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Archive 2009Canon EOS 7D Master thread
p.54 #1Canon EOS 7D Master thread
dolina wrote:
http://akimagery.zenfolio.com/img/v1/p1063258743.jpg
http://akimagery.zenfolio.com/img/v1/p1063258743-3.jpg
Though the 7D contains more noise, it doesn't have the kind of pattern noise that both the 5D2 and the 50D does.Thanks for posting this. This pretty much seals my opinion to wait for the 1D3 replacement.
it's at iso 12,800!!!!
thedigitalbean wrote
ISO 12,800 comparison for the Canon cameras. Forgot to mention that in all of these LR's noise reduction was set to 0 (for both lum. and color) and all sharpening set to 0.http://akimagery.zenfolio.com/img/v1/p1063258743.jpg
http://akimagery.zenfolio.com/img/v1/p1063258743-3.jpg
Though the 7D contains more noise, it doesn't have the kind of pattern noise that both the 5D2 and the 50D does.
it's at iso 12,800!!!!
Sep 16, 2009 at 11:06 AM
p.54 #3Canon EOS 7D Master thread
The 7D seems very promising, but I'm still on the fence about the sensor size. An APS-H 1D Mark IV having this sensor technology and a larger pixel pitch... that would be nice I think.
I'm sure that future full frame variants will be great too, but I really don't need a 31Mp camera (or whatever Canon does next with the 1Ds IV / 5D Mark III).
If Canon's smart, they'll wait till we all buy one or two 7Ds, then introduce cameras with similar features and larger sensors so we'll all feel compelled to upgrade.
I'm sure that future full frame variants will be great too, but I really don't need a 31Mp camera (or whatever Canon does next with the 1Ds IV / 5D Mark III).
If Canon's smart, they'll wait till we all buy one or two 7Ds, then introduce cameras with similar features and larger sensors so we'll all feel compelled to upgrade.
Sep 16, 2009 at 12:30 PM
p.54 #4Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Fascinating. Internal liquid cooling for the 5DIII!?!?
thedigitalbean wrote:
Here's the excerpt (emphasis added):
"When designing the sensor, a larger size was considered however _research_ has shown that when _all_ factors are considered, a larger AF sensor is not necessarily better. Larger sensors are more susceptible to changes in temperature rises and falls. This in turn has an impact on the accuracy of the AF system overall. In order to maintain consistency and accuracy the size of the sensor has been optimized to ensure that changes in temperature have little or no affect on AF performance"
---- smoking gun, perhaps?Good sleuthing... very interesting indeed...
thedigitalbean wrote:
timbop wrote
Not to get too far off topic, but something very interesting on that "technical" section caught my eye. Notice how on page 8 they start to mention how larger AF sensors were thought to be better, but that resulted in problems at high temp. Hmm, sounds a lot like the 1dm3......Here's the excerpt (emphasis added):
"When designing the sensor, a larger size was considered however _research_ has shown that when _all_ factors are considered, a larger AF sensor is not necessarily better. Larger sensors are more susceptible to changes in temperature rises and falls. This in turn has an impact on the accuracy of the AF system overall. In order to maintain consistency and accuracy the size of the sensor has been optimized to ensure that changes in temperature have little or no affect on AF performance"
---- smoking gun, perhaps?
Sep 16, 2009 at 12:31 PM
p.54 #5Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Just got a post (on a different forum) from Eric Chan from the ACR/LR development team that the adobe support for the 7D is in the very earliest stages of development and that they had very few RAW files to work from. I'm expecting things to get a lot better and that's incredible!
Sep 16, 2009 at 01:08 PM
p.54 #6Canon EOS 7D Master thread
The first full wedding video exclusively shot with the Canon EOS 7D. Looks really good.
Sorry if posted earlier:
Sorry if posted earlier:
Sep 16, 2009 at 01:19 PM
p.54 #7Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Wow...I thought video on DSLR is a gimmick ?
ruhikant wrote:
The first full wedding video exclusively shot with the Canon EOS 7D. Looks really good.
