. Tell me you are joking?!
Paul; the Einstens look incredibly tempting and thank you for your contributions to this thread and others in lighting. I always enjoy reading your posts. No; I dont own any of your stuff; I have shot with it, just never bought it.
E-Vener wrote:
That is a crap statement. Some people -- not everyone but a lot -- has had issues with the Pocketwizard TT5 and Canon's 580 EXII and the source of the problem is poor RF shielding in the Canon Speedlight. Fair enough --Canon didn't think that people would develop units like the Pw TT5 when they were designing the 580 EX II. .
otherwise I've been using pocketwizards since they were introduced -- First the 16 channel classics, and my current set up is one pair of Pocketwizard MAX and one pair of the first generation of MultiMAX units . I use them hard, and use them regularly in situations where other radio remote system are challenged to the point of failure. With one exception in one shoot out of thousands of sessions, they have NEVER let me down. ...Show more →
My PW Plus II's would work well with my profoto lights, though I'd get misfires a few times per studio shoot and more per outdoor shoot. Maybe because I was using FCC USA PWs in a CE country? Wasn't bad enough for me to care.
Well Adam; perhaps they do mis-fire from time to time. I have had no issues at all w/ pw plus and pw2s with my 7b or Acuteb 2400; like ever. Kind of why I go with them; no issues. Also interesting reading about the flex units having some issues. Dont own those and have never used them. hhmmm