Sorry if posted earlier:
ruhikant wrote:
The first full wedding video exclusively shot with the Canon EOS 7D. Looks really good.
Sorry if posted earlier:
Sep 16, 2009 at 01:57 PM
p.54 #8Canon EOS 7D Master thread
kewlcanon wrote:
Wow...I thought video on DSLR is a gimmick ?
DSLR video looks great in the hands of a capable videographer? Who knew?!
Wow...I thought video on DSLR is a gimmick ?
DSLR video looks great in the hands of a capable videographer? Who knew?!
Sep 16, 2009 at 02:00 PM
p.54 #9Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Couldn't agree more!.
Yohan Pamudji wrote:
DSLR video looks great in the hands of a capable videographer? Who knew?!
Yohan Pamudji wrote:
kewlcanon wrote
Wow...I thought video on DSLR is a gimmick ?Sep 16, 2009 at 02:03 PM
p.54 #10Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Rather jerky focusing transitions (lenses really not designed for doing that like a smoothly pulled manual lens) and slightly overdone here IMO. The natural light stuff such as the dance is very nice though and non 'video'. Did I see Jello on the pan down that paper or whatever it was? Not an expert on video.
Sep 16, 2009 at 02:12 PM
p.54 #11Canon EOS 7D Master thread
I think it would be fun to use video with wildlife at Bosque del Apaches
some video of the birds
mixed with all the still shots
seems video is here to stay on SLR's. May as well see where it is useful.
some video of the birds
mixed with all the still shots
seems video is here to stay on SLR's. May as well see where it is useful.
Sep 16, 2009 at 04:24 PM
p.54 #12Canon EOS 7D Master thread
AWB that actually works would be a nice change.
Sep 16, 2009 at 05:43 PM
p.54 #13Canon EOS 7D Master thread
ohyeah wrote:
AWB that actually works would be a nice change.
So true!
I think canon has actually been (slowly and quietly) working on it. My 20D and my 50D behave very differently on AWB in the exact same conditions. I think both are wrong, and I'm not sure that the 50D is actually less wrong then the 20D, but clearly they've done some tweaking. I tend to leave both on the cloudy WB nearly all the time and tweak it later as needed.
If this new color-seeing exposure sensor thingy (sorry it's been a long day) can feed info to the algorithm for doing AWB that could potentially be very helpful.
Andrew
AWB that actually works would be a nice change.
So true!
I think canon has actually been (slowly and quietly) working on it. My 20D and my 50D behave very differently on AWB in the exact same conditions. I think both are wrong, and I'm not sure that the 50D is actually less wrong then the 20D, but clearly they've done some tweaking. I tend to leave both on the cloudy WB nearly all the time and tweak it later as needed.
If this new color-seeing exposure sensor thingy (sorry it's been a long day) can feed info to the algorithm for doing AWB that could potentially be very helpful.
Andrew
Sep 16, 2009 at 07:28 PM
p.54 #14Canon EOS 7D Master thread
brainiac wrote:
All other cameras were resized (up or down) to the 7D's size to keep the comparison fair.Aah! Music to my ears.
Thanks and well done. EDIT: oh - page is locked
by this logic you were to compare a 4cyl car with an 8cyl car...and make it a fair comparison you would cripple the 8cly car to 4cly and expect the fair equal outcome
it is intellectually dishonest to compare an FF sensor to a 1.6crop sensor
also what does it really prove ? if one is so hung up about the lack of ISO performance,dynamic range,noise ect in a crop camera them get a FF one
this is getting old...a camera should be critiqued on it own merits but on a level playing field FF vs FF,1.3 crop vs 1.3crop,1.6 crop vs. 1.6crop..and how each stacks up to each other in real world tests...not charts,brickwalls,batteries,20$ bills...
thedigitalbean wrote
I have put together a camera/ISO matrix...All other cameras were resized (up or down) to the 7D's size to keep the comparison fair.
Thanks and well done. EDIT: oh - page is locked
by this logic you were to compare a 4cyl car with an 8cyl car...and make it a fair comparison you would cripple the 8cly car to 4cly and expect the fair equal outcome
it is intellectually dishonest to compare an FF sensor to a 1.6crop sensor
also what does it really prove ? if one is so hung up about the lack of ISO performance,dynamic range,noise ect in a crop camera them get a FF one
this is getting old...a camera should be critiqued on it own merits but on a level playing field FF vs FF,1.3 crop vs 1.3crop,1.6 crop vs. 1.6crop..and how each stacks up to each other in real world tests...not charts,brickwalls,batteries,20$ bills...
Sep 16, 2009 at 07:28 PM
p.54 #15Canon EOS 7D Master thread
it is getting tiring. 100% pixel peeping is not a level playing field; It is EXACTLY akin to making 2 prints of the same size and comparing them from 2 different distances. Obviously the noise on the nearer image will be more noticable, even if the prints were made from the same source.
By viewing both at 100%, you are essentially "looking closer" at the higher MP image
By viewing both at 100%, you are essentially "looking closer" at the higher MP image
Sep 16, 2009 at 07:55 PM
p.54 #16Canon EOS 7D Master thread
digitalbug30d wrote:
by this logic you were to compare a 4cyl car with an 8cyl car...and make it a fair comparison you would cripple the 8cly car to 4cly and expect the fair equal outcome
.
I'm confused, which body is the 8 cyl and which is the 4?
by this logic you were to compare a 4cyl car with an 8cyl car...and make it a fair comparison you would cripple the 8cly car to 4cly and expect the fair equal outcome
.
I'm confused, which body is the 8 cyl and which is the 4?
Sep 16, 2009 at 09:03 PM
p.54 #17Canon EOS 7D Master thread
rd4tile wrote:
.I'm confused, which body is the 8 cyl and which is the 4?
C'mon?
digitalbug30d wrote
by this logic you were to compare a 4cyl car with an 8cyl car...and make it a fair comparison you would cripple the 8cly car to 4cly and expect the fair equal outcome .
C'mon?
Sep 16, 2009 at 09:44 PM
p.54 #18Canon EOS 7D Master thread
OK I tried to search on this, didn't get an exact hit. I looked at the IR images. Here's my half-baked conclusion: compared to my 40D, the 7D improves noise by between a stop (ISO 800 looks like 40D's ISO 400) and two stops (ISO 12800 looks like 40D's ISO 3200).
very ballpark. working on WAF fodder. any comments?
very ballpark. working on WAF fodder. any comments?
Sep 16, 2009 at 10:35 PM
p.54 #19Canon EOS 7D Master thread
digitalbug30d wrote:
by this logic you were to compare a 4cyl car with an 8cyl car...and make it a fair comparison you would cripple the 8cly car to 4cly and expect the fair equal outcome
You analogy is deeply flawed but I'll play. You have two existing cars, an I4 and a V8, we know the V8 kicks the I4's butt.
Now out comes a new car, we don't really know whats in there, we want to see how it comes. We race each car against the other to get an idea of where it fits. Seems completely reasonable to me.
Comparing images at the same resolution neither cripples 5D2 images nor is such a comparison unfair if the intent of the comparison is to see the relative performance of the sensors, regardless of format size.
it is intellectually dishonest to compare an FF sensor to a 1.6crop sensor
also what does it really prove ?
It helps someone who doesn't have a 7D in front of them to play to see where along of spectrum of 50D to 5D2 the camera fits in, nothing more and nothing more has been claimed.
if one is so hung up about the lack of ISO performance,dynamic range,noise ect in a crop camera them get a FF one
And who exactly is hung up about the performance of this camera? Have you actually bothered to read the responses by the folks here? Have you bothered to actually look at the images? Or did you just get all worked up over nothing.
Most people who have seen these images have been impressed by the 7D's IQ, especially considering its high pixel density and APS-C format.
this is getting old...a camera should be critiqued on it own merits but on a level playing field
And if people were being critical of the camera you may have a point, but so far people have done exactly what they should be doing, using these images to give them a rough basis for where in the IQ spectrum this camera will likely end up.
FF vs FF,1.3 crop vs 1.3crop,1.6 crop vs. 1.6crop..and how each stacks up to each other in real world tests...not charts,brickwalls,batteries,20$ bills...
Sure, you can send a 7D right over and we start those real world tests. Or perhaps you have some real world RAW files from the camera you can share? Or right, neither is available. With a dearth of available data, one makes do with whats available. Most people are mature enough to realize that exact performance of the camera will be made much more clear when people actually have units in their hands and that the only purpose this serves to basically show that the 7D's IQ doesn't completely blow and that Canon has made some very nice advances over the 50D (and in some cases even over the 5D2). If you can't understand that very simple point, then I'm not quite sure what else to say.
by this logic you were to compare a 4cyl car with an 8cyl car...and make it a fair comparison you would cripple the 8cly car to 4cly and expect the fair equal outcome
You analogy is deeply flawed but I'll play. You have two existing cars, an I4 and a V8, we know the V8 kicks the I4's butt.
Now out comes a new car, we don't really know whats in there, we want to see how it comes. We race each car against the other to get an idea of where it fits. Seems completely reasonable to me.
Comparing images at the same resolution neither cripples 5D2 images nor is such a comparison unfair if the intent of the comparison is to see the relative performance of the sensors, regardless of format size.
it is intellectually dishonest to compare an FF sensor to a 1.6crop sensor
also what does it really prove ?
It helps someone who doesn't have a 7D in front of them to play to see where along of spectrum of 50D to 5D2 the camera fits in, nothing more and nothing more has been claimed.
if one is so hung up about the lack of ISO performance,dynamic range,noise ect in a crop camera them get a FF one
And who exactly is hung up about the performance of this camera? Have you actually bothered to read the responses by the folks here? Have you bothered to actually look at the images? Or did you just get all worked up over nothing.
Most people who have seen these images have been impressed by the 7D's IQ, especially considering its high pixel density and APS-C format.
this is getting old...a camera should be critiqued on it own merits but on a level playing field
And if people were being critical of the camera you may have a point, but so far people have done exactly what they should be doing, using these images to give them a rough basis for where in the IQ spectrum this camera will likely end up.
FF vs FF,1.3 crop vs 1.3crop,1.6 crop vs. 1.6crop..and how each stacks up to each other in real world tests...not charts,brickwalls,batteries,20$ bills...
Sure, you can send a 7D right over and we start those real world tests. Or perhaps you have some real world RAW files from the camera you can share? Or right, neither is available. With a dearth of available data, one makes do with whats available. Most people are mature enough to realize that exact performance of the camera will be made much more clear when people actually have units in their hands and that the only purpose this serves to basically show that the 7D's IQ doesn't completely blow and that Canon has made some very nice advances over the 50D (and in some cases even over the 5D2). If you can't understand that very simple point, then I'm not quite sure what else to say.
Sep 16, 2009 at 10:36 PM
p.54 #20Canon EOS 7D Master thread
Alek Komarnits wrote:
HowardNice catch ... I wonder how long this will last.
Incidentally, I got an order in during the initial couple hour window back on 9/1 ... still no update yet on when it will be shipped ...
I did too and am waiting for the "email" too.
My guess is that Amazon realized it was losing a lot of money by stopping pre-orders at it's first allotment That is why there is that message about not knowing when the pre-orders will ship, now on the page..
HowardWi wrote
Amazon is taking pre-orders again for the 7D body only and kit.Howard
Incidentally, I got an order in during the initial couple hour window back on 9/1 ... still no update yet on when it will be shipped ...
I did too and am waiting for the "email" too.
My guess is that Amazon realized it was losing a lot of money by stopping pre-orders at it's first allotment That is why there is that message about not knowing when the pre-orders will ship, now on the page..
Sep 16, 2009 at 10:59 PM